Canadian Operators Card - Just Another Money Grab

[boatpoker]

My 10 year old nephew took the "challenge" at the Toronto Boat Show last year at my urging. He has no boating knowledge or experience ..... he passed !

I believe the Canadian Power and Sail Squadron 11 week Boating course should be a mandtory minimum to acquire this card.

Way too many 25yr boaters on the water. ie 1year experience repeated 25 times.

[Artful Dodger]

We took our test and course through the Power squadron, and at first I wondered at the cost compared to others, and must say we got our moneys worth as they also make you a member of the power squadron for one year and receive the Canadian Yachting magazine, but other than that there purpose is not just to help you aquire your card but open your eyes to other things which are not apart of the regular test. I think that their test and their's only, other than any other organization in boating should have been the ones to offer the tests. I was at the Toronto boat show and the test then was a jock as the people taking the test were being coaxed by the testers.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by dana-tenacity

... There is no statistical evidence that places with licensing/registration are "safer" than those without. End of argument.

Although I doubt (withgout affirmative contrary evidence) your contention that there's no evidence, the arguement (itself) presents a logical fallacy (argumentum ad ignorantiam, or appeal to ignorance"). In this case, we've BOTH expressed unsubstantiated opinions, worth about what they cost (the reader).

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by dana-tenacity

The bureaucracy here in NZ have looked at it on and off over the years and have always concluded it isn't worth the effort. There is no statistical evidence that places with licensing/registration are "safer" than those without. End of argument.

What jurisdiction or country requires a boating license ?

[jackdale]

Artful Dodger

Both Canadian Yachting Association and International Sail and Power Association instructors teach courses on the water. CYA offers the card as separate exam in their courses or through their Spark Start program. ISPA has its own exams which can be administered by instructors. Both are Coast Guard accredited. Neither does pay-if-you-pass.

[boatpoker]

Jackdale : That "accredited " course is pretty light weight stuff. I believe a license should be required and acquiring it should be at the very least as difficult (?) as getting a car license with written and practical testing in "rush hour" ie. A hot, sunny afternoon in Toronto Harbour.

[jackdale]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

Jackdale : That "accredited " course is pretty light weight stuff. I believe a license should be required and acquiring it should be at the very least as difficult (?) as getting a car license with written and practical testing in "rush hour" ie. A hot, sunny afternoon in Toronto Harbour.

I agree wholeheartedly with you. I see a lot of poor seamanship when I out on the water. It ranges from poor anchoring procedures which endangers others in the anchorage, to poor sailing practices, to failure to read / follow control buoys.

BTW - some providers have lost their accreditation.

[Bill Lee]

I think the PCOC requirement is a good idea - at least it gets you to think about some safety issues. Of course, the power squadron course is better. Like all things, the test does NOT (and can't) screen for actual behavior on the water - you'd need a 'sea-test' for that. Despite a requirement for a license AND a road test there's still lots of idiot drivers on the roads. So all that a 'sea-test' would do is ensure someone knew what they were doing THAT day in those conditions - not how they'd always perform... IMHO, I've seen a lot of experienced yet poor boaters. The PCOC is relatively inexpensive. If it screens even 1% of idiots then that's not too high a price....
Cheers,
Bill

[Morganministry]

Oregon has something similar. I think all Oregon citizens are required to take some kind of boating class before operating a vessel in Oregon. I've been inspected by the coast guard twice in Oregon and both times they asked me if I've taken the boating safety class.

To wich I reply "Nope, I'm from California."

Apparently they can't enforce it on people from outside of the state.

Scott

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by Bill Lee

I think the PCOC requirement is a good idea - at least it gets you to think about some safety issues. Of course, the power squadron course is better. Like all things, the test does NOT (and can't) screen for actual behavior on the water - you'd need a 'sea-test' for that. Despite a requirement for a license AND a road test there's still lots of idiot drivers on the roads. So all that a 'sea-test' would do is ensure someone knew what they were doing THAT day in those conditions - not how they'd always perform... IMHO, I've seen a lot of experienced yet poor boaters. The PCOC is relatively inexpensive. If it screens even 1% of idiots then that's not too high a price....
Cheers,
Bill

Can you imagine driving in our cities and on our highways if all that was required to get a "license" was a 10 minute test with no education or practical experience required ?

[stillbuilding]

Most states in Australia have instituted a Boaters Licence achieved after a sit-down paper exam. A money-making exercise of course - another hollow log which government found. Maybe partly driven by ski doos which drove everyone crazy.

Hong Kong has a Leisure Boating Licence. Achieved by 2 hour-long theory exams. For more highly powered vessel a second tier exam achieved by theory, oral and practical exam - not surprising given the volume of traffic through HK waters.

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by stillbuilding

Most states in Australia have instituted a Boaters Licence achieved after a sit-down paper exam. A money-making exercise of course - another hollow log which government found. Maybe partly driven by ski doos which drove everyone crazy.

Hong Kong has a Leisure Boating Licence. Achieved by 2 hour-long theory exams. For more highly powered vessel a second tier exam achieved by theory, oral and practical exam - not surprising given the volume of traffic through HK waters.

So China has something going for it besides milk laced with melamine

[David M]

Certifications mean that you were required to learn a number of things. They reduce the chance, not eliminate the chance of a problem.

Its a matter of deciding if reducing the chance is worth the cost.

Because something is not 100% guaranteed does not make it worthless....like wearing seat belts. There is no guarantee it will save your life but it does help your chances.

[Zednotzee]

Originally Posted by Bill Lee

IMHO, I've seen a lot of experienced yet poor boaters. The PCOC is relatively inexpensive. If it screens even 1% of idiots then that's not too high a price....

I agree. Besides, it would still be your cheapest boat-related expense all year.

Originally Posted by boatpoker

So China has something going for it besides milk laced with melamine

Okay, that's just downright funny!

[Brent Swain]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

Can you imagine driving in our cities and on our highways if all that was required to get a "license" was a 10 minute test with no education or practical experience required ?

Again you compare boating with driving,comparing another vehicle passing you at the equivalent of 160 KMH with boats passing you a half mile away at 20 K, the equivalent of a horse and buggy on the open prairie. There is no comparison. This is the ocean , not streets and highways.Duhhhh!!
They give zero credit for decades of practical experience.
If we shoot thousands of people randomly,we are bound to get a few guilty people, so it makes it all worthwhile? Sounds like your kind of logic.
In France, they have one very expensive license to cruise within 20 miles of the coast, another to cruise a little bit further offshore, another for a bit further offshore, etc etc. and you are required to have fully welded watertight bulkheads on 35 footers, etc etc. This is the start of that kind of thinking, the thin edge of the wedge. Government of the bureaucrats for the bureaucrats. This is only the start. A frenchman I knew got his dive ticket in a couple of weeks on Kerguelan. When he got back to France he met a woman there who had been taking dive training for two years, costing thousands of Euros and still hadn't jumped thru all the hurdles.
Expect "Boater Qualification" to head that way, given time, and Public support for restrictions.