Hard dodger, soft dodger or pilothouse?

[rexposeidon]

Ok, I know I'm throwing chum in the water here...

Trying to formulate my own opinion on the above question:

Hard dodger, soft dodger or pilot house?

Specifically blue water cruising.
Which do you think is better and why?

Thanks in advance for all your answers.

[fxykty]

BWC in high latitudes or low/mid latitudes?

In cold water areas a pilot house makes life so much more comfortable. Combined with a soft bimini that can be removed during higher wind events and you’re set. You need somewhere to shelter when on watch with heating and protection from the elements.

OTOH, if you’re in warm water areas then sun protection is more important. A hard bimini is easier to manage, more weather proof (a soft bimini will inevitably leak once the materials are no longer new), and provides a platform for solar panels. But a hard bimini does provide more windage and may not look that good.

It really depends on your boat and what you want to do with it.

[rexposeidon]

I live in the PNW, and I'm hoping to tie the knot, or at the very least South Pacific and back so both warm and cold weather cruising.

My concerns were the possibility of waves over the top and the concern of shipping water due to the hard dodger or pilot house vice a soft dodger just being swept away.

[Joh.Ghurt]

The answer to your question is a resounding YES!

All of them have advantages and drawbacks. If a solution provides you the protection you need in the area you sail, accept it as good enough.

[Breaking Waves]

Originally Posted by rexposeidon

Hard dodger, soft dodger or pilot house?.

pretty personal decision - but hard dodger for me.

Pilot houses I think isolate you from the weather too much so that you don't sense changes (like the small temp drop or small wind shift) before they hit you full force. And I get seasick more often in pilot houses.

Soft dodgers I can understand IF you plan to put it down when you sail, but pretty much no cruiser ever does that, so it would just be better if it was a hard dodger (stronger in wave hits, you can stand on it to get to the back of the boom, never needs replacing).

So, for me, hard dodger (a decently big one with mainsail reefing under it) hits a sweet spot - excellent protection, we could usually sail in shirt sleeves while other boats were in foul weather gear. But you still have enough feel for conditions that you can feel when the weather is just about to chance and can get the reef in ahead of time. And it is solid, no worries about green water or ever needing to replace it and with tempered glass, you can always see out of it clearly never gets cloudy.

Other people obviously have different priorities/feelings about this and I don't think any of these answers is 'wrong.

[rexposeidon]

Breaking Waves,

What do you sail and where?

Thanks!

[rexposeidon]

Joh.Ghurt

I get your point but good enough might not be.
I understand that everything is a compromise. I'm curious as to the thought processes behind everyone's compromises.

Thanks!

[Smokeys Kitchen]

We are also from the PNW currently traveling to Mexico.

Our boat came with a soft dodger/bimini/full enclosure. It has worked well for us during a winter in Alaska, living in the Puget Sound, and now going down the coast. The flexibility of being able to remove panels - which we store flat wrapped in towels under a berth mattress - has proved to be a great advantage. With a full enclosure, it acted like a covered porch in the rains in the Seattle area. Yes, constant rain would overwhelm the material occasionally, but it really wasn't bad inside and provided a great place to remove wet clothing and shoes outside of the cabin in winter.

On the offshore passage down, we removed all the side panels and the dodger/bimini connector for better deck access and visibility to sails, but will put the connector back up once in Mexico for more cockpit shade.

I would go a similar route if I had to do it over again, but maybe with a hard dodger with a hard top that allows better placement of solar panels.

YMMV

[vpbarkley]

We have a soft dodger. It was very expensive and is not terribly long lived. The isinglass is difficult to open or close with multiple zippers.

In heavy weather a hard dodger offers the advantage of strength and improved optical clarity of the windshield. You can even add a wiper.

In hot weather, if a hard dodger's windshield is openable, a soft dodger offers no advantage in ventilation. And a hard dodger's glass is easier to open.

I don't think solar panels belong on a dodger due to shading but even here a hard dodger holds the advantage.

[Breaking Waves]

Originally Posted by rexposeidon

Breaking Waves,

What do you sail and where?

Thanks!

do a google of "S/V Hawk Beth and Evans"

[Smokeys Kitchen]

Originally Posted by vpbarkley

We have a soft dodger. It was very expensive and is not terribly long lived. The isinglass is difficult to open or close with multiple zippers.

In heavy weather a hard dodger offers the advantage of strength and improved optical clarity of the windshield. You can even add a wiper.

In hot weather, if a hard dodger's windshield is openable, a soft dodger offers no advantage in ventilation. And a hard dodger's glass is easier to open.

I don't think solar panels belong on a dodger due to shading but even here a hard dodger holds the advantage.

It really depends on the dodger maker. Ours has a front opening window, my wife and I can stand on the tubing, and we do have flexible solar panels on it. The dodger, bimini, and all the connectors and side panels are Iverson out of the PNW. Again, it came with the boat, but after at least 7 years it is still going strong

[Sandy Frank]

I like sailing with my dodger down...

[wingssail]

The two main purposes of the dodger are to provide a place to shelter from the elements and to keep water away from the companionway and cockpit.

Those two requirements are better met by a hard dodger.

A pilot house does the same and more.

However, some of us enjoy the outdoors aspect of sailing. We like the wind in our face on a nice day and the visibility afforded by a completely clear view forward.

We are among the latter. We have a soft dodger and we fold it down often. During the sailing season, for four months, we take it off the boat entirely.

We have a good shade awning rather than a bimini (several in fact) and for long hot days on a passage we always need the shade awning. But it comes down when we don't need it. And we never appreciate being closed in with side curtains, etc. We want openness.

For us the outdoor activity is essential.

But in cold weather, rainy conditions, big wind and waves, a good dodger is essential. We built our own (after 35 years we have built three or four, they don't last forever) and we engineered it to keep water out. Even zippers will soak through after several water soaked hours. Dripping zippers or seams make that needed shelter almost worthless. We also engineered it to be strong. In nearly hurricane sailing conditions the wave impacts are huge. But it does not have to be a hard dodger to withstand those impacts, it just has to be well done.

Finally, pilot houses: If you yearn for and appreciate motoring on those totally miserable cold, foggy, windless days, a pilot house, with heat and windshield wipers, sitting in your captain's chair behind the wheel with a steaming cuppa close at hand, go for the pilot house.

Photos: Outdoor fun with friends, hard reaching under spinnaker

[alaskanviking]

Depends on where you’re cruising honestly.
Hot weather id want a dodger and bimini, or maybe a full enclosure with screen. You want more protection from the sun. a dodger will keep the spray out of your face.
Colder weather the dodger will protect you from the wind and spray but not from the cold. I’d rather have a pilothouse and full enclosure.

I have a preference for redundancy so the pilothouse with a second steering system rules in my book.

Soft Dodger – good for the tropics and nicer weather. Has an advantage in that it’s easy to take down in heavy weather or storms. However I don’t see many take these down except for hurricane prep. Window clarity and waterproofness has a limited life, but it will still keep most of the spray off your face.

Hard dodger – much more windage. not easy to remove or takedown for storm prep, or it’s a permanent structure. Glass/acrylic/lexan stays clear for longer. Can install window wipers, and other permanent equipment (speakers, Lights ect). Some of these look really good, some look really bad.

Hybrid dodger – hard top with fabric sides and front windows. More windage than a soft dodger. easy to take down. In bad weather this can add enough force with gusts to rip it off the boat. Gives you sun and rain protection even if you remove the fabric windows

Pilothouse – ultimate cold weather or heavy weather structure. They typically have a second steering station to hide out when it gets nasty or cold. Has a lot more windage, you will definitely notice when the wind is blowing or at anchorage. Usually has a lot of windows which adds a lot of heat in hotter weather think big green house. Windows are heavier duty. Wiring and plumbing of equipment is easier since its part of the boat. Depending on the boat design a pilothouse may be difficult to add a Bimini or full enclosure that looks good. Complicates the installed systems on the boat and increases maintenance, as you have an additional steer station, throttles, engine panel, and increases load on your heating/cooling system. Can take up a lot of real estate in the boat depending on the design. Key thing to look out for is if you can dock or operate the boat from the interior steering station. Some designs have poor visibility and are not good even in bad weather ie running off radar and instrumentation, so they are only usable in the very worse of conditions. Another issue depending on the design is light/night vision. If you have a larger pilothouse that’s more of a cathedral ceiling or open salon style, it’s easy for someone to turn on lights while moving through the boat and kill your night vision. A pilothouse that is separated from the rest of the boat is better for operating at night in heavy weather. that style tends to be larger boats.

[deblen]

https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ps-175159.html