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Old 29-01-2022, 21:09   #1
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Caribbean boat management ideas?

Hello all!

I’m a long time lurker and new member here. Our family has owned about 8 sailboats in last 15 years ranging from two man racing dinghies to 30 foot cruiser. Although I have been sailing and crewing for a long time I’m just now finally taking a formal training course to get bareboat certified.

We are a family of four (two teens)looking at buying a mechanically sound 10-12 year old boat for Caribbean use primarily. Trying to budget from 50-150k depending on boat size/condition. I’m leaning towards Bavaria/Beneteau/Jeanneau brands In the 37-44 range. I like destinations USVI/BVI/Antiqua/Grenada. I work for an airline so travel is free if space permits.

Ideally I would like to have use of the boat for 10-12+ weeks a year and have minimal expenses. It would be great if I could put it in a “lighter use” or “second tier “ charter program to help generate some revenue towards dockage/maintenance, etc.

I have read horror stories of many of both large and small companies taking advantage of clients and trashing boats or otherwise causing problems.

Anyone have good or at least decent luck with this and any particular companies or individuals that might be able to help? I’m ok with owner involvement on my part from standpoint of website, etc. One of the brokers I spoke with in the phone this week indicated he may be able to help manage boat if I try this approach.

I’m making a trip this week to look at boats in Grenada and Antiqua, possibly Virgin Islands also.

Thanks for any guidance you may be able to provide on this subject. I found a few names on forum search function but most of it was quite dated information.

Thanks

Rick
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Old 30-01-2022, 03:52   #2
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Rick.
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Old 30-01-2022, 05:20   #3
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

The charter market in the Caribbean has changed a lot over time and a monohull in the range you are looking at is no longer as popular for charters as in times past. So even with a 2nd tier charter company you are not going to see an significant revenue - the fixed costs of owning a charter vessel won't be offset by income. There is a lot of competition in the Caribbean charter market and many others have had the same thoughts as you are having.
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Old 30-01-2022, 06:25   #4
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

I am the ideal boat charter customer and I’m here to discuss my thoughts on just what you’re getting into so that you enter into this with eyes wide open…. I have about a decade worth of experience sailing in the Pacific as well as the Caribbean - though this is on daily/weekly charters and maybe if you add up the days on the water, it’s only one or two months. I have ASA certification. I have a completely clean driving record, and a job that involves lots of responsibility and risk management. I’ve owned a 30 foot boat for 1.5 years now with no accidents with my boat. Probably another two months worth of experience on the water on my boat.

I recently went to the Caribbean and chartered a 45 foot boat. In order to further reduce the risk of anything going wrong, we even hired a captain for the first few days. I wanted to gain experience manoeuvring a 45 foot boat, so high asked the captain to help us as we were leaving the dock. we even had someone on the dock helping with the lines. Despite all this, as we were leaving, one of the fenders got caught between the boat and a pylon due to a timing issue on my end being late to give power to the engine and being unfamiliar with the boat. This bent the lifeline stanchion. Later during the trip, I left one of the cupboard doors unlocked while we were at sea and out came all of the plates shattering all over the floor. Despite our best efforts to clean it all up, I’ll bet you a few pieces got into the bilge and may even end up in the bilge pump.

At the conclusion of the trip, I realized that if this much could go wrong in just one week with a responsible party at the helm and a captain, this much are even worse should be expected to happen at least once a month when chartering your boat. Plus all the mechanical wear and tear from the boat being under near continuous use. I still have thoughts of putting a boat into charger and then eventually moving a board with my family, but if I do so, I will do so knowing that that boat is not “my boat” and I would approach it the same way I would approach a random boat on yacht world at the end of its time in charter.
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Old 30-01-2022, 07:25   #5
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

We have kept our boat in the Caribbean for more than 20 years. It has NEVER been chartered. I have seen the damage charters do to boats! It is fairly easy to find very professional yacht management in most of the islands. Ask around the yards and the marina and the same names will start coming up. We have kept Callisto in Granada, Martinique, Sint Maarten, the BVI's and Antigua. Sint Maarten remains our favorite due to the availability of marine tradesmen, parts, no duties and air connections. The people who look after Callisto when I am not onboard check the lines and bilges, coordinate various repairs, get the boat cleaned up before our arrival and take care of the boat laundry after a trip. I do the oil changes, most of the maintenance and pickle the water maker after a trip. I usually haul her in mid July and splash her back in the water in late October early November. Since Irma, we pull our sticks for the summer haul. I am always amazed at how the boat just seems to take a nap when we are gone and wakes up ready to when we get back. We have really enjoyed this style of cruising and love having the boat in the Caribbean.
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Old 30-01-2022, 07:42   #6
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

Callistov42,
Roughly how much do you reckon it costs, per annum, to look after your boat?
Thx
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Old 30-01-2022, 07:42   #7
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

Our favorite summer layover location was the south coast of Grenada. A good place to hang out but also with excellent boatyards and marine trades. Also boat "concierges" were easy to find - And far enough south that hurricanes are very rare (though quite unpleasant when they do happen)
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Old 30-01-2022, 07:50   #8
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emoyeni View Post
I am the ideal boat charter customer and I’m here to discuss my thoughts on just what you’re getting into so that you enter into this with eyes wide open…. I have about a decade worth of experience sailing in the Pacific as well as the Caribbean

At the conclusion of the trip, I realized that if this much could go wrong in just one week with a responsible party at the helm and a captain, this much are even worse should be expected to happen at least once a month when chartering your boat. Plus all the mechanical wear and tear from the boat being under near continuous use. I still have thoughts of putting a boat into charger and then eventually moving a board with my family, but if I do so, I will do so knowing that that boat is not “my boat” and I would approach it the same way I would approach a random boat on yacht world at the end of its time in charter.

Thanks guys, eye opening information for sure!
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Old 30-01-2022, 09:25   #9
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

Ask yourself this: why do you need to own the boat for occassional usage?

Most people over estimate the time they will use a boat. My educated guess (decades in the industry) is that 10-12 weeks is optimistic.

Do yourself a favor, avoid huge headaches/expenses, and save money...charter instead: when, and where, you want. Walk away and the end of a nice sailing vacation with nothing to worry about.
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Old 30-01-2022, 12:03   #10
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

If you really do use a boat for 10 - 12 weeks a year then the managed charter company is a good deal. I chartered in the Caribbean for 10 years before deciding to buy a Leopard 45 with Sunsail. I have found it is to be a good deal both for the sailing time I get out of it but also financially. I get about ten weeks of use from my contract with Sunsail which, if I were to pay the going rate would amount to about $100,000 a year. I get the use of 20 bases around the globe so I don't have to sail my catamaran from the BVI to the Med. My last boat with Sunsail was destroyed by Hurricane Irma and insurance paid me back $360.00 for a boat I initiallty paid $540,000. On top of this I got about $4,500 a month for the use of my boat for 4 years equalling $250,000. I ended up with a gain of about $80,000 in the four plus years my boat was in charter. I felt the biggest reason by far to buy and put a boat into charter was the $500,000 use I recieved of boats around the world.
The negative part, of course, is the abuse your boat will take at the hands of less than experienced charter guests aboard your boat. But if you plan on only 10- 12 weeks a year of use you will end up with big bills for moorage, insurance, and upkeep every year along with the limited sailing grounds you have compaired to those of the larger charter companies worldwide bases.
I'm in the same position as you wanting to sail warm waters about 10 -12 weeks a year. You will end up in a positive chash flow if you go with a contract with a large charter company (and the iceing on the cake is $500,000 worth of time you get on a sister ship at bases around the world).
I may be sounding like an ad for the charter industry but it has worked well for me. I do plan on taking my boat out of charter in about two years and sail for a about three months throughout the Caribbean before putting her into secondary charter probably in either the BVI or US Virgins.
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Old 30-01-2022, 12:17   #11
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

DougMc, I pay $200 a month for normal boat watching, taking the laundry in (I pay for the cost of the laundry separately) and simple repair coordination. I pay the guys who clean her above and below decks before each trip about $100. We get to the boat 5 or 6 times a year for a couple of weeks each trip. We probably could charter for about the same money but I like it being MY BOAT with my tools, my spares. We keep clothes and toiletries on board so I really do not have to carry much back and forth. It is a fairly complex boat with a generator, air conditioning, water maker, ice maker, etc. It used to be difficult to find charter boats equipped like that. I think it is getting more common now. We have been doing it this way since the mid 90's.
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Old 30-01-2022, 13:55   #12
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

Quote:
Originally Posted by callistov42 View Post
DougMc, I pay $200 a month for normal boat watching, taking the laundry in (I pay for the cost of the laundry separately) and simple repair coordination. I pay the guys who clean her above and below decks before each trip about $100. We get to the boat 5 or 6 times a year for a couple of weeks each trip. We probably could charter for about the same money but I like it being MY BOAT with my tools, my spares. We keep clothes and toiletries on board so I really do not have to carry much back and forth. It is a fairly complex boat with a generator, air conditioning, water maker, ice maker, etc. It used to be difficult to find charter boats equipped like that. I think it is getting more common now. We have been doing it this way since the mid 90's.
So $200/mo for the watch. What about does the haul out/in and dry storage cost? We pay about $2000 for hauling and winter storage (6 mo) of a 41ft boat in NJ. Is your Caribbean storage about the same?
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Old 30-01-2022, 15:39   #13
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

Hurricane storage on the hard in Sint Maarten is about $500/mo plus the haul and splash, pressure wash and pulling the sticks. That adds another $1500+. Jolly Harbour Antigua, that has a really nice storage yard was a little less.
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Old 30-01-2022, 17:06   #14
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

This is all great information. Still thinking about options here.

If I decide to go for it, how old is “too old” a boat to charter? I have found some pretty nice 2010-2012 models in my price range. I could go even cheaper and get back into (a well maintained) older boat from around year 2000-05, those I would worry about less if damaged or torn up by clients.

But I have to wonder if people would want to rent a year 2000 model even if it was clean?
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Old 30-01-2022, 18:00   #15
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Re: Caribbean boat management ideas?

Maybe you could look into a syndicate of some kind.
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