Warning to Channel Sailors -- Warships on the Loose

[FilBrown]

Originally Posted by Sofie B

Reading our local paper,

"The Kutznetsov was accompanied by the Kirov-class heavy missile cruiser Pyotr Velikiy, the Vice Admiral Kulakov and Severomorsk destroyers, and several supply ships, Sputnik news reported. The BBC said a submarine was also part of the fleet.

The Royal Navy's Type 45 destroyer HMS Duncan and Type 23 frigate HMS Richmond set off from Portsmouth on Tuesday to shadow the Russians from the Norwegian Sea into the Atlantic"

The Admiral Kutznetsov was belching black smoke, may need to fix that engine,

The UK Navy have always escorted foreign navy vessels of any country through the channel. However this time was a little more embarrassing....

I was on Southampton water when HMS Duncan left port and promptly broke down. Two other navy escort ships also had technical problems.
Not very impressive....

[delmarrey]

Originally Posted by FilBrown

The UK Navy have always escorted foreign navy vessels of any country through the channel. However this time was a little more embarrassing....

I was on Southampton water when HMS Duncan left port and promptly broke down. Two other navy escort ships also had technical problems.
Not very impressive....

Were they using Lucas electronics?

[weavis]

Originally Posted by delmarrey

Were they using Lucas electronics?

Engines by Austin.

[bustermaw]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Just about now, a Russian task force including an aircraft carrier (Admiral Kuznetsov) and a huge battlecruiser (Peter the Great; together with her sister ships, the largest operational surface combat ship on earth), and various escorts, shadowed by several Royal Navy warships, will be entering the Dover Straits to transit the English Channel on their way to escalate the situation in Syria.


I think we can be sure that none of these vessels will be broadcasting AIS


Anyone sailing in the channel might want to keep your radar on, and keep a sharp watch. Methinks the bridge of Peter the Great is not going to pay much attention to Rule 8

How dare those awful Russians sail in international waters .
Obviously an invasion force .
I wonder if those former Russian Baltic states tell their children the same thing about the American tanks charging up and down the Russian border or
do Chinese boats warn people about American fleets arrogantly sailing up and down the south China sea's .
Good grief !

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by bustermaw

How dare those awful Russians sail in international waters .
Obviously an invasion force .
I wonder if those former Russian Baltic states tell their children the same thing about the American tanks charging up and down the Russian border or
do Chinese boats warn people about American fleets arrogantly sailing up and down the south China sea's .
Good grief !

Well, the Baltic States are now in NATO, so the scary stories they tell are about Russians, not Americans!

But the point is different -- a large naval force moving through our playground, represents a very serious collision avoidance situation. Just a navigational warning from me, not a political statement!

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Well, the Baltic States are now in NATO, so the scary stories they tell are about Russians, not Americans!

But the point is different -- a large naval force moving through our playground, represents a very serious collision avoidance situation. Just a navigational warning from me, not a political statement!

I was just going to ask that we keep it sailing not politics. I've had enough of politics with our elections coming up.

[Eric50]

On the other side (continental) of the channel, I cannot ensure that our navy was more brillant than the mighty Royal Navy. if I consider my experience in the french navy construction and inspection...
The budget is the main issue, as we have the second most extended maritime area in the world to cover and very rare vessels to cover all of it. Most of them are outdated, obsolete, we use to have 6 large submarines, we only have 4 nowadays, and so on.
I am afraid that, as european, the only chance we have (had?) was to create a single european army with a cost spreaded over the 27 countries, inducing a larger budget and a potential as large navy than USA or china ???
I know, I am a dreamer, and the brexit is may be the sign of the end of EU ?
We lost the seas guys

[boatman61]

Temporary hiccup.. one of the inherent flaws of the NATO Pact.. Europe abdicated personal responsibility to the USA..
Hence the piss taking slackness of many countries with regards to maintaining their armed forces in the way they should have.. instead diverting funds to create the farce called the European Union where they (Germany/France) bribed smaller countries with generous handouts if they signed up..
Sadly the UK followed suit under both Labour and Tory Governments whilst at the same time signing up for costly and futile foreign adventures such as Iraq and Afghanistan and supplied its fighting men with inferior, faulty and sub standard equipment.. but hopefully with Brexit the early signs are that a change is on the way.. the last thing we need is another Chamberlain spouting the 'Peace in our Time' bullcrap that saw Hitler roll through the pathetic armies of Europe in less than 6 months.
Lets just hope that its not mere 'Window Dressing' but the real deal for as an Island Nation we need a strong Navy to act as a deterrent once again..

[Eric50]

I agree that EU is totally f.. up..although it gave peace up to now after centuries of war.
It is like that because of politicians and bureaucrats, but if we ignore the simple fact that size matter, as European, each single european nation alone cannot challenge anymore the big powers, as USA, (Russia?) or China.
Islanders always think their island first (in all the island in the world it is the same mindset, whether it s a big or a small one).
I am not quite sure that UK alone will have again the budget to be able to build and maintain a navy powerful enough to protect your nation from the future threats...
France cannot be blamed to have left NATO took care of its protection, as we get rid of NATO in the 50' and build our own nuclear force (air, sea and land), up to recently when we joined it again.

[boatman61]

Today we need a different Navy.. the days of big ships is past now we have no Empire to manage.. even destroyers are to big..
Frigates would be sufficient for most tasks abroad.. and a strong force of fast patrol boats armed with missiles surface to surface/air.. also a good midi submarine fleet for local waters.. technology today means more can be fitted into less so multi tasking is much simpler.
Leave the big nuclear sub's scattered far out to sea to threaten from a distance..
Lets be honest.. half dozen to a dozen jet bikes with skilled riders, armed with missiles could have wreaked havoc/chaos on that ancient 'Armada' in the Channel.. the times have changed and Prestige ships are history..

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by boatman61

the days of big ships is past now we have no Empire to manage.. even destroyers are to big..

Oh dear, in that case should I put an advert up on CF:

For sale:

2 x new aircraft carriers but not cat and traps, so vertical take off only.

6 x Type 45s, could do with a couple of Beta engines being installed

7 x Astute Subs, missiles a bit wonky, one needs a new rudder and one left the conning fin on Gib last year.

PX considered for a couple of big ribs or a drone.

Pete

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Oh dear, in that case should I put an advert up on CF:

For sale:

2 x new aircraft carriers but not cat and traps, so vertical take off only.

Oh for a Harrier Jump Jet Mk 3..

6 x Type 45s, could do with a couple of Beta engines being installed

Yeah.. they're a load of crap.. didn't have those problems with the original Daring Class Destroyers.. still have fond memories of my time on HMS Dainty (but Deadly)

7 x Astute Subs, missiles a bit wonky, one needs a new rudder and one left the conning fin on Gib last year.

Oh for the Shipyards of yesteryear..

PX considered for a couple of big ribs or a drone.

Pete

That's how we lost an Empire.. the Politicians decided they were Generals and Admirals and shopped at the Pound Shop..

[Eric50]

A friend of mine spent years working in China, one thing he learnt is that you cannot beat number, the smaller we will be, the weaker we'll be too !

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by boatman61

That's how we lost an Empire.. the Politicians decided they were Generals and Admirals and shopped at the Pound Shop..

There's someone in the USA now who knows more than the generals! :smile :

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Eric50

A friend of mine spent years working in China, one thing he learnt is that you cannot beat number, the smaller we will be, the weaker we'll be too !

Having served with 200+ other men.. all of us sitting on one big target, numbers is what I'm talking about.. one of todays missiles can do as much damage as a salvo from both 4.5's from an old Daring Class Destroyer.. now if you take those same 200 men.. stick em all on fast 1 man vessels with 4 missiles each.. that's one hell of a lot of targets the enemy has to hit to stop an attack and the odds of a successful attack increase expontentially..
I'm a great believer in Guerrilla style warfare.. small force, hard strike..