RIP Chavez

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Bash

There's a legitimate cruising interest here if folks would put aside their pro/anti-socialist soapboxes. Venezuela used to be a great place to go during hurricane season. In addition to being a gorgeous destination, it's a straight shot from Panama, and a source of cheap fuel. Unfortunately, yachties keep getting mugged there, officialdom is corrupt, and scarcities have become commonplace. Far fewer cruisers have visited Venezuela this past decade than in the decade before.

Let's hope the new administration can clear things up. And let's hope we can continue to have intelligent conversations on CF.

I entirely agree... but... if others come out with statements that kick me off I'll respond.. but abusing Chavez the way some folk have is not helpful at all... if anything the disrespect shown will make things worse...
And folk who say he was surrounded by guns should look closer to home...
what was it last time in the UK... 250 SS and their weapons had to be let in from the US to cover Olympic attendance.
Wots wrong with our guns...

[zboss]

Lets get this absolutely clear.... he did not raise anyone out of poverty by any means other than theft. He stole from US companies by appropriating our property and handed it out to thugs in his country as gifts to keep them in check. The only reason his people "came up out of poverty" is the price of his stolen oil skyrocketed - money that was ours by legal agreements between two countries. Anyone with a retirement account should be outraged at his actions. He reached into your pocket and pulled bills out. He might as well have taken formula from your baby.

He has clear ties to the terrorist regimes of Syria, Sudan, and Iran and was working closely with them to help the Persians influence policy just south of our border. Can you imagine if he had been able to put nuclear missiles on Venezuelan soil?

Good riddance.

[markpierce]

Why is it that many socialists love dictators?

[Ocean Girl]

Humanity has the stars in its future, and that future is too important to be lost under the burden of juvenile folly and ignorant superstition.
~~Isaac Asimov

I hope to cruise there one day, hope to get to know the culture, volunteer my nursing skills, hopefully laugh with them. I wish the country all the best.
Erika

[Jimbo485]

Originally Posted by boatman61

And folk who say he was surrounded by guns should look closer to home...
what was it last time in the UK... 250 SS and their weapons had to be let in from the US to cover Olympic attendance.
Wots wrong with our guns...

LOL. I guess I was that "folk".....? I am in my birth country now and there are bugger all guns here. You making assumptions, boaty? Yes, i am sure those British guns are fine for killing! So why did the Brits let the USA guns in?

S American politics and economics are pretty interesting. You have to live there a decade or so and spread yourself around the continent before you can get your head around it. Outsiders lump the S American countries together, but they are so, so different. Not too many people are ignorant enough to think Singapore and Myanmar are similar because they share a continent. But it still surprises me when they think, for example, Bolivia and Chile are similar. "both countries are in S America, must be the same 'cause I don't know any better.".

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by markpierce

Why is it that many socialists love dictators?

There's Socialists on CF....

Shock.. Horror... Where...??

[SaltyMonkey]

Dear Chavez:

Now that you have moved on to "warmer climates", and had motivated the lower classes to support you under a calculated camouflage of carefully budgeted "free bread and entertainment", do you think the people could possibly have that 2 billion dollars back that you stole and lined your families bank accounts with? Not to mention, now, the nepotistic opportunities you handed out to your family as bonuses since 1999?

Nothing personal, Il Duce, but we sure would like Venezuela to be a welcoming country again, and its people respected instead of swindled through crafted rhetoric and emotional manipulation.

[MarkSF]

It is rather telling that he was on record listing the Syrian and Libian presidents/dictators as his best friends.

He was definitely of the same ilk as Fidel Castro, with the same belief - that if everyone in a country is grindingly poor, you have equality and hence, the ideal state.

[John A]

All of his improvements to his country were so great that Hugo had to travel to Cuba to be treated by doctors he could trust.

[sww914]

I have very good friends from Venezuela. They were a part of the very few, very rich before Chavez. They fled the country right before the election, after the locals got together and robbed them, cleaned out their whole ranch. You need to remember that Venezuela, like Cuba and so many other currently socialist or communist countries once had two classes, the very few at the top, a bunch at the bottom, and nothing in-between.
Eventually the bunch at the bottom get pissed off.

[David M]

Originally Posted by Bash

Let's hope the new administration can clear things up. And let's hope we can continue to have intelligent conversations on CF.

Amen brother.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey

Dear Chavez:

Now that you have moved on to "warmer climates", and had motivated the lower classes to support you under a calculated camouflage of carefully budgeted "free bread and entertainment", do you think the people could possibly have that 2 billion dollars back that you stole and lined your families bank accounts with? Not to mention, now, the nepotistic opportunities you handed out to your family as bonuses since 1999?

Nothing personal, Il Duce, but we sure would like Venezuela to be a welcoming country again, and its people respected instead of swindled through crafted rhetoric and emotional manipulation.

I nthink I'm gonna abandon this thread... before I get banned from CF...
But... before I do...
Salty... go to the UK and chat with the 3+ million or so pensioners who got screwed over by Private Pension Funds set up by US owned corporations who decided to go bust and go home with their money.
Stop chuckin rocks... there's glass houses everywhere and the only place you guys have a good reputation is at home..
Oh... and OZ... coz your boats are cheap...

[MarkSF]

Originally Posted by sww914

I have very good friends from Venezuela. They were a part of the very few, very rich before Chavez. They fled the country right before the election, after the locals got together and robbed them, cleaned out their whole ranch. You need to remember that Venezuela, like Cuba and so many other currently socialist or communist countries once had two classes, the very few at the top, a bunch at the bottom, and nothing in-between.
Eventually the bunch at the bottom get pissed off.

Good points but think the key to creating a successful economy is wealth creation, not theft. Once you have robbed all the money off the rich, the poor are still poor, and are likely to stay that way.

Cuba would be a very good example.

[zboss]

If there are any cruisers in Venezuela right now - you better bug out.

[SaltyMonkey]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Salty... go to the UK and chat with the 3+ million or so pensioners who got screwed over by Private Pension Funds set up by US owned corporations who decided to go bust and go home with their money.

Boaty, there is no platform for a comparison of crimes as if to try and justify one crime over another (making it legitimate and just). You take each case to trial on an individual basis.