Coast Guard/DEA boardings

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Sailor Jer

Go learn about maritime law already...you'll be changing your tune of wanting those LEO when you get hijacked by pirates after you get raped, plundered and pillaged..but it'll be too late then right...

This statement has no basis in fact or reality.

First, the overwhelming majority of the boardings by USCG and US Customs take place in US waterways or near offshore waters. The main other areas are the NW Bahamas, the waters off Columbia and Venezuela and the northern Caribbean around the Yucatan Channel and Windward Passage.

As far as I know, there are zero documented cases of hijacking, rape, plunder and pillage of yachts in the US waterways and near coastal waters and very few in the other areas. There are serious crimes against boaters in the coastal waters around Venezuela which the USCG doesn't really patrol anyway. Otherwise, most of the hijackings occur off east Africa and parts of the Indian Ocean and western Pacific.

So the odds of USCG having any impact on the crimes you mention against a US flagged yacht are just about zero.

[surfprimal]

Originally Posted by skipmac

As far as I know, there are zero documented cases of hijacking, rape, plunder and pillage of yachts in the US waterways and near coastal waters

I know of at least one in Newport Beach, CA.

"Convicted murderer Skylar Deleon was sentenced to die by lethal injection for three slayings, including the murders at sea of a couple forced to sign over ownership of their yacht, then tied to an anchor and thrown overboard."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder...d_Jackie_Hawks

Extremely rare? Absolutely but, not zero.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by surfprimal

I know of at least one in Newport Beach, CA.

"Convicted murderer Skylar Deleon was sentenced to die by lethal injection for three slayings, including the murders at sea of a couple forced to sign over ownership of their yacht, then tied to an anchor and thrown overboard."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder...d_Jackie_Hawks

Extremely rare? Absolutely but, not zero.

Oh yes. I do remember this one. Skylar and his girlfriend posed as rich boat buyers, went for a sea trial with the owners and did them in.

So this would fall into the category of hijacking and murder but doubt random boardings by the coast guard would have prevented this.

[motion30]

3 weeks ago on a Friday evening a combination of Coast Guard and florida Marine Patrol went through the Key West Anchorage and inspected every boat where there was someone aboard. when they board my boat they were polite and friendly, asking to see the valve in the head, flares and life jackets. Probably boarded 50 boats

[boatpoker]

I cross the border (Canadian Flag) 7-8 times per year and average two boardings per season on Lake Ontario. I've also been boarded in Lake Superior, the Detroit River and Hudson River by USCG, I think they were bored but all were quite pleasant, no problems.

Boarded by local cops in NJ at Toms River. One came back the next day to take me grocery shopping.

Boarded by a border protection guy in Oswego Harbour, He stayed for a coffee.

I've also been boarded in Florida at Lake Worth and at Venice ..... I hope all Florida cops are not like the illiterate, open mouthed gum chewing, arrogant, self inflated dick heads that I met.

[motion30]

I understand the Coast Guard can board you for no reason, my question is can the local Leos Board you without cause? what happens if you refuse ?

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by motion30

3 weeks ago on a Friday evening a combination of Coast Guard and florida Marine Patrol went through the Key West Anchorage and inspected every boat where there was someone aboard. when they board my boat they were polite and friendly, asking to see the valve in the head, flares and life jackets. Probably boarded 50 boats

I heard this was called operation "Liveaboard"
I assume if you refuse you may get to spend the night with Bubba in the local lock up? In other words I don't think refusal is any more of an option than not stopping your vehicle for a traffic stop.


Sent from my iPad Pro using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[tomfl]

Originally Posted by motion30

I understand the Coast Guard can board you for no reason, my question is can the local Leos Board you without cause? what happens if you refuse ?

Depends on jurisdiction and how you define local LEOs. In Florida the FWC can board if they suspect violations, probably the same for most state level LEOs. All LEOs can board if they think there is a crime being committed. Example would be as a LEO approached they hear gun fire and screams. Might get by with saying they smelled pot. Same goes for things like seeing a holding tank being dumped, gas leaking, anchoring over coral, or sea grass. Of course LEOs have been accused of faking claims of seeing a crime.

I would not refuse simply because the next day more LEOs might be putting me under a microscope and I am sure they could find something wrong. Also might run into a LEO who would force the matter and board even if you refused. Don't forget LEOs all have guns and radios and their friend have guns and radios and some of their friends with radios have bigger guns than you have.

[surfprimal]

Originally Posted by motion30

I understand the Coast Guard can board you for no reason, my question is can the local Leos Board you without cause? what happens if you refuse ?

Local LEO and DEA are generally restricted by the 4th Amendment. Need probably cause for search. Just like getting pulled over in your car, or knocking on your door. That being said, if they have the authority to come aboard, due to local laws/regulations, to "inspect" your head, fishing licenses, fish holds, etc or "safety" equipment. That's a pretty wide open door. It would be like a cop being able to pull you over, without cause, to check your airbags and that your seat belts are functioning, there isn't anything to stop them from a plain view search once inside. If anything pops, then they switch gears to a probable cause LE search.

Refusal? IDK it's probably tied into your boating registration or your fishing license as implied consent or some small print thing.

[dwedeking2]

Originally Posted by surfprimal

Local LEO and DEA are generally restricted by the 4th Amendment.

In real life this isn't accurate. In your post and the one above it, intimidation proves this isn't what happens. The police can do whatever they want if you don't have the money to defend yourself. For the white people, "it's easier to go along". Probable cause is whatever the cop says it is. In a court of law, cops are "trained observers".

I find it funny that in highschool I was shown how bad "communism" was. They invaded freedoms, asked for papers. 20 years later, they are us.

[meridian28]

Last year at an FWC presentation in Marathon the presenter said that FWC personnel were deputized with other federal, state and local agencies. If they were driving down the road and saw you weaving they could stop you.

[markpierce]

Never, ever been boarded even though the USCG passes by most every time I boat.

[chuckr]

On our last trip down the East Coast from the Cheapeake Bay to Miami to jump off to Mexico we were boarded off Florida by Homeland Security. They made us slow down and came aboard - one guy stood in the cockpit with his had on this gun while another went down below alone - we were not allowed to go with him and he rummaged around and then they left -
We have been inspected in multiple foreign ports and each and every time the inspectors insist someone be with them full time and at time there were 2 of them and would not move until they had someone with them.
Only in the USA do the officials feel they can wander around your boat by themselves -

[Island Time O25]

Originally Posted by dwedeking2

In real life this isn't accurate. In your post and the one above it, intimidation proves this isn't what happens. The police can do whatever they want if you don't have the money to defend yourself. For the white people, "it's easier to go along". Probable cause is whatever the cop says it is. In a court of law, cops are "trained observers".

I find it funny that in highschool I was shown how bad "communism" was. They invaded freedoms, asked for papers. 20 years later, they are us.

Yes, I recall back in the early 80s, studying "1984" in college, we were heaving a big sigh of relief thinking that all these 35 year old warnings about the Big Brother were heeded and we did not have to worry about him being connected to our TVs. Fast forward 35 years and we are willingly giving up all of our freedoms to the gov't on the silver platter. All under the guise of our own "safety and security".

Indeed, we deserve neither the freedom nor the safety as the saying goes.

[Rustic Charm]

Originally Posted by sailnow2011

If your are documented in America, they could board you on a Chinese inland lake.

Whilst im aware that the US CG can search a US vessel even outside the USA, i seriously doubt they would have ANY authority in another soverign nation

Lets use Australia for example. Under what authority would ANY US law enforement authority have over its citizens in Australia?