Boat Hunting

[anjou]

Over the past 5 months ive viewed several boats.All are mid to late 70s built and all are gruby, dirty, run down, poorly maintained with no sign of home comforts, stained torn upholstery, faded yukky curtains, disgustingly dirty galleys and heads, cabins full of junk and crap, wires hanging down everywhere, water stained bulkheads, dirty brightwork, filthy dirty floors, hatches and ports that are hard to opperate or have broken fastenings. Not to mention cracked and faded gel coat, rusty deck fittings,screws missing from fittings etc. All the boats havent had any updating or TLC since they were launched and as such made me feel seasick even though they were all on the hard.In contrast, ive spent so many hours looking at the pic galleries on CF and seen so many stunning and beautiful immaculate boats. Therefore I can only conclude some owners are dirty barstewards. Im losing the will to live and wonder why some people are happy to live and sail on boats that make me want to puke.Putting aside the lack of hygene, I also have an aversion to the outdated style and materials used, the lack of thought in design and asthetics etc.Are there certain makes of boat which are worse than others for poor styling and construction, is it a case of you only get what you pay for?Are these boats all of a certain era like the 70s and therefore more modern boats are generaly better quality.I was a quality auditor with Sealine boats, and as part of the Brunswick leisure group, we strived to make good quality boats. I got used to seeing new, clean tidy boats but now im looking to buy my own, all im finding are boats that leave me feeling depressed.So, to sum up, ......are these boats like they are because of - AgeCertain type of previous ownersPrice rangemanufacturerWhen you go boat hunting, do you find the same things or do your vendors look after their boats and make an effort to present them for sale.

[Eleven]

I suggest you try MultihullWorld at Emsworth, nr Portsmouth.
I got my thirty yr old boat there and wasn't allowed to view it until the owner finished his tidy up. (Didn't stop me peering through windows of course).
There are usually a few cats there of many makes, all fit for cruising.
If you are stuck for sailing time PM me for day/weekends ON the briny. I'm Southampton based, and in need of working crew until work becomes available again.

[Pblais]

Im losing the will to live and wonder why some people are happy to live and sail on boats that make me want to puke.

Old boats over 30 years don't last long neglected. Once neglected, the owners want to lose them like a kid sister on Saturday night. Some of the problems in old designs were Dark wood and dark fabrics (popular if you can believe that). Narrow beams with few ports are always going to look dark too. They didn't have the materials to make the nice big ports they make today.

You can change things .Fabric and upholstery on a boat does not do well after 15 years - even the good stuff. The modern fabrics and foam are now better than ever and come in all colors not just navy with white ticking. That alone changes the interior look. Quality lighter colors help a lot on older dark wood interiors. Adding updated LED light fixtures can help too. These are things you should expect to need in an older boat unless redone in the past 8 years. Some boats have the really nice closed cell foam and those can be recovered without replacement.

As far as other issues, you should expect a fair amount of work in a 1970's boat. It really won't get much better until late 1980's. I think for the money the late 80's are far better than the 70's for older boats in terms of cost up front plus cost to repair.

You need to reset your price range to match your wants or get used to what you see for sale. You can always keep looking. Have you done any looking t the US boats on Yachtworld. Not that you should buy one in the US but it has the largest number of boats and can give a lot of pictures to view and see what types of boats are out there for sale.

Its better to regret something you have done, than to regret not having done it.

I think you would prefer to have a boat that was yours. It changes how it looks.

[Intentional Drifter]

I second Paul's comments. Anjou, I know you're in the UK so this might not apply, but you might want to look at some of the boats that are in local sailing clubs. I know that one of our local clubs has a fair number of older boats, but they work hard at keeping them in good shape. Occasionally, one of them comes on the market. For example, here's this very nice CS 30 that is a real gem:
Windworks Sailing And Powerboating, Inc (Seattle, WA)

I agree with your sentiments - if the boat looks and smells like a pig pen, lord only knows what's wrong with those things you can't easily see.

ID

[imagine2frolic]

This boat hunting thing can be quite difficult. I have been lucky both of my searches went well. Frolic took about ten looks at other boats until I ran into her. Imagine was a one stop shop. I saw her on the computer, and then in life. With a couple of weeks she was mine.......BEST WISHES in the search......i2f

[Cheechako]

Anjou.... I've forgotten what your budget is, also where are you willing to buy? UK only? With this info more could help...

[anjou]

Once I reveal my budget, some will laugh and say 'what do you expect for the money' but i disagree.I drive a 7 year old wv golf. its done 147000 miles and is immaculate condition with the service schedule stamped up to date.My appartment is in pristine condition with no clutter and you could eat off the floor.So why am I expected to accept that when something is a few years old, its ok for it to be trashed and completely f**ked?I used to have a fetish for William Garden, Formosa type ketches, probably because of the Capt Ron factor. They have at first glance, the old world romantic sailing charm about them. The reality is different, so ive become more realistic and would rather a boat which needs some work, not a total rebuild.You might well knock tupperware but Ive been looking at beneteau's and they have a good compromise of size to space, design, affordability, etc.Ok, so im looking at about 30k Sterling, 32-36ft lOAPreferably Uk based for ease of viewing,transfer both delivery and taxation/paperwork

[Southern Star]

What type of boat are you looking for, Anjou? If it is a cat (as Eleven suggests, above), then what you are likely seeing in the UK from the 70's will be Prouts, Catalacs, Iroquois/Cherokees and some Solaris. All made use of (eventually) saggy vinyl headliners (or even painted, rough frp) and are bound to look tired inside, to some degree, if they have not had a major refit. Ratty rigging and hardware, however, is inexcusable and should steer you clear of any boat.

If you are looking at monohulls, then you are likely to find a number that made use of molded frp headliners and interior pans, which hold up better over the years even if they are initially more austere. On the other hand, the exterior gelcoat on any 30 plus year old boat is bound to be rough unless the boat has been awlgripped (or painted with some other 2 part polyurethane paint) - again, something requiring a substantial 'reinvestment' in terms of both time and money.

It is trite to say that, if you are lucky, you get what you pay for. I am unsure of your budget, but to find a boat in bristol condition may require you to go to something smaller (and newer, or at least substantially upgraded) than you have been checking out, to date.

Brad

[Allan S]

Originally Posted by anjou

Over the past 5 months ive viewed several boats.All are mid to late 70s built and all are gruby, dirty, run down, poorly maintained with no sign of home comforts, stained torn upholstery, faded yukky curtains, disgustingly dirty galleys and heads, cabins full of junk and crap, wires hanging down everywhere, water stained bulkheads, dirty brightwork, filthy dirty floors, hatches and ports that are hard to opperate or have broken fastenings. Not to mention cracked and faded gel coat, rusty deck fittings,screws missing from fittings etc. All the boats havent had any updating or TLC since they were launched and as such made me feel seasick even though they were all on the hard.In contrast, ive spent so many hours looking at the pic galleries on CF and seen so many stunning and beautiful immaculate boats. Therefore I can only conclude some owners are dirty barstewards. Im losing the will to live and wonder why some people are happy to live and sail on boats that make me want to puke.Putting aside the lack of hygene, I also have an aversion to the outdated style and materials used, the lack of thought in design and asthetics etc.Are there certain makes of boat which are worse than others for poor styling and construction, is it a case of you only get what you pay for?Are these boats all of a certain era like the 70s and therefore more modern boats are generaly better quality.I was a quality auditor with Sealine boats, and as part of the Brunswick leisure group, we strived to make good quality boats. I got used to seeing new, clean tidy boats but now im looking to buy my own, all im finding are boats that leave me feeling depressed.So, to sum up, ......are these boats like they are because of - AgeCertain type of previous ownersPrice rangemanufacturerWhen you go boat hunting, do you find the same things or do your vendors look after their boats and make an effort to present them for sale.

Anjou, you just described ALL the things I seem to be looking in a boat. I wish I could get excited over a turn-key boat but I look and find these homeless , decrepit lonely hulls and I want to take them home and lavish the attention on them that they deserve. I am sick.

Allan

[anjou]

Originally Posted by Allan S

Anjou, you just described ALL the things I seem to be looking in a boat. I wish I could get excited over a turn-key boat but I look and find these homeless , decrepit lonely hulls and I want to take them home and lavish the attention on them that they deserve. I am sick.

Allan

Maybe we should swap as all i want to do when i go aboard one of these grotty boats is wipe my feet and wash my hands. I cant understand how someone can own and neglect or worse, live in squallor and filth.I appreciate design and customer expectation have improved over the years, a lot of 70s stuff we thought was hip and cool is actually crap and naff, so saggy head linings, dark stained wood and slit windows, gally counter tops done in tile that cant be kept clean, drapes that dont work, cushions are so thin they compress to nothing when you sit on them etc, go with the 70s territory. i could go on but im sure youve seen it too.I want something thats easy to keep, cheap to keep, makes me feel happy, not depressed by the work that needs doing.

[imagine2frolic]

Have you thought of looking outside of England? If I hadn't bought Imagine I would have gone to Thailand for a Hans Christian Christina. It was 60% of the cost of the same boat in Calif. There was no cruising gear, but $20k would've solved that problem, or less.

There are deals to be had, and in many destinations where they lay. Places where the dreams don't equal reality. Divorces occur, or the boat left behind. I once had to leave Frolic in Cabo to return to the states. There were a half dozen boats in the yard for sale for these very reasons. There are always boats in the northern part of the Sea of Cortez, I think San Carlos?

What about down under where the lb is strong against the Aussie $ ? Then again markj went from downunder to the Caribbean to purchase his boat. The internet is a great tool. You found all of us..........i2f

[Talbot]

Anjou

Suggest you go to Multihullworld in Emsworth and have a look at some of their boats - condition ranges from in need of major refit, to those that have recently had a major refit .

The brokers are very knowledgeable about multis and they definitely have boats in your price range - My recently refitted 9m Catalac went for less.

[anjou]

Originally Posted by imagine2frolic

Have you thought of looking outside of England? If I hadn't bought Imagine I would have gone to Thailand for a Hans Christian Christina. It was 60% of the cost of the same boat in Calif. There was no cruising gear, but $20k would've solved that problem, or less.

There are deals to be had, and in many destinations where they lay. Places where the dreams don't equal reality. Divorces occur, or the boat left behind. I once had to leave Frolic in Cabo to return to the states. There were a half dozen boats in the yard for sale for these very reasons. There are always boats in the northern part of the Sea of Cortez, I think San Carlos?

What about down under where the lb is strong against the Aussie $ ? Then again markj went from downunder to the Caribbean to purchase his boat. The internet is a great tool. You found all of us..........i2f

I hear what your saying and it makes sense. One guy told me Gibraltar is a good place for divorce and marriage saving boats. The loving couple cruise the Med, but she eventually wants to go home and spend time with the grand kids and becomes dissolusioned, then at Gib, they have a day of high seas and bad weather and thats the last straw. He has to chose between wife or boat, ...........poor boat gets advertised and left at the marina.All I can say is, poor guy is with the wrong woman.

[imagine2frolic]

All I can say is, poor guy is with the wrong woman.


This is exactly what I was describing, and your last sentence is so right. I have been through a marriage, and several girlfriends, but always kept the boat! I told Melanie when I met her. The boat will always be #1, and she would be #2, as I would be #3. Her, and I are easily exhangable, but not the boat. To some the boat was a threat. For Mel she understood my desire, and passion for what I do is unshakable.....i2f

[Eleven]

Please don't start that discussion all over again. Lets just hope it never happens to any of us.