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Old 08-03-2020, 07:37   #76
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

I opted for a Weems and Plath C-1001 electronic flare on my boat.
The light is white, flashing SOS in Morse code. Day flag included.
It is USCG Requirement 46 CFR 161.013 compliant.
SOS Distress Light with Day Signal Flag


Slug, not trying to pick a fight, looks like you are making the point that a strobe not flashing SOS is not really a distress signal, correct?

Then the issue is the intent of the signal for the user and the interpretation of the signal by other parties.
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Old 08-03-2020, 08:07   #77
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

There is no color white distress . Only the color red may be used to signal distress

There is currently no electric light certified for distress use



A flashing white strobe signifies “ mark me “

At sea you will come across hundreds of “mark me “ white strobe lights , fishing gear

A flashing yellow strobe signifies “ special purpose “ and it’s use can only be determined by consulting the pilot book. Along the coast yellow strobe are always on fish farms or on bouys for restricted zones

The rule states that non standard lights shall be avoided

I avoid them until I feel that my safety is being threatened... then I fire them off
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Old 08-03-2020, 08:26   #78
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Quote:
Originally Posted by slug View Post
There is no color white distress . Only the color red may be used to signal distress

There is currently no electric light certified for distress use

A flashing white strobe signifies “ mark me “
OMG! Really?

I previously proved you incorrect. Please don't spew disinformation biased by your ignorance.

I previously provided context. In the past, Europeans adopted a flashing white strobe to indicate "mark me" or stand clear. This was also adopted in the COLREGS.

I also previously proved that in the US a white strobe (as opposed to a low intensity white flashing light) is a distress signal as specified in the inland rules (US LAW).

I provided you with several links to white distress lights on the market (both in the US and in Europe) when you challenged me.

And also gave you a link to the SOLAS recommendations that suggest white distress lights be affixed to life rafts and life jackets. (WHY...because they are highly visible!)

I also stated that the COLREGS and SOLAS conventions conflict, despite being issued by the same UN subcommittee. But, that's what bureaucrats do.

As for "certified for distress use."

The Weems and Plath C 1001, the Sirius Signal C-1003 "Complies with all U.S. Coast Guard requirements for “Night Visual Distress Signals” as found in the Code of Federal Regulations: 46 CFR 161.013."

Also, the ACR C-Strobe is approved by the USCG and SOLAS.

I could go on, but...

Again...you can ignore all these facts, but please do not provide people with false or misleading information. It is a disservice to those here wanting to learn.
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Old 08-03-2020, 08:28   #79
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

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Originally Posted by Discovery 15797 View Post
OMG! Really?

I previously proved you incorrect. Please don't spew disinformation biased by your ignorance.

I previously provided context. In the past Europeans adopted a flashing white strobe to indicate "mark me" or stand clear. This was also adopted by the COLREGS.

I also previously proved that in the US a white strobe is a distress signal as specified in the inland rules (US LAW), I provided several links to white distress lights on the market (both in the US and in Europe), and also gave you a link to the SOLAS standards that specify white distress lights be affixed to life rafts and life jackets.

I also stated that the COLREGS and SOLAS conventions conflict, despite being issued by the same UN subcommittee. But, that's what bureaucrats do.

Again...you can ignore all these facts, but please do not provide people with false or misleading information. It is a disservice to those here wanting to learn.


MCA notice to mariners


https://www.safety4sea.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/UK-MCA-Life-Saving-Appliances-Recognised-Distress-Signals-and-Advertised-Alternatives-to-Pyrotechnic-Flares-2017_10.pdf
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Old 08-03-2020, 08:57   #80
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

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SLUG...do you understand how CONTEXT can be important?

Your link is useful for UK registered/documented vessels. (Although it expired in 2018.)

US registered/documented vessels need to comply with USCG regs and US Law (even when transiting UK waters).

Vessels registered/documented in other countries must comply with the standards and laws established by their country (assuming they are signatories to the COLREG convention).

The debate is not about whether Pyrotechnics are superior to EVDS (clearly they are), we are discussing the use of white strobes for distress. PERIOD.

But, it seems that in the document you provided....even the Brits may finally be coming around.

"However, for pleasure vessels, seagoing commercial vessels, and most non–seagoing commercial vessels, EVDS may be carried in addition to the required distress signalling equipment and used to identify location or transmit the S-O-S distress signal through a switch mechanism (just as a torch or other light-emitting device could be used). However, the limitations of EVDS devices should be recognised and anyone using them should be made aware of the type and quality of signal being generated."

We probably agree that red flares, or orange smoke signals are vastly superior to EVDS. I would never rely solely on EVDS as a single distress signal aboard my vessel. But again, this discussion is not comparing pyrotechnic devices with EVDS.
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Old 08-03-2020, 09:38   #81
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Sorry

Those are COLREGS rules

A boat can only conform to colregs

Once inside colregs the rules are unknown because every country , every region , every geography has specific regulations

In no regulation that I have ever seen is White used to indicate distress

In no inspection regime that I have had to conform with has an electric light device been required distress signaling equipment
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Old 08-03-2020, 10:24   #82
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Quote:
Originally Posted by slug View Post
There is no color white distress . Only the color red may be used to signal distress

There is currently no electric light certified for distress use



A flashing white strobe signifies “ mark me “

At sea you will come across hundreds of “mark me “ white strobe lights , fishing gear

A flashing yellow strobe signifies “ special purpose “ and it’s use can only be determined by consulting the pilot book. Along the coast yellow strobe are always on fish farms or on bouys for restricted zones

The rule states that non standard lights shall be avoided

I avoid them until I feel that my safety is being threatened... then I fire them off
I think the answer, is for you to just do whatever you feel like doing, and not stress so much, about what other people do.
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Old 08-03-2020, 10:29   #83
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Quote:
Originally Posted by slug View Post
Show me this regulation

Show me any white signal approved for distress

My flag state requires that I carry four white hand flares. See 2.12 on attached.

Here are the flares I bought:

https://www.landfallnavigation.com/i...hand-held.html

They meet SOLAS requirements. Here is the white parachutes flare that also meet SOLAS requirements:

https://www.landfallnavigation.com/i...parachute.html
Attached Files
File Type: pdf safety_matrix.pdf (135.9 KB, 7 views)
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Old 08-03-2020, 11:30   #84
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Quote:
Originally Posted by Capdave360 View Post
My flag state requires that I carry four white hand flares. See 2.12 on attached.

Here are the flares I bought:

https://www.landfallnavigation.com/i...hand-held.html

They meet SOLAS requirements. Here is the white parachutes flare that also meet SOLAS requirements:

https://www.landfallnavigation.com/i...parachute.html

Once again

Red is distress

White is “ mark me “

Be aware ...when you blast off your white parachute flare a sea ..., you are signaling that you are a submarine about to surface
If you observe a white para flare st sea....beware and stand clear
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Old 08-03-2020, 11:43   #85
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

All this technical back and forth is of a certain arcane interest.

But the original topic, which I started, was my complaint that people who use strobe lights and underwater lights while anchored, moored, or docked, are not being good neighbors.

Nothing I've heard in the six pages of posts since then has made the case that they are indeed being good neighbors; those writing in defense sound an awful lot like that neighbor I used to have whose dog barked constantly and whose car alarms were always going off - I think you all know the one.

We politely asked a nearby boat if they could turn their strobe off a couple days ago, and the gentleman was surprised to learn that it bothered anybody, and turned it off right away.

So there is hope.
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Old 08-03-2020, 11:52   #86
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Quote:
Originally Posted by Capdave360 View Post
All this technical back and forth is of a certain arcane interest.

But the original topic, which I started, was my complaint that people who use strobe lights and underwater lights while anchored, moored, or docked, are not being good neighbors.

Nothing I've heard in the six pages of posts since then has made the case that they are indeed being good neighbors; those writing in defense sound an awful lot like that neighbor I used to have whose dog barked constantly and whose car alarms were always going off - I think you all know the one.

We politely asked a nearby boat if they could turn their strobe off a couple days ago, and the gentleman was surprised to learn that it bothered anybody, and turned it off right away.

So there is hope.
Yes indeed

And the answer is that white strobe cannot be confused with a distress light

A white strobe is deployed as a “ mark me “ light

If you feel threatened or feel the need to increase you visabilty you use a white strobe

Whether this is needed st anchorage is debatable

Anchor lights superimposed against a city skyline become invisible because of light pollution making vessel vulnerable to collision
Vessels on the perimeter of certain anchorages would be wise to use whatever means to brightly illuminate the vessel

A strobe is one way to accomplish this
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Old 08-03-2020, 11:58   #87
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Quote:
Originally Posted by Capdave360 View Post
All this technical back and forth is of a certain arcane interest.



But the original topic, which I started, was my complaint that people who use strobe lights and underwater lights while anchored, moored, or docked, are not being good neighbors.



Nothing I've heard in the six pages of posts since then has made the case that they are indeed being good neighbors; those writing in defense sound an awful lot like that neighbor I used to have whose dog barked constantly and whose car alarms were always going off - I think you all know the one.



We politely asked a nearby boat if they could turn their strobe off a couple days ago, and the gentleman was surprised to learn that it bothered anybody, and turned it off right away.



So there is hope.


Ok, honest question from my ignorance. How a strobe pointing to the sails bothered you at night? Was it pointing at your boat?
If the person had them in order to be visible at night, what else could’ve used? In a busy anchorage I would be a bit scared someone cannot see me in complete darkness....
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Old 08-03-2020, 12:04   #88
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Quote:
Originally Posted by Discovery 15797 View Post
OMG! Really?

I previously proved you incorrect. Please don't spew disinformation biased by your ignorance.

I previously provided context. In the past, Europeans adopted a flashing white strobe to indicate "mark me" or stand clear. This was also adopted in the COLREGS.

I also previously proved that in the US a white strobe (as opposed to a low intensity white flashing light) is a distress signal as specified in the inland rules (US LAW).

I provided you with several links to white distress lights on the market (both in the US and in Europe) when you challenged me.

And also gave you a link to the SOLAS recommendations that suggest white distress lights be affixed to life rafts and life jackets. (WHY...because they are highly visible!)

I also stated that the COLREGS and SOLAS conventions conflict, despite being issued by the same UN subcommittee. But, that's what bureaucrats do.

As for "certified for distress use."

The Weems and Plath C 1001, the Sirius Signal C-1003 "Complies with all U.S. Coast Guard requirements for “Night Visual Distress Signals” as found in the Code of Federal Regulations: 46 CFR 161.013."

Also, the ACR C-Strobe is approved by the USCG and SOLAS.

I could go on, but...

Again...you can ignore all these facts, but please do not provide people with false or misleading information. It is a disservice to those here wanting to learn.
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Old 08-03-2020, 18:32   #89
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

Quote:
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My father and my uncle built a nationwide business in the 50's & 60's, including 37 acquisitions that my father led. He taught me something very important - never try to teach a pig to dance, it just makes the pig mad, and you get covered in mud.
Indeed.

Fortunately, I think most people here can read the ACR literature, the US inland rules and US Code, and clearly understand that a large majority of us are no longer British subjects and forced into following arcane rules.

But, at least we all now know that if you see a white strobe light on a boat, first check to see if it is a British flagged ship....and if so...sail in the other direction!
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Old 08-03-2020, 18:47   #90
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Re: Anchor Strobe Lights & Underwater Lights

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Originally Posted by Capdave360 View Post
My father and my uncle built a nationwide business in the 50's & 60's, including 37 acquisitions that my father led. He taught me something very important - never try to teach a pig to dance, it just makes the pig mad, and you get covered in mud.
Quote of the thread.
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