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Old 27-02-2020, 09:48   #1
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Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

Hi All:

Getting ready for an Exumas bareboat trip.

In the Exuma Cays, the tidal currents between the Banks and the Sound are obviously a thing. Some anchorages are tighter/narrower with more current and more pronounced change, others less-so. Though I've never had to do it in real life, I'm familiar with Bahamian-style anchoring/mooring.

So, a two-part question:
  1. Assuming a good set/holding to begin with, how reliably do standard Delta or Danforth anchors reset with a 180 degree tide change – almost always, 50/50, rarely?
  2. In actual practice, how often do people end up feeling the need to hang on two anchors in the Exuma Cays? I realize "it depends" – but if you peeked at 50 random boats in settled weather across a handful of anchorages on any given night – would virtually all of them likely be using two, virtually all using one, all using one except everyone in tight/narrow anchorages using two, or what would you guess?

Thanks in advance.
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Old 27-02-2020, 10:03   #2
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

Never as far as I can tell. Everyone has a modern anchor that just resets. At the recent anchoring seminar at Chat & Chill the two big no-no’s were excessive scope and two anchors, both due to midnight tangles with others.
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Old 27-02-2020, 10:12   #3
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

2 anchors were common 30 years ago but seldom seen now. Usually an idiot who upsets the whole scheme of swinging.
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Old 27-02-2020, 11:16   #4
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

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Originally Posted by Woodland Hills View Post
At the recent anchoring seminar at Chat & Chill the two big no-no’s were excessive scope and two anchors, both due to midnight tangles with others.
I don't have to anchor very often where we are but I am curious about what excessive scope is. I've always read 5:1 minimum feet and 7:1 preferred. In just 10' of water that's 50' to 70' of line and potential swing. Watching the crowded harbors in the Bahamas I'm stuck watching on You Tube here surrounded by snow, that seems like a lot of rope/chain in on small area.
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Old 27-02-2020, 11:38   #5
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

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Originally Posted by Tmacmi View Post
I don't have to anchor very often where we are but I am curious about what excessive scope is. I've always read 5:1 minimum feet and 7:1 preferred. In just 10' of water that's 50' to 70' of line and potential swing. Watching the crowded harbors in the Bahamas I'm stuck watching on You Tube here surrounded by snow, that seems like a lot of rope/chain in on small area.
In 10’ of of water my anchor roller is 19’ off the bottom so 5:1 is about 100’. Don’t forget to add the distance above the water to your depth at high tide, not low tide. If everyone else is using 5:1 to 7:1 and you have 10:1 out that’s excessive.

Currently I am in 17’ at high tide and have 150’ of chain out for just under 6:1 add 70’ for the LOA and I have a 420’ swinging circle. Several sailboats have anchored near us in the past two weeks and later moved off due to swinging a bit too close as we clocked in the wind. Then again, we are the farthest out boat in the area for just this reason.

If for whatever reason I had to anchor among others in a crowded place, I would use 3:1 and keep my anchor watch program handy all night (which I do every night anyway). This is why we run 5/8” chain and a 121 lb Rocna Vulcan: so we can shorten up in mild weather if needed. It’s the 9’ off the water to the roller that makes us incompatible with lots of others, it makes little difference that the hook on the bridle is at the waterline either (cleats are 8’ up).
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Old 27-02-2020, 11:42   #6
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmacmi View Post
I don't have to anchor very often where we are but I am curious about what excessive scope is. I've always read 5:1 minimum feet and 7:1 preferred. In just 10' of water that's 50' to 70' of line and potential swing. Watching the crowded harbors in the Bahamas I'm stuck watching on You Tube here surrounded by snow, that seems like a lot of rope/chain in on small area.
It’s actually more rode than that.
Assume for ease of math that you draw 5’, your in 5’ of water under your keel and your bow is 5’ above the water.
That’s 15’, multiply 15 x7 and you get 105’.

Some will occasionally use two anchors, but those are most often very experienced people who have been cruising for a long time and then they only do so when in very tight confines. Like here in Pipe Key, a beautiful well protected anchorage but if you look between the mice, it’s 200’ across, Max.
That’s in 15’ of water and add of course 45’ of boat to your rode math and you’ll see without two anchors they are going aground when the current changes.

90% of people in boats here don’t have a clue what they are doing, they toss the anchor out, a bunch of chain on top of it and get into the dinghy and go to the bar.
It’s just us nuts that get wrapped around the axle about anchors, many don’t have a clue what anchor they have, it came with the boat.
Most of the time they get lucky and get away with it. Rarely they don’t, and when they don’t it seems there must be plenty of good Samaritan’s to help as there is no Boat US or Seatow to call, yet you don’t see wrecked boats on the beaches.

It’s best to avoid places like Staniel Cay and Georgetown when it’s busy, with a little looking you can usually find a nice safe, out of the way place to anchor and not worry about some boat dragging down on you when the wind gets up, cause it does.

I have never used two anchors, I’m just too nervous to let myself get into that tight a spot where it’s required.
I’m chicken, I go somewhere else.
I’m not sure how they keep the two from twisting up when the current changes, cause in my Pipe Cay example, it’s pretty strong current.
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Old 27-02-2020, 12:04   #7
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

The times i could see my well dug in Mason Supreme anchor were i have changed directions 180 degrees, I could tell it never “flipped” etc. it was still set in the same direction it started with. Now i am sure it has in fact changed directions, I personally have never seen it do so.

I have never put out a second anchor, including in the Bahamas.
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Old 27-02-2020, 15:54   #8
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

Two seasons in Exumas, and some time in Eleuthera and Abacos. Used conventional roll bar Rocna first time, then Rocna Vulcan on new boat. Both times carried a Fortress as backup. It never hit the water. Always just one anchor. In crowded spots, you better swing with the group, not upset things with a second anchor.
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Old 27-02-2020, 16:08   #9
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

I just set an alarm to coincide with the tide change. One should never rely on your anchor to self re-set when dealing with the strong currents across the banks. compounded by shifting sands over hard coral bottom.
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Old 27-02-2020, 16:14   #10
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

Here's a thread on Bahamian moors
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ead-99212.html
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Old 27-02-2020, 16:22   #11
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

This is our second winter in the Bahamas and we’ve never set two anchors. We have a Rocna with all chain (actually 125’ plus 175’ of 8 plait but we’ve never had to put all of the chain out in the Bahamas) and we typically have 5:1 out under normal conditions.

I agree with a64pilot about avoiding crowded anchorages whenever possible here. Mr. cthoops and I were just discussing that today. It seems that there are always a few boats that drag in crowded anchorages when the wind pipes up to 25+ knots and honestly there is simply no reason for it in the Exumas with some care when anchoring, proper scope, and an appropriately sized anchor.

But in places like Georgetown, especially with the Regatta going on right now, people try to cram in on short scope which leads to the inevitable sh**show when a front comes through. No thanks. We’ll just hang out here in Red Shanks until it’s over and people start to head north again.

Have fun on your charter.
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Old 27-02-2020, 18:30   #12
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

Quote:
Originally Posted by MileHighSkip View Post
Hi All:
  1. Assuming a good set/holding to begin with, how reliably do standard Delta or Danforth anchors reset with a 180 degree tide change – almost always, 50/50, rarely?
    It's the guys with CQR's that drag from my observation. I see a lot of small Deltas also. IMO though, on a charter, there really isn't a reason to worry about 180 degree shifts with tide. Just avoid it.
  2. In actual practice, how often do people end up feeling the need to hang on two anchors in the Exuma Cays? I realize "it depends" – but if you peeked at 50 random boats in settled weather across a handful of anchorages on any given night – would virtually all of them likely be using two, virtually all using one, all using one except everyone in tight/narrow anchorages using two, or what would you guess?
I've never seen it in three years
Thanks in advance.
Besides, you won't have to worry about two anchors as your bareboat probably will only have one.


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90% of people in boats here don’t have a clue what they are doing, they toss the anchor out, a bunch of chain on top of it and get into the dinghy and go to the bar.
Man, I'd say the exact opposite. Most do know what they are doing. The only thing that screws up the anchorages is guys who won't invest in a quality anchor and therefore layout way, way more chain then they need relying on the chain to hold them.

As for people hoping in the dingy and going to the bar - which one? We go to Highborne, McDuffs, and Staniel all the time and they are hardly filled with cruisers. The only bar I've seen with a lot of cruisers is Chat and Chill, but given the number of boats hanging out around there it's a fraction - small fraction that goes there. Pretty much most cruisers are uber cheap and beer costs too much let alone food.
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Old 27-02-2020, 19:24   #13
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

For those people who say you should NEVER use two anchors, that's not right--but it is unusual. Apparently some people think the reason that two anchors are used is to avoid a "reset" on a tide reversal. That is not true, and was NEVER the real logic for using a "Bahamian Moor".

When you are a deeper draft boat anchoring in a narrow channel, with a reversing current, you better use two anchors or you'll be likely aground as the tide shifts and you swing wide on your rode. The only place we have had to sit on two anchors is between Allen Cay and Cabbage Cay. We only had room to float in the channel that was a lot narrower than a normal anchor scope. Other people might chose to move on and not deal with the issue. If you are uncomfortable dealing with two anchors, there is always a place nearby where it is not needed.

We need 6.5 feet to float, and our anchor roller is 4 feet above the water, so at our minimum anchoring depth a 5:1 scope is almost 40 feet of rode, plus 50 feet back to our rudder skeg, and you can see that a narrow channel needs something other than just a single line.

If you are using two anchors because you are worried about your anchor resetting, you need to find another anchor, or another place to anchor. And in a crowded anchorage, you ALWAYS do what everybody else is doing, or just move on if that isn't what you want to do.

I have never seen anyone clog up an anchorage with two anchors, but there was one A-hole in Georgetown who seemed to delight in getting on the radio and yelling at everybody to stay away, he had 160 feet of rode out--in 10 feet of water!
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Old 27-02-2020, 20:08   #14
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

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I have never seen anyone clog up an anchorage with two anchors, but there was one A-hole in Georgetown who seemed to delight in getting on the radio and yelling at everybody to stay away, he had 160 feet of rode out--in 10 feet of water!
I heard him two years ago!! It really cracked me up but have to say the easiest way to deal with that would be to say no problem and throw out all your fenders.
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Old 27-02-2020, 21:24   #15
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Re: Exuma Cays – How Commonly Two Anchors are Used

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Originally Posted by billknny View Post
For those people who say you should NEVER use two anchors, that's not right--but it is unusual. Apparently some people think the reason that two anchors are used is to avoid a "reset" on a tide reversal. That is not true, and was NEVER the real logic for using a "Bahamian Moor".
......
In the days when Bahamian moors were common, so were Danforth anchors. The Bahamian moor was often used to avoid issues with tripping the Danforth and for resetting. With modern anchors a Bahamian moor is far less required.

In the case you are pointing out which is essentially to reduce the swinging diameter, a Bahamian moor or bow and stern anchoring works. Which one is preferred seems to be based on location and tradition.
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