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john61ct · 17-11-2019, 12:08

https://www.greenbiz.com/article/veh...nology-revving

OneHullPaul · 17-11-2019, 12:13

I wouldn't worry too much about a lack of diesel for your sailboat. Dr Diesel designed the engine to run on vegetable oil so that farmers could grow their own fuel for a multi use farm engine. Most sailboats over 20 years old have mechanical diesels that simply need an oil pan hater installed on the engine for starting in cold weather. Carrying a liquid that can be used to fuel your engine or your body has benefits for world cruising.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chotu

Thanks for this one. I wasn't looking to get political, just to try to predict what's coming.

As internal combustion is phased out on the roads, it'll have a profound effect on small boats like ours.

Personally, I'm thinking about this in terms of fitting out a boat I have so that I don't have to fit it out more than once in this lifetime.

It already has outboards, which means an easy transition to whatever is next, engine/motor wise. However, I have started keeping an eye toward the domestic systems as well.

Thinking sailing will become more important than ever.

These changes skew the arguments of solar vs generator, induction vs lpg, heating and cooling, etc.

The post wasn't really about cars. It's just that what happens on the road will have a great effect on what's available for boats.

OneHullPaul · 17-11-2019, 12:46

Perhaps it's not burning fossel fuel? I have a diesel in my boat and in my car, and they both fun on commercial biodiesel from waste vegetable oil.

More broadly, if you are willing to do engineless sailing to cruise, but with the convenience of easy manouvering in and out of anchorages and Marina's, an electric sailboat is for you. If you want to motor on days when the wind isn't cooperating with your cruising plans, you need a diesel inboard. Just do the planet a favor and see if you can find a local biodiesel seller.

NorthernMac · 17-11-2019, 12:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneHullPaul

I wouldn't worry too much about a lack of diesel for your sailboat. Dr Diesel designed the engine to run on vegetable oil so that farmers could grow their own fuel for a multi use farm engine. Most sailboats over 20 years old have mechanical diesels that simply need an oil pan hater installed on the engine for starting in cold weather. Carrying a liquid that can be used to fuel your engine or your body has benefits for world cruising.

Though it’s lacking oil, jet fuel and kerosine can also be used in a pinch.

OneHullPaul · 17-11-2019, 12:58

I have two smaller HVAC units. I can run one from the engine with my Balmer alternator/battery bank/2000 watt inverter, both units with a generator.

**newhaul** · 17-11-2019, 13:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneHullPaul

Perhaps it's not burning fossel fuel? I have a diesel in my boat and in my car, and they both fun on commercial biodiesel from waste vegetable oil.

More broadly, if you are willing to do engineless sailing to cruise, but with the convenience of easy manouvering in and out of anchorages and Marina's, an electric sailboat is for you. If you want to motor on days when the wind isn't cooperating with your cruising plans, you need a diesel inboard. Just do the planet a favor and see if you can find a local biodiesel seller.

many engines actually state that using more than b15 will void the warranty on the injectors.
My old engines don't like bio diesel unless I add 2 cycle oil to the fuel as a lubricant for the injection pump.

**a64pilot** · 17-11-2019, 13:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeepFrz

It is interesting to note that during the blackouts in California Tesla diverted all solar cell and Tesla Wall production to charging stations most likely to be affected by the blackouts. What didn't get much, or any, attention was the fact that very few gas/diesel stations had back up generators installed so people couldn't get gas for their cars or generators. At least one airfield in CA supplied a limited amount to people on an emergency basis until they hit their reserve.

The few fuel stations that did have backup generators had "lineups for blocks" according to one observer. Not much in the mainstream press about this.

So your saying that Tesla can divert power from privately owned devices? I assume these roofs and power walls are privately owned?

**a64pilot** · 17-11-2019, 13:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by newhaul

many engines actually state that using more than b15 will void the warranty on the injectors.

My old engines don't like bio diesel unless I add 2 cycle oil to the fuel as a lubricant for the injection pump.

The problem with “bio Diesel” is there are many different forms, from soy bean to palm oil to used French fry oil.
They are very different things with very different properties.
It’s why it’s so difficult to certify an engine to burn Bio Diesel because there is no standard for it.
I know because I was part of an effort to certify an aircraft to burn it, and it was very plain from almost day one that it was hopeless with out a definition of what Bio Diesel is.

Actually what is widely available in the US is Bio made from Soy and it has much better lubricity than ULSD, I would run it when I could find it in my truck, which wasn’t very often at all.

Lake-Effect · 17-11-2019, 13:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

The problem with “bio Diesel” is there are many different forms, from soy bean to palm oil to used French fry oil.
They are very different things with very different properties.
It’s why it’s so difficult to certify an engine to burn Bio Diesel because there is no standard for it.
I know because I was part of an effort to certify an aircraft to burn it, and it was very plain from almost day one that it was hopeless with out a definition of what Bio Diesel is.

Wow. Very good point. If the possibilities are so wide, then standards or grades for biodiesel would definitely help.

**newhaul** · 17-11-2019, 14:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

The problem with “bio Diesel” is there are many different forms, from soy bean to palm oil to used French fry oil.
They are very different things with very different properties.
It’s why it’s so difficult to certify an engine to burn Bio Diesel because there is no standard for it.
I know because I was part of an effort to certify an aircraft to burn it, and it was very plain from almost day one that it was hopeless with out a definition of what Bio Diesel is.

Actually what is widely available in the US is Bio made from Soy and it has much better lubricity than ULSD, I would run it when I could find it in my truck, which wasn’t very often at all.

that's the problem with it all . When I replaced the db2 pump on my dt444 the literature actually stated that if I didn't add a lubricity agent to the fuel regardless of lusd or up to b15 bio it would cause premature failure and gliding of the warranty on the pump.

I live in one of the top 5 bio diesel producing states in the CONUS .

OneHullPaul · 17-11-2019, 14:03

Nonsense. Biodiesel has far more lubricity that modern low sulphur diesel.

My comment was on 20 year old mechanical diesels so your first point is moot too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by newhaul

many engines actually state that using more than b15 will void the warranty on the injectors.
My old engines don't like bio diesel unless I add 2 cycle oil to the fuel as a lubricant for the injection pump.

**newhaul** · 17-11-2019, 14:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Wow. Very good point. If the possibilities are so wide, then standards or grades for biodiesel would definitely help.

that's likely the reason for most stations to have mostly b15 for sale
There are a couple that sell up to b85 mostly for industrial engines.

**newhaul** · 17-11-2019, 14:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneHullPaul

Nonsense. Biodiesel has far more lubricity that modern low sulphur diesel.

My comment was on 20 year old mechanical diesels so your first point is moot too.

you don't know much about older mechanical diesel engines .
BIO DIESEL yes has more lubricity than ULSD but it is still lacking .
That is direct from Stanadyne the manufacturer of the injection pump.
Due to the close tolerances of the parts in the high pressure injection pump the fuel acts as the lubricant . The new ULSD is more of a cleaner than a lubricant .