Greek Tax! - MERGED 4 THREADS

[Barra]

Originally Posted by Palarran

Barra, so what your saying is "Business as Usual" Sounds great to me. I only hope that there are still a lot of cruisers who stay out of Greece because of this tax in order to have more space for us.

As an FYI, I never was charged the transit log tax yet. It will be around 20 months when I return to get mine re-issued. I wonder if they are saving it up or have forgotten about it.

Yep for us at least it seems business as usual with the transit log. The TL tax is collected 3 monthly in arrears so you will have a nice bill waiting for you before you can get your departure stamp from port police. I paid for 6 months even though im in greece for 8 and a bit months. next PP stamp and i will get another bill as i understand it.

beneteau your confused? that makes a few thousand of us! yes i have to provide a crew list as skipper but that isnt just a piece of paper its got a stamp on it from the PP or customs wont accept it. the farce is the PP wouldnt give me the stamped crew list for customs to accept without me providing the transit log which customs was holding onto until they saw a stamped crew list. it would have gone in an endless loop but a helpful captain stepped in and chewed a few underlings out....

ahh well back in the water and no officials to deal with for a month or so thank god!

[EllesBelles]

The majority Greek people have suffered a lot in the last 5 years from the greed and fault of a minority of Greeks (and people from other countries) who took advantage of them, made out like bandits, and left the common people holding the bag. This new tax on cruisers will keep many away from Greece, or limit their time there, which will further hurt the common Greek people, because there will be fewer cruisers spending money in Greece. It's a short-sighted decision, and my hope is that the numbers of cruisers will go down enough this year that the Greek politicians take notice and repeal this tax.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by EllesBelles

The majority Greek people have suffered a lot in the last 5 years from the greed and fault of a minority of Greeks (and people from other countries) who took advantage of them, made out like bandits, and left the common people holding the bag. This new tax on cruisers will keep many away from Greece, or limit their time there, which will further hurt the common Greek people, because there will be fewer cruisers spending money in Greece. It's a short-sighted decision, and my hope is that the numbers of cruisers will go down enough this year that the Greek politicians take notice and repeal this tax.

While these sentiments are fine, the tax is primarily designed to reach those keeping their boats in Greece long term, ie 12 months or more. Not visting cruisers.

Dave


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[EllesBelles]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

While these sentiments are fine, the tax is primarily designed to reach those keeping their boats in Greece long term, ie 12 months or more. Not visting cruisers.

Dave

but Dave, if that were so, why would Greece have per month taxes. Wouldn't they structure tax that only if you are in the country for over X period, you'd owe the tax. Instead, they will tax you and let you pay on a per month basis.

I think tax will push cruisers to go to Turkey instead.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by EllesBelles

but Dave, if that were so, why would Greece have per month taxes. Wouldn't they structure tax that only if you are in the country for over X period, you'd owe the tax. Instead, they will tax you and let you pay on a per month basis.

I think tax will push cruisers to go to Turkey instead.

Because the Greeks were concerned that introducing a long term only tax, would cause a on mass departure of Greek resident boats. Hence there had to be a proportional tax to catch this. The primary driver behind this tax is that it's a wealth tax, there have been similar initiatives to tax private planes and expensive cars. This is all at the behest of the Troika, which is forcing Greece to raise additional tax revenues as fast as possible. Hence the introduction of such crude taxes.

In practice I ultimately think this tax will run foul of the free movement of EU goods and possibly modified like they had to do in Spain.

Dave


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[Barra]

We are berthed in Hydra today -

on my port an 84 foot stink boat
on my starboard a 110 footer
on the north mole an even bigger one

the port is full to capacity with the weekend athens crowd and we are the smallest at 42 feet (and one of just 3 cruising sailboats)

the weekend boats are all crewed but thats not helping the local unemployed as they are nearly all phillipines- cheaper i guess.

on this evidence if the tax is targeted at the tax dodging rich then its far far too small - they spent more on fuel to get here for just one night!

[dlymn]

One night in Monaco during grand Prix 1200 euros. Three weeks cruising from Rome to Santa Maria di Leuca 1000 euros in also ran Marinas and little access to sheltered anchorages. A month in the Ionian 300 euros. Plenty of readily accessible anchorages, plenty of rarely custom policed villages, even when the customs are there 7 euros a day, a few big marinas with all the services when you need it. Most accessible seaside towns have clean stone paved quays with shops and taverns a few meters away. Even with the tax it's still a good place to sail and we all know what the rest of the Med is like for cruisers who just want to take it easy sails up and motor off.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by dlymn

One night in Monaco during grand Prix 1200 euros. Three weeks cruising from Rome to Santa Maria di Leuca 1000 euros in also ran Marinas and little access to sheltered anchorages. A month in the Ionian 300 euros. Plenty of readily accessible anchorages, plenty of rarely custom policed villages, even when the customs are there 7 euros a day, a few big marinas with all the services when you need it. Most accessible seaside towns have clean stone paved quays with shops and taverns a few meters away. Even with the tax it's still a good place to sail and we all know what the rest of the Med is like for cruisers who just want to take it easy sails up and motor off.

+1, on that dlymn, given you'll be paying 100 euros a night in many places along the western med, in high season, the greek "tax" is not a bit imposition


Ah , I was never even able to get a berth in Port Hercule during the GP. " on the vhf the answer was always something like "Désolé, Monsieur, je n'ai rien pour un petit bateau", I slunk away in shame.....

dave

[weavis]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Ah , I was never even able to get a berth in Port Hercule during the GP. " on the vhf the answer was always something like "Désolé, Monsieur, je n'ai rien pour un petit bateau", I slunk away in shame.....

dave

thats funny.

[jckb]

I have just updated New Greek Cruising Tax | CA to reflect the big relaxation in Port Police reporting which was introduced on April 14th with law 4256.

JimB

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by jckb

I have just updated New Greek Cruising Tax | CA to reflect the big relaxation in Port Police reporting which was introduced on April 14th with law 4256.

JimB

Good to see the PP getting gradually taken out of the equation, about time. Still can't see why any EU boats have to check in with them on first arrival. You'd think these formalities could be done at a marina office.

ITs seems very unfair for under 12m metre boats doesn't it . This size includes some very popular smaller cruisers, that will find 400 shekels v expensive

dave

[weavis]

Originally Posted by jckb

I have just updated New Greek Cruising Tax | CA to reflect the big relaxation in Port Police reporting which was introduced on April 14th with law 4256.

JimB

Thanks for this.
Turkey is beginning to look really good.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by jckb

I have just updated New Greek Cruising Tax | CA to reflect the big relaxation in Port Police reporting which was introduced on April 14th with law 4256.

JimB

Thanks! Some doubts regarding this:

"PP permission is no longer needed when arriving in harbour...The port police should otherwise only be contacted if there is accident or injury at sea..
Apart from local fees for electricity, water, and lines ashore, it is not yet clear what other fees will be due, or who will collect them.."

This means that if a Port has no water or electricity or if you don't take water or electricity there is no need to contact Port Police regarding papers or paying the usual Port fee?

[beneteau-500]

Water and elec come under the control of the local council now if you go too poros there you will find a very large greyed haired man who works for the council he will charge you 6 euros per nite for water elec no mooring fees charged the on syros finikas you will be charge 10 euros a nite for water (up to 200 litres then x amount there after ) and elec iOS no marina fees council run you go to travel ferry ticket office and purchase a key to the value of either 5 10 or 20 euros which buys water and elec

[Polux]

So, no need to do paper work anymore at each port? If water and electricity are not needed there is nothing to pay? It seem too good to be true.