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Old 17-06-2021, 18:04   #31
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
Chris, it happened on our previous boat which was a "repurposed" IOR one-tonner. The original winch layout did not consider that a dodger might someday be installed. When we converted it into a cruising platform and wanted a dodger we relocated the primary winches aft to where the helmsman could reach them, solving two problems at once.

Jim
thanks - you did the right thing which was to move the winch/s

but i can (now) see where in a narrow set of circumstances a ratcheting winch handle might be a useful temporary solution

cheers,
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Old 18-06-2021, 08:54   #32
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

We could easily do that while our motorsailer motorsails to windward while we are in the air conditioned comfort of the pilothouse.
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Old 18-06-2021, 10:13   #33
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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Originally Posted by wingssail View Post
.

So 21 miles, mostly upwind, in 3 hours.

Can your boat do that? Would you even want to?
We usually calculate our dead upwind passages as:
Double the distance direct to windward mark, so 42 miles
Divide that by an average 6 knots boat speed depending on the wind.(6 knots has been our average for the last 50,000 miles, including time drifting in light winds at 2 knots at the equator, occasional knuckle biting sprints of 17 knots, anchoring, & docking).
So we would plan on 7 hours if the passage was going to all be directly into the wind with no long reaches. If there are sections with reaches, our boat speed might increase to 10, and we would get there in much less time, but better to project conservatively.

We recently did a passage in the Bahamas through a narrow channel south of Hopetown with the wind blowing right on the nose. We tacked something like 25 times. Not a problem, since we are self tacking.
No need for knee pads, gloves or lots of specialized winch handles either. Just sail an hour, throw the helm over, go the other way. It's lovely when you find a passage like that with flat water but still have wind.
But I agree with you - it's nice to have a boat that sails well, whether that's because of tacking angles or speed, ease of tacking, or comfort. We hardly ever motor- we only fill up the diesel tanks once a year.
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Old 18-06-2021, 14:14   #34
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

Upwind is our best angle
Zero degrees to the wind @ 7.5 knots.
Best windward vessel we have ever owned (-;
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Old 18-06-2021, 15:24   #35
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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yep, i see that...but on a single speed winch you can simply rotate the winch backwards until your handle is in the right angle again...yes ?

however thinking further, i guess on a two speed winch you could be in the position of having to turn back in the highload direction, which might be a problem for some.

of course it has to be asked why you would ever site a 2 speed winch (ie something used for decent loads) in such a place that you cannot swing the handle properly...but i suppose it can happen

cheers,
Hello Chris, as wingsail summized, we have added a dodger to the boat and have created a couple problems that a ratcheting winch handle could help alleviate.
There are other work arounds which include leading the line to another winch or using an 8" winch handle but a ratcheting winch handle would be nice.
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Old 18-06-2021, 15:29   #36
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

Point to point we seem to average 7.2 knots based on 15,000 miles over the past 18 months.
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Old 18-06-2021, 19:59   #37
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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No. Nowhere near that.
But we did 27 Nm on 3.5 hours with white sails. Consistent reach with a building non breaking swell in below fresh strength. Upwind was a lot lot slower.

Anyway. Researching my next home. Cockpit seats on anchorage liked sailing too.
Any thoughts on Adams13 willing to share?

My thoughts are Swanson, Roberts Offshore, Adams lift board.

Adams should hold its own, it's keelson looks deep quickly then shallow to stern. Ain't interested in tacking alot like your plot.
Weight bias I read as top side hence don't like that but figure a nice chunk such as a storm mobile mooring type anchor can stow low if bilge access allows. Then weight shift to leg preferances. Ain't much, every little bit helps.
Skinny I like, volume cabin should be enough.
Reefing sails early ain't a problem neither.
Reading that they're top sided naturally puzzles me. Guessing strong decks because keelson lead going to dig deep but then cockpit rear gathering momentum of wall hits when systems build scares me.
One big worry I have is I've probably forgotten how to tune a set of sails. Was worrying about selftailing winches but just remembered feel goes to handle. Yet bigger boats do bigger mistakes. Looking around 11 metre too. Room for dinghy.

Any feedback? I'm slow whilst on land is what I hope; going to take a while finding a boat.
We love our Adams13, "Risky Business", she's an aluminium version with a ballasted (2.7tonne) drop keel, (and 6ft1inch headroom), so not standard. Since start 2014 when retired to date have over 50,000naut miles cruising to NZ, Fiji,
Vanuatu and a tradewind circumnavigation. Main has 4 reefs each about 2m deep, and a 5% overlap headsail on a roller. PM me if want to discuss good and bad points further.
Not sure about point of vanishing stability with standard glass version.
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Old 19-06-2021, 09:49   #38
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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We love our Adams13, "Risky Business", she's an aluminium version with a ballasted (2.7tonne) drop keel, (and 6ft1inch headroom), so not standard. Since start 2014 when retired to date have over 50,000naut miles cruising to NZ, Fiji,
Vanuatu and a tradewind circumnavigation. Main has 4 reefs each about 2m deep, and a 5% overlap headsail on a roller. PM me if want to discuss good and bad points further.
Not sure about point of vanishing stability with standard glass version.
Thank you..
I don't just like but viewed internet pictures as a wow, that looks nice, a long natural keelson that develops early and should dive well mating a tapered edge for when knots are up.
Was just jisting hints for later.. probably going with a going south in our Southern Ocean type cruiser instead and miss out on a few or more knots.
I like the look of your vessel and sisters though. Definitely ain't discarding possible purchase. My neighbour has a Adams13. I'll try bump into a conversation with him during summer. It'd be easier. Just thought of that then. Certainly looks like a missile.
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Old 19-06-2021, 10:05   #39
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

Thank you muchly again.
Reefing slabs and circumnavigation described the vessel very clearly here. I like description.

Edit: again.. I'm so slow here.. my ol' friend has tonnes of lead. Was to be used on a shallow keelson vessel but mutually a stuff that, gonna have to beat some someday.
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Old 19-06-2021, 10:07   #40
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

Sorry, but I think you have a mistake somewhere in your original post - you say at the end you did 21 miles in 3 hours, but you said at the top that you departed La Cruz at 12:30 and at the bottom you said you dropped the hook at 6:30 which is 6 hours, not 3. Maybe you meant to say you departed at 3:30, or??? I don't mean to turn this into one of those "A train left Chicago at 9am and arrived at...." - but I read your piece carefully, being familiar with the area and curious about what your point was, and I couldn't help notice the disconnect.
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Old 19-06-2021, 10:21   #41
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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Sorry, but I think you have a mistake somewhere in your original post - you say at the end you did 21 miles in 3 hours, but you said at the top that you departed La Cruz at 12:30 and at the bottom you said you dropped the hook at 6:30 which is 6 hours, not 3. Maybe you meant to say you departed at 3:30, or??? I don't mean to turn this into one of those "A train left Chicago at 9am and arrived at...." - but I read your piece carefully, being familiar with the area and curious about what your point was, and I couldn't help notice the disconnect.
Sorry, jordanbigel, for any confusion. The times are 24 hr time. We anchored at 16:30, which is 4:30PM, but that is still a discrepancy since that is 4 hours not three. However we spent one hour at the start, after leaving the La Cruz marina, with no wind and drifting less than 1/2 mile, so we started sailing on the 21 mile journey at 13:30 (or 1:30 PM) and finished three hours later.

About the point of the post: We had a wonderful sail to windward in rather boisterous conditions, just the two of us oldsters, and we were really pleased about the performance of our boat and ourselves. Not many boats could do as well, and truthfully, very few cruisers want to. But I am an advocate of good performing (ex racing boats) as cruisers and liveaboards and I am always trying to show others how much fun it can be.
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Old 19-06-2021, 11:19   #42
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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...very few cruisers want to. But I am an advocate of good performing (ex racing boats) as cruisers and liveaboards and I am always trying to show others how much fun it can be.
Well, I have done that run many times (or to Chacala, my favorite) and it's true, we all have different ways of doing things. I would have motored that first half hour, I admit.

Frankly, I doubt you are going to ever convince me, or my commanding officer, that drifting in dead air is as relaxing and fun as you find it. The sailing part I am totally down for. Maybe I'm just not old enough yet...

I once left in company with a buddy boat for a 1000nm passage (which happened to cross the equator) with a fresh breeze blowing. On day 3 the wind died and the sea was like glass, the sky as clear as could be. Almost 600 miles to go, and still about 6 degrees South of the equator (the accompanying heat + the very slight swell added up to a recipe for an extended period of "shake and bake") we didn't hesitate to fire up the iron genny - we motored the entire remaining distance and the wind never filled in, not even a puff. Our friends in the other boat had a different plan. We arrived at our destination on day 7, our friends arrived on day 13. They hung out in the middle of the ocean drifting and bobbing for literally 5 or 6 days waiting for wind. I salute him and you for your determination and patience!
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Old 19-06-2021, 11:33   #43
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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The times are 24 hr time. We anchored at 16:30, which is 4:30PM...
Oops. I saw 6:30 - dammit. I guess I am old enough that I am losing my eyesight...
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Old 19-06-2021, 11:48   #44
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

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...On day 3 the wind died and the sea was like glass, the sky as clear as could be. Almost 600 miles to go, and still about 6 degrees South of the equator (the accompanying heat + the very slight swell added up to a recipe for an extended period of "shake and bake") we didn't hesitate to fire up the iron genny - we motored the entire remaining distance and the wind never filled in, not even a puff. Our friends in the other boat had a different plan. We arrived at our destination on day 7, our friends arrived on day 13. They hung out in the middle of the ocean drifting and bobbing for literally 5 or 6 days waiting for wind. I salute him and you for your determination and patience!
Usually we motor in those conditions also, on ocean passages we'll motor at 1100rpm (3knots) just to be moving instead of wallowing, but still saving fuel.

On the day I wrote about we already had the sails up and I didn't want to take them down just to motor a mile or so, I saw the wind coming.
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Old 19-06-2021, 14:07   #45
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Re: Can your boat do this? Would you even want to?

Wing, do what? I lm failing to see anything unusual in your post.
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