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Old 09-08-2020, 06:15   #31
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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Very curious what sealant and the process you used to reseal the lenses on those hatches, and what was the largest hatch?
Hi Wingssail,

As I said, I replaced the lenses of 13 portlights. These are bronze portlights about 5 X 10 inch. I found a good silicone gasket and bought about 50 feet or more. I have some left over as well as a few spare lenses. Twenty perfectly cut, heavy, smoked lexan lenses cost less that $200US. I do not remember the bedding / sealant I used; it needed to be compatible with lexan.
I have not replaced a lens as large as a hatch but I will if it is needed.
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Old 09-08-2020, 08:01   #32
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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Hi Wingssail,

As I said, I replaced the lenses of 13 portlights. These are bronze portlights about 5 X 10 inch. I found a good silicone gasket and bought about 50 feet or more. I have some left over as well as a few spare lenses. Twenty perfectly cut, heavy, smoked lexan lenses cost less that $200US. I do not remember the bedding / sealant I used; it needed to be compatible with lexan.
I have not replaced a lens as large as a hatch but I will if it is needed.
We've used Dow Corning 795, it's easy to work with and bonds well to clean surfaces. It's the same mastic used in the building trades to hold glass in skyscrapers.
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Old 09-08-2020, 09:00   #33
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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In a different thread I posted this. I have a Seawind with twin Yamaha outboards in wells; way cheaper than any monohull engine to maintain. Not to mention the boat spins in it's own length. First time I drove the boat I though this is cheating it is so easy to drive the boat. I have seen both cats and monohulls with what I consider too many heads, mine has a single composting head that costs almost nothing to maintain while lots of monohulls have expensive electric heads that require more to maintain than a composting head. These two things mean no through hulls, no shaft, struts, prop, and zincs that not only cost money to maintain but seem safer to me as well.

Not saying a monohull can't be set up to be easy and cheap to maintain, or that a cat can't resemble a expensive condo more junk than is needed. But there are plenty of cats with outboards that are way cheaper than inboards and I can't really recall any 40+foot mono with an outboard.
My son and his girlfriend converted their 42ft cat from diesels/sail drives to a pair of 25hp high thrust Yamahas. Now they retract clear of the water at the push of a button and are serviceable from inside and can be easily fresh water flushed. Outboards are perfect for cats. Good access is probably the determining factor in the cost of maintainance regardless of the number of hulls if you are paying someone to do it for you. Our shop rate is $110/hr so even what should be a simple job can run you a grand if access is poor which it usually is.
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Old 09-08-2020, 10:27   #34
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

I have a friend who made good living in the Caribbean fixing up windows on cats.


Apparently this is one of the weaknesses of many big brands as he was always busy and never hungry.


b.
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Old 09-08-2020, 10:49   #35
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
I have a friend who made good living in the Caribbean fixing up windows on cats.


Apparently this is one of the weaknesses of many big brands as he was always busy and never hungry.


b.
I canít argue this. The most difficult part of building a catamaran is the deckhouse windows.
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Old 09-08-2020, 10:54   #36
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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My son and his girlfriend converted their 42ft cat from diesels/sail drives to a pair of 25hp high thrust Yamahas. Now they retract clear of the water at the push of a button and are serviceable from inside and can be easily fresh water flushed. Outboards are perfect for cats. Good access is probably the determining factor in the cost of maintainance regardless of the number of hulls if you are paying someone to do it for you. Our shop rate is $110/hr so even what should be a simple job can run you a grand if access is poor which it usually is.
First time a board went out on my 9.9 I had a shop guy come to the boat and fix it, cost just over $US240 including a little over one hundred for the board. Was talking to the guy a couple of slips down who was having work done on his twin Detroit Diesels. He paid $US1,200 each for an oil change. I can easily do that myself with a twenty dollar hand pump and hose I bought for that purpose. I have been on plenty of boats with an inboard where access to the engine required contortions beyond my abilities, especially the stuffing box.

Especially on cats raising the prop out of the water adds an extra knot or two of speed and really cuts down on what you need to do in terms of dealing with metal in the water and the resulting electrolysis. I like my block and pully system to raise my motors, simple and I can fix it myself.
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Old 09-08-2020, 11:23   #37
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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First time a board went out on my 9.9 I had a shop guy come to the boat and fix it, cost just over $US240 including a little over one hundred for the board. Was talking to the guy a couple of slips down who was having work done on his twin Detroit Diesels. He paid $US1,200 each for an oil change. I can easily do that myself with a twenty dollar hand pump and hose I bought for that purpose. I have been on plenty of boats with an inboard where access to the engine required contortions beyond my abilities, especially the stuffing box.



Especially on cats raising the prop out of the water adds an extra knot or two of speed and really cuts down on what you need to do in terms of dealing with metal in the water and the resulting electrolysis. I like my block and pully system to raise my motors, simple and I can fix it myself.


And with the Yamaha 9.9 outboards there is no oil filter and it takes .85 quarts to fill. So we are talking $8.00 per motor and maybe 20-30 minutes per side.
We replaced our Yamaha 9.9ís a year ago. The cost of the motors was $2800 plus tax per motor. So $6,000 for a repower and maybe 2 hours max to pull and replace each motor.
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Old 10-08-2020, 03:25   #38
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

A Lagoon 380 will cost similar to 44ft monohull ( ex berthing and slightly more haul out / antifoul). Catana 42 more similar to 48 mono (ex berthing haul out).
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Old 10-08-2020, 04:01   #39
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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So we all accept that cats are much more expensive to maintain, but how much does this hold true when you compare cats and monos of comparable sizes? So it seems that the general consensus is that a 38-40 cat is about the same amount of space as a 50-54 mono. So how do you guys feel the maintenance costs of the two compare on average? Does the heavier duty rigging, sails, etc of the larger mono exceed the redundant system maintenance of a cat? Or does the cat actually become a better value at that point?
consensus is wrong at least for purchase price. I know this as we were buying new Lagoon 420 and price equalled Benetau 50. Lagoon 400 is like Benetau 46. Maybe things have changed lately as cats got more popular.

maintenence costs will greatly depend on way boat is used. if you have it setup light and nice sailor, and not push much above factory reefing recommendations there will not be lots of engine hours or rigging failures and will be more or less prescribed periodic maintenance only.

If you push it or overload or just motor everywhere, or not use it enough cost can get up a lot.
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Old 10-08-2020, 04:50   #40
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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I have surveyed plenty of cats that are on their second or third set of outboards, where as a good diesel engine will keep on going for thousands of hours.
One issue with this line of thought is over 20-30yrs, you can spend more maintaining that good diesel than simply replacing an outboard 2 or 3 times (Plus I'm betting those on a third set of outboards are either really old boats or were abused).

We had a single outboard we replaced for $5k including installation (original engine was 21yrs old and still ran fine but it was 2 stroke vs a new fuel injected 4 stroke). The equivalent diesel & out drive (it was an alternative option on the boat) installed would run $15-20k to replace in full.

Based on the forum we follow, the cost of 2-3 major maintenance items on a diesel could easily offset the price of a new outboard. Especially when you compare diesel techs vs outboard mechanic prices.
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Old 10-08-2020, 17:24   #41
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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And with the Yamaha 9.9 outboards there is no oil filter and it takes .85 quarts to fill. So we are talking $8.00 per motor and maybe 20-30 minutes per side.
We replaced our Yamaha 9.9ís a year ago. The cost of the motors was $2800 plus tax per motor. So $6,000 for a repower and maybe 2 hours max to pull and replace each motor.
And another 10-15 minutes to pump out the .15 quarts of oil I overfill.
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Old 14-08-2020, 11:15   #42
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

I have learned by watching YouTube that cats attract many more women in bikinis. These are expensive to maintain.
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Old 14-08-2020, 13:43   #43
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

Haha good one loneshark. Like billgewater says, ya gets what ya pays for.
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Old 14-08-2020, 17:13   #44
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

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Originally Posted by nuru05 View Post
So we all accept that cats are much more expensive to maintain, but how much does this hold true when you compare cats and monos of comparable sizes? So it seems that the general consensus is that a 38-40 cat is about the same amount of space as a 50-54 mono. So how do you guys feel the maintenance costs of the two compare on average? Does the heavier duty rigging, sails, etc of the larger mono exceed the redundant system maintenance of a cat? Or does the cat actually become a better value at that point?
Difficult to compare costs by boat's volume, there are many other factors. Two engines, transmissions, rudders etc. are generally twice the cost of a single engine - even if the single is 100HP vs. two 50HP. Many of the costs are related to systems: pumps, plumbing, mechanical structural -- that are way more complex and sensitive in a cat - all that regardless the comparison between the larger mono size to a shorter cat size.
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Old 14-08-2020, 17:14   #45
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Re: Apples to apples cat vs mono maintenance costs

I have owned and done my own maintenance on a Roberts 40ft monohull and a Prout Escale 39ft cat.

The Prout has the internal space of a 55ft mono. A pig to sail but superb in bad weather.

Costs. Berthage. Thanks to my marina having a wider than normal 12m berth, same for both yachts. Travel lift and hardstand. Cat gives me far fewer options and costs about twice that of the mono. Antifoul etc. Cat has less wetted area because its half the weight of the mono. Paint costs about half that of monohull. Engine service costs. Similar for both. Despite twin engines on cat and single on monohull. General maintenance is again much the same. The monohull was steel (still my preference) and needed a lot of surface maintenance to keep rust away. Cat is epoxy glass so easy to maintain but portlights and hatches etc regularly leak so more work there. The cat is strongly rigged and has kept well. Had to replace mast on monohull due to damage from a strong gust.

Overall I think the cash costs are about the same but I do all the work myself and the time cost is much lower on the cat.
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