Far East Sails

[Fore and Aft]

I have a mainsail from Rolly Tasker and are pretty happy with it. Derrick the agent for Rolly Tasker here on the Sunshine Coast is very helpful.
I am not a racing sailor and have little idea what makes a bad sail but our mainsail apears to be pretty good to my eyes.
Cheers

[myocean]

We bought a Genoa from Far East.

- good service
- quick delivery

- you get what you pay for: There are no extras at all, no extra reinforcements, etc. if not explicitly ordered. So think carefully what you expect/what you want.

[Jim Cate]

One from an in country sailmaker and one from Far East Sails.. I need to re read the fine print and make sure I am comparing apples to apples but in principle I asked both for radial cut hydranet or equivalent. Both replied with a quote for cross cut Dacron "premium" sails so both didn't really read my request that carefully

G'Day Cranky,

Ya know, when a sailmaker responds to a request for quote for a radial Hydranet sail with a quote for a cross cut dacron sail, I'd say that communications were compromised at the very least. And if they can't get this critical and basic bit right, why would you have confidence that they would get the details right?

FWIW, I paid a hefty premium to get our current suit of radial Hydranet sails made (over cross cut dacron)... and I t hink it was worth the extra cost.

YMMV, and your requirements certainly will vary, but I'd be leery of either of your prospective vendors.

Jim

[wsmurdoch]

Because of where I live I do not have a sailmaker who will come out to my boat, measure, make sails, go on a trial sail with me, correct any deficiencies in the sails, and give me a great set of sails. Because of that I have bought sails from North, Schurr Sails, and Far East Sails by telephone, fax, and email. All were Dacron sails (well except the spinnaker).

North Sails - These sails were a radial genoa and a radial loose footed main for a Tanzer 22 and were made by their loft in Canada. All communications were in writing. The main came with a rope luff rather than the specified slides. The genoa came with tell tale windows rather than not (the yarns hang on the stitching). The main went back to Chicago at my expense to have slides installed. The tack rather than being moved back was moved forward. I gave up and installed a taped o-ring tack myself. I sucked up about the tell tale windows in the genoa. The sails are pretty, but the service was awful.

Schurr Sails - They made me a genoa, cruising spinnaker, and storm jib for the Tanzer. No problems. We race the Tanzer, and I like their cross cut genoa better than the radial North genoa, but there are physiological advantages to the crinkly North sail. The fit and finish of the Schurr sails are fine.

Far East Sails - They have made me first a reefable hanked on staysail and later a genoa and loose footed mainsail for my Pacific Seacraft 34; all cruising cross cut sails. I sweated making my own measurements doing them at least three times. With little hand holding I worried about my choices of options on the sails. In the end all is fine. The only fault I've found is a pair of rusting steel staples inside the head of the staysail. I'd have no hesitation about ordering from them again. I paid no import duty.

I have also dealt with one other sailmaker the results of which were so bad I will not discuss them here except to say that I have the sail and I have not used it in at least 15 years.

Bill

[crankysailor]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

G'Day Cranky,



Ya know, when a sailmaker responds to a request for quote for a radial Hydranet sail with a quote for a cross cut dacron sail, I'd say that communications were compromised at the very least. And if they can't get this critical and basic bit right, why would you have confidence that they would get the details right?

Exactly.. my point was more along the lines that it didn't really make a difference in service when working remotely if the sailmaker is in the same country or in China. They both appear to be offering cookie cutter bulk service anyway. So if it is going to be like that, might as well save the 5000€. But yeah, I am inclined to just keep shopping. There must be a better option. If not, I might just get the Genoa and CCZ from FE sails since not a lot can go wrong there at that price.

FWIW, I paid a hefty premium to get our current suit of radial Hydranet sails made (over cross cut dacron)... and I t hink it was worth the extra cost.

Jim

Good to hear.. I keep hearing things like for cruising might as well save the money and get some good quality dacron sails. Without personal experience is tricky I find to know what is worth or not for us.

[Jim Cate]

Good to hear.. I keep hearing things like for cruising might as well save the money and get some good quality dacron sails. Without personal experience is tricky I find to know what is worth or not for us.

Again FWIW, the Hydranet sails are now around 5 years and 17000 miles old. There are a few wrinkles from sloppy reefing, bt the basic shape is still damn good. They maintain the s hape through a wide range of wind speeds, and in general are far better at their age than previous dacron sails have been.

Their down side, if any, is that they are stiff and don't flake nicely when dropped... even at this advanced age!

As membrane sails improve in longevity they may overtake Hydranet in cruising usefulness, but as of now I'm happy.

Jim

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Again FWIW, the Hydranet sails are now around 5 years and 17000 miles old. There are a few wrinkles from sloppy reefing, bt the basic shape is still damn good. They maintain the s hape through a wide range of wind speeds, and in general are far better at their age than previous dacron sails have been.

Their down side, if any, is that they are stiff and don't flake nicely when dropped... even at this advanced age!

As membrane sails improve in longevity they may overtake Hydranet in cruising usefulness, but as of now I'm happy.

Jim

The radial cut Hydranet sails on our cat were made by Delta Voiles in France in 2010. Since then the cat has sailed Med, Atlantic, Caribbean, East Coast USA to Maine and back, Panama, Galapagos, FP to New Caledonia to New Zealand, then three round trips NZ - S. Pac. Islands and back. Guesstimating 50,000 miles in 9 years.

Sails still in very good condition, albeit a bit stretched. They maintain their shape anyway. The hand on them is rather stiff, which in a stack pack is fine and with the full battens there is no flogging when reefing or hoisting/lowering, just slow waves. Stitching is still solid and only minor repairs . We’ve recently replaced battens, batten cars, and the UV cover on the jib.

When we eventually replace these sails we’ll go Hydranet again - I can’t see how any of the laminates can last as long. The really nice thing about Hydranet is that the chances of catastrophic cloth failure is low.

[Seman]

Originally Posted by fxykty

How about Rolly Tasker Sails in Phuket? Has anyone used them?

For any of these, is there any value to being on site with them if your boat is in the area? Or will they still deal with you completely hands off?

I have had a Genoa and main made by Rolly Tasker. Both I had to return. The Genoa was the wrong size and the stitching on the main was intermittently missing. Lucky I was in Phuket at the time!

[seacap]

I had a jib built by them. I always though that triple stitched meant 3 rows of stitching. But in actuality you only get two rows and they give some confusing explanation how two rows is triple stitching. Finish looked rather light weight. Customer service was excellent.

[wsmurdoch]

Which kind of zig zag stitch did Far East use?


Did they mean 3 point zig zag stitching or perhaps 3 step zig zag stitching and it was confused in translation?

Bill

[seacap]

Originally Posted by wsmurdoch

Which kind of zig zag stitch did Far East use?


Did they mean 3 point zig zag stitching or perhaps 3 step zig zag stitching and it was confused in translation?

Bill

Could have been any one of those. And it may be a translation thing. But every time I have bought a sail and it was triple stitched I got three rows. I would rather have 3 rows of the upper stitch as opposed to two rows of the lower stitch. Takes more overlapping material for the three rows.

[lars]

They do a single row of three step stiching and call it triple stitched. I called them on this when my sail was delivered and told them that 3 step is not triple stiched as i had ordered. They told me to pretty much stuff it and all their sails are "made to specifications" there is no warranty what's in the bag is what you get

[hpeer]

Is there any definitive evidence one kind of stitching is better than the other and by how much?

I dont have a clue but currently have a dog in this fight because I am about to purchase a sail and Tasker is looking very attractive.

[wsmurdoch]

We are on our Pacific Seacraft 34 on the Chesapeake Bay right now. All three of the sails on this boat are Far East. The one-reef staysail is perhaps 10 years old. The main and 135% genoa are two years old. The staysail has its panel seams sewn with three rows of one step zig zag. The main and genoa have their panel seams sewn with two rows of three step zig zag. Below are some pictures.

My take is:

In the older staysail three rows of one step zig zag are set in an inch of seam overlap. The top and bottom rows just reach outside the overlap preventing the edges of the overlap from rising. The stitching pierces both layers 24 times in 2 inches and one layer 12 times in 2 inches.

In the newer main and genoa two rows of three step zig zag are set in an inch and an eighth of seam overlap. The stitching does not reach outside the overlap so the edges of the seam are a bit vulnerable. The stitching pierces both layers 42 times in 2 inches. Each of the three step stitches are individually shorter than the one step zig zag stitches leaving them less vulnerable to snagging.

Overall, I like the newer method.

Our other boat has North sails. When we get back home this summer, I'll try to remember to take a look at it.

Bill

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by rbk

Guess no one really read my original post. Having sailed new and old sails from Doyle, Hyde, North, Pryde, Hood and Hong Kong and it's pretty hard to screw up a cross cut full batten heavy cruising sail as a "quick and cheap replacement" and I'll add... to allow me to sail while I complete a refit. So if no one has anything constructive to add...

Your attitude put me off to the point that I didn't want to reply at all, but I'll overlook that and give you my experiences although this thread is so old that probably its a mute point. But maybe somebody else can benefit.

I bought a Dacron cross cut mainsail for my boat from Far East, as a cruising main, not a racing main. The price was low but they promised quality materials and prompt service. They were easy to work with until the very end of the design process, making sure that I understood the importance of accurate measurements and that I was taking responsibility for the fit if the sail was built my specs but didn't work.

Where we ran into problems is that I needed a particular luff curve due to the odd pre-bend in my mast. They didn't want to cut the sail to that shape. We went back and forth but I was adamant and finally they agreed (I thought).

When the sail arrived I found that they had made the sail with their standard luff curve, then cut away some areas to meet my spec, resulting in a sail with much diminished girth measurements. On my complaint their response was to send it back (at my expense) and they would look at it and decide it there was an error. No promises. Well I kept the sail and have used it for 6 years on my annual cruise, but it irks me every time I look at it.

Other than this design beef, I found the sail to be acceptable but built to the very minimum standards. It was cheap and looked it.

Now to make a long story longer, I have purchased many other sails (about 9 I think) from offshore sailmakers including two factories in China, one in Thailand, and also from a loft in Sri Lanka. Some of these sails were for myself and others were for friends. I have gotten a license as a "sailmaker" from some of these organizations which allows me to buy at wholesale prices. I sell to other people just to keep my account active, not as a money making venture.

I have found that you get the quality that you ask (and pay) for. The fabrics, hardware, and designs, and workmanship, are all comparable to large national or global lofts. You take on a lot of risk and responsibility by performing all the measurements and deciding what sail shape, fabric, size, etc to ask for. But you save a lot of money.

It is worth it? For me it is because I cannot afford a $9000 racing sail, but I might be able to afford a $3000 one, plus I get a lot of satisfaction from being at the helm, so to speak, when I am spec'ing and designing a sail.

Recently I ordered a mainsail and a jib for a big cat and boy was that a complicated project. It went well except for ONE BIG MISTAKE: The buyer gave me an incorrect leech dimension for the main, 1 foot too long. The sail is beautiful but could not be used. Since it was our error, we had to eat it, and we found a local loft willing to modify the sail at our expense.

But as for Far East, it was very inexpensive, but not the best experience, probably because my needs did not fit their standard product.