Schengen Overstay

[double u]

btw: upon arrival in the US for a distributor-conference of one of our suppliers we were f... fingerprinted! (wonder what would have happened if our visas hadn' been in order...)
I'm sorry to have to write:
during our peregrinations we had been hassled so often & so intensly by little envious s...-bureaucrats that I see not without a certain satisfaction that "my political entity" is now reciprocating all those "welcomes" to a certain degree!

[Polux]

Originally Posted by Brob2

That is utterly ridiculous. Switzerland is still a huge draw for tourists, particular skiers. When I talk with my friends about travel and our annual ski trips the only drawback ever mentioned regarding Switzerland is the franc, never anything else, including immigration.

Yes, Swiss is a beautiful country with a lot of wild protected regions and magnificent scenery. I have also the utmost respect by Swiss citizens and Swiss government that was able to maintain a tiny country, with three different cultures, independent through the centuries.

"Tourism is a key source of Switzerland’s income... tourism is the sixth biggest export industry, creating 4.3% of Swiss jobs in 2013."

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/tourism-today/29054498

I disagree with the opinion Dockhead expressed regarding Immigrants not having an important role on the Swiss society and development.

On a recent interview Rosita Fibbi that is a main Swiss researcher in what regards immigration (PhD in political science, she teaches sociology of migrations at the University of Lausanne. She is also responsible for the project and member of the coordination of the Swiss Forum for the Study of Migration and Population at the University of Neuchâtel.) said : "I believe that Switzerland won the lottery with the Portuguese..... Switzerland could not function without the Portuguese." She also referred that recent opinion pools showed that the image of the Portuguese is good among Swiss citizens.

And no, she is not Portuguese neither she has Portuguese origins. The information on which she bases this statements has origin on a study "The Portuguese in Switzerland" that she made and published, mandated by the Swiss Federal Department of Migration in the context of integration policy.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

I think you are confusing taking their job seriously with being difficult.

Also, they are busy watching you for signs that you aren't what you say you are. It's actually gotten much better. In the past all they knew is what they read in your passport. Officers were skilled at reading people and would pull people out for further investigation based on your reactions. If you were nervous or gave conflicting answers, they would pull you out.

With modern technology, they already know who they need to check in more detail before the flight takes off. They still watch for signs but if you don't fit a profile (yeah, it's a dirty word but it works), it's just a cursory review. (Example: last year, I was flying in and out of EU on separate tickets. The airline wasn't going to even give me a boarding pass until I could show that I had a flight departing the EU. I wasn't even going to get to the gate let alone land and make it to C&I at the destination.)

Not saying any of the officials are being difficult, they are just so grim, serious and unwelcoming. Perhaps they see (and it could be correctly so) that coming across to the passenger in this way will elicit a nervous response in the guilty and help identify the criminals.

I was pulled out of line in the US Customs once, wearing a suit and traveling with my wife and teenage daughter. Was about as un-nervous and anyone could be and had not yet even interacted with any agents since I was about 50 back in a long line. Got the third degree from the agent just as a random pick.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Polux

. . .

I disagree with the opinion Dockhead expressed regarding Immigrants not having an important role on the Swiss society and development.

. . .

You're confusing me with someone else.

Immigrants have played a big, and mostly very positive role in the development of probably all countries on earth, certainly all European ones.

Doesn't mean you can't have bad consequences if you get your immigration policy wrong and fail to attract those immigrants with the most to contribute.

I predict that within our lifetimes, as the demographic sag starts to bite advanced countries, there will be intense competition between countries for skilled and educated immigrants, and immigrants with various special talents, with even bonuses paid.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

You're confusing me with someone else.
..

You are absolutely and utterly right. I am sorry.

Chala on the post quoted you and I misinterpreted the one quoted with the one that was posting.

Originally Posted by chala

Non-sens.
That Area (Swiss) you live in as pretty much been wrecked by over immigrations and definitely not attractive to tourism.
Only immigrants would be hurt. 260 000 Portuguese’s, 250 000 Albanians, 16 000 Turks and so on are only there to take advantage of the high value of the Swiss francs but contribute little to Swiss prosperity and more to a lower quality of life for primordial Swiss.
When you take in consideration the mess that the CE is in, there is nothing clever about that.

[Barra]

Originally Posted by double u

let's boil it down Barra: yours is clever ('cause no worries to you), our's is stupid ('cause it's working to your disadvantage)
anybody ever showed up without their previously obtained visas???
anybody ever could not show funds the Oz/Nz/Us authorities considered "sufficient" for the intended stay? ...clever systems, o so clever...

You have no logic again -

ALL countries require proof of sufficient funds to obtain a visa (schengen included).

ALL countries require Visa before entry though for some countries under treaty it is negotiated that this may happen on arrival. (Schengen included)

No Double U Australias Visa policy is just in line with the rest of the world. Your system that you seem to oddly take such a personal pride in is at odds with best practice.

And this from you -

"during our peregrinations we had been hassled so often & so intensly by little envious s...-bureaucrats that I see not without a certain satisfaction that "my political entity" is now reciprocating all those "welcomes" to a certain degree!"

says it all really. Ive been screwed over so Im glad visitors to my country get screwed over too.

Zero respect for your opinions after that little insight. Your compatriots dont deserve the migrant mess your "entity" is in but Ill take some satisfaction that you do

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by ErikFinn

While as an EU-citizen I have not had to lose hair in EU when moving from one country to another, but I do agree there is something rotten in the system when these terrorist attacks seem go on and on, latest one yesterday in

Terrorism is still way below the levels we had pre-Schengen...

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by skipmac

Not saying any of the officials are being difficult, they are just so grim, serious and unwelcoming. Perhaps they see (and it could be correctly so) that coming across to the passenger in this way will elicit a nervous response in the guilty and help identify the criminals.

Their role is not to be the local tourist board. If a cop pulls you over for speeding, do you want them laughing and joking as they hand you a ticket?

Yes, they use physiological methods to elicit reactions but as stated previously, it's far less than it used to be.

Grew up in the Detroit area and used to cross the bridge to Canada regularly. They would frequently ask questions to trip you up.

We had spent the winter bouncing around about a half dozen destinations (including not only cruising but work and a couple of vacations) with multiple stops in a few over 6 months. He did the standard, "where did you travel?" After rattling off the general itinerary that took 5 minutes, I offered to pull out the tracking spreadsheet if he wanted actual dates, he laughed and told me to move along it was already all in his system.

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by chala

Non-sens.
That Area you live in as pretty much been wrecked by over immigrations and definitely not attractive to tourism.

As someone who lives there I can tell you that the reality on the ground is nothing like what you paint here. Switzerland is actually a lot more successful in properly keeping their foreign population active than most European countries.

Only immigrants would be hurt. 260 000 Portuguese’s, 250 000 Albanians, 16 000 Turks and so on are only there to take advantage of the high value of the Swiss francs but contribute little to Swiss prosperity and more to a lower quality of life for primordial Swiss.

Schengen actually has zero to do with migration. Those Portuguese (who are by the way generally nice and hard working people) came already to Switzerland before Schengen. Most of the Albanians are actually Kosovar's that fled violence. And the Turks make good pizza...

[double u]

Barra: please let me state passionately:

I take exactly zero pride in most of what our politicians do, least of all agree with their "immigation"-"policies" & Ivery much least of all want to see any cruisers whatsoever hassled anywhere, least of all in europe!
I am sorry to have used the word "satisfaction"!
there are just two points that I would have liked to make:
1.during our travels common courtesy kept us from complaining to people about bureaucratic hassles their country subjected us to - here everybody apparently does so openly to all the world withou any knowledge about what hassles their own country subjects the arriving cruiser to
2.a standard response that we heard fellow-cruisers with a lower frustration threshold get from citizen of hassling countries was "you gotta abide by the laws, we can make any we want!" (I seem to recall this "shut-up-&-comply!" attitude from SSCA - clean wake -...) - these smart-ass-replies still rankle, apparently...

[chala]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Immigrants have played a big, and mostly very positive role in the development of probably all countries on earth, certainly all European ones.

Doesn't mean you can't have bad consequences if you get your immigration policy wrong and fail to attract those immigrants with the most to contribute.

Have, mostly and fail to attract those immigrants with the most to contribute.
So true and also valid for Australia.

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I predict that within our lifetimes, as the demographic sag starts to bite advanced countries, there will be intense competition between countries for skilled and educated immigrants, and immigrants with various special talents, with even bonuses paid.

Our lifetimes? Past our lifetimes I doubt. Some countries will fall by the wayside, likely that China will extent up to Australia. We will see more dissident fighting governments. In other words Aleppo or the fall of Rome revisited.
London with Sharia law and no pubs, how will that go with the British?
Middle East migrants getting used to pork, sauerkraut and beer festivals?
Primordial Swiss accepting the votes of Cantons with high rates of recent naturalisations?