Colregs Etiquette

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by paralog

1. who the heck remembers that.

Every competent skipper

Originally Posted by paralog

2. who the heck flys a day shape indicating the are motoring.

Ditto. It's not optional, and in many parts of the world you can be fined for failing to do so.

Originally Posted by paralog

. . .

In those situations it's always better to back off and let the other person through rather than try and argue the above later.

That's not only good advice, it's actually required by the Rules

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

The issue with late or slight changes is they may be interpreted by the other party incorrectly and resulting excuse me waltz can lead to a serious situation

Exactly right.

NEVER use"slight adjustments" in collision avoidance situations, unless you're so far away that a risk of collision has not yet arisen. The other vessel may not realize you've changed course and may then maneuver itself, negating your "slight adjustment". This is one of the most common causes of collisions.

"(b) Any alteration of course and/or speed to avoid collision shall, if the circumstances of the case admit, be large enough to be readily apparent to another vessel observing visually or by radar; a succession of small alterations of course and/or speed should be avoided."

Rule 8, and Collision Avoidance 101.

[Rumrace]

For years I’ve been watching sailboat tack right in front of my 8 ton power boat cruising at 35 n with no darn brakes claiming the right of way. Some educated boating fraternity gives them the rights to exercise bad manners base on the edge of interpretation of rules. Water drama queens looking for a new adventure to discuss their latest superior boating expertise.
I must have missed that lesson but I don’t but in lines either.
I see bad manners on sidewalks, learned to expect them on the water. It’s all the other nice boaters make it worth while

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Rumrace

For years I’ve been watching sailboat tack right in front of my 8 ton power boat cruising at 35 n with no darn brakes claiming the right of way.

Where? In a channel? If so, what are you doing flying through a channel with sailboats in it at those kinds of speeds? If not, can't you steer a course to miss sailboats by far enough that it doesn't matter whether/when they tack? You really can't stop? The power boats that I've operated that can do 35 knots stop quickly enough that people loose their balance when you cut the throttle. You can't turn a little to miss them once they start the tack?



Following the COLREGs isn't some huge burden or problem and if you see it that way maybe boating isn't for you.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by Jammer

Following the COLREGs isn't some huge burden or problem and if you see it that way maybe boating isn't for you.

I didn't understand it to mean Rumrace felt burdened by the Rules. BTW, it's the sailboats tacking in front of power boats that are the ones not following Colregs.

[Lake-Effect]

Power boats running down sailboats is by far the most common occurrence. Last week, over half a mile from shore, we had to change course (bear off, not tack) because of some young doofus bearing down on us at speed. This sort of clod is the exception, but still there seems to be some primal urge to always pass in front of sailboats, even if they have to go out of their way to do so. I guess they like watching our small sailboat pound into their wake.

I would respectfully suggest that if, in open water, a fast-moving powerboat is burdened by a tacking sailboat, they're probably too close to begin with.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

I didn't understand it to mean Rumrace felt burdened by the Rules. BTW, it's the sailboats tacking in front of power boats that are the ones not following Colregs.

No sailor tacks right into the path of a speeding power boat; that is against common sense and Colregs and could result in a nasty collision. Who would do that just to assert some rights?

But if a boat is sailing then there will be times when a tack is required. Usually one tacks when the water into which one tacks is clear of other boats. No sailor I know would intentionally tack into the path of a power boat but power boats can cover a lot of ground. What might be clear water when I tack could be a place where a power boat will come cruising through in a minute later even though he was 500mts away when I tacked. It looks to him that I tacked right in front of him.

But the Colregs require that the power boat give way, and for good reason. Sailboats are generally limited in their choice of speed and direction. Power boaters should be aware that they have the responsibility to avoid sailboats, even ones which might maneuver in a manner unexpected by the powerboat however Rumrace and others might actually learn enough about sailing to anticipate that the sailboat is going to soon tack. And the power boater should realize that the sailboat tacked because he had to, not because he wanted to get in the way of the speeding powerboat.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Power boats running down sailboats is by far the most common occurrence. Last week, over half a mile from shore, we had to change course because of some young doofus bearing down on us. This sort of clod is the exception, but still there seems to be some primal urge to always pass in front of sailboats, even if they have to go out of their way to do so.

I would respectfully suggest that if, in open water, a fast-moving powerboat is burdened by a tacking sailboat, they're probably too close to begin with.

There are idiots on both types - WAFIs and PAFIs.

I respectfully suggest that a sailboat, tacking in front of a powerboat so as to cause a burden, regardless of how fast the powerboat is going, is responsible for taking it from a situation where the powerboat would have passed astern of the sailboat, to a situation where the passing will be closer.

I have been on both sides of the coin, so this isn't a bash on sailboaters, but there are far too many sailboaters who don't understand their requirement to stand on.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by wingssail

What might be clear water when I tack could be a place where a power boat will come cruising through in a minute later even though he was 500mts away when I tacked. It looks to him that I tacked right in front of him.

But the Colregs require that the power boat give way,

If you tacked in front of him when he is 500m away, then you failed to stand on as required by the colregs. Thank you for illustrating my point so well.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

TI respectfully suggest that a sailboat, tacking in front of a powerboat so as to cause a burden, regardless of how fast the powerboat is going, is responsible for taking it from a situation where the powerboat would have passed astern of the sailboat, to a situation where the passing will be closer.

I have been on both sides of the coin, so this isn't a bash on sailboaters, but there are far too many sailboaters who don't understand their requirement to stand on.

In my experience, sailboats deliberately tacking or manoevring to burden a passing fast motorboat is very rare. And again, if a tack creates a burden, the motorboat is arguably too close and/or too fast for the conditions.

Standing on didn't work for us last week.

[boatman61]

What I hate is when the "I know the rules" knobhead pushes things to the extreme..
Heading up the narrow small boat channel against the tide when leaving Poole one w/end with heavy traffic ahead and behind there was a sailboat Tacking up the main channel heading towards Poole.. he was using both the main and small channel as he came towards me and a collision was all but inevitable, I could not turn to port as that would put me in his path as he tacked, I could not turn to stbd as I would have promptly run aground and cutting my speed put me in danger of having the boat close behind me having to make emergency manouveres causing chaos and a pile up so I stood on.
Man did he curse me out for having to tack 5 metres earlier than the edge of the Channel... "go back to f**King school.. Blah Blah"
I responded with the traditional single digit.
I'd do the same again..

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

If you tacked in front of him when he is 500m away, then you failed to stand on as required by the colregs. Thank you for illustrating my point so well.

What?!? If a tacking sailboat half a km away is a burden, somebody's too fast and their course is too close. Or they're just being petty.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Heading up the narrow small boat channel against the tide when leaving Poole one w/end with heavy traffic ahead and behind there was a sailboat Tacking up the main channel heading towards Poole..

... restricted channel, traffic... sounds like you were actually in the right to stand on.

[rslifkin]

As a powerboater, about the only time I've had a sailor tack and cause a problem is when someone insists on sailing in a narrow channel with the wind blowing up the channel. It's fine if they leave some room, but tacking across the entire channel is just inconsiderate. In some cases it's so extreme that I've had to stop just try to maneuver around in the wind because it was impossible to get past the sailboat safely and they were only making maybe 1 kt up the channel.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

In my experience, sailboats deliberately tacking or manoevring to burden a passing fast motorboat is very rare. And again, if a tack creates a burden, the motorboat is arguably too close and/or too fast for the conditions.

Standing on didn't work for us last week.

I don't think the suggestion was that these sailboaters are deliberately trying to burden the other vessels, but that they are ignorant of the rules, and do not consider the consequences of their manoeuvres.

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

What?!? If a tacking sailboat half a km away is a burden, somebody's too fast and their course is too close. Or they're just being petty.

Are you for real? That's a 1/4 mile away. Their speed is absolutely irrelevant. If your tack is going to create a risk of collision, then you shouldn't tack. Delay, ease the sheets, luff up if necessary, but don't sail as if you have "right of way." You don't!