Vaccine Certification Restriction of Travel

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by cyan

Mike, I think this keeps coming up because so many people misunderstand vaccines. Within my own family with many advanced degrees there is even some misconception. The US CDC has a nice introduction to basic epidemiology, but it's not everyone's cup of tea.

The one basic concept that often gets missed is that a vaccine for a contagious disease like this covid is different than a vaccine for a disease that is not contagious, like malaria. Much different. I think it is unfortunate that the same word, vaccine, is even used for both.

There is no concept of "herd immunity" for a mosquito-borne parasite. The vaccine Mosquirix has an effectiveness of ALMOST 50% in some places. ONE person has a better chance of staying healthy, but there is no community-wide benefit. (other than maybe one less sick person in the hospital) You might get a similar benefit by using bug spray. There is no chance of eradication of malaria by vaccine. ONE 4-shot course of Mosquirix helps only ONE person. That's it. Full stop.

Covid is much different. It is contagious. These new vaccines target this CONTAGEOUS disease. The goal is eradication. No more covid-19 in the world. One person getting inoculated will benefit the ENTIRE community. It is much different than protecting one's self against malaria. It is protecting the community. I previously posted the equation for this herd immunity threshold. It can be done, as has been done with other contagious diseases before this. If enough people join this noble group, the disease goes away. Eradication. That's what we all want, no?

There is community wide benefit from being vaccinated by all the mosquito vectored viruses.

Covid and malaria both need a vector be transmitted. In the case of malaria the virus is transmitted from an infected person to a female mosquito when she bites and draws blood and the virus in the blood of an infected person and then later she bites an uninfected human and delivers the virus with her bite. The guy mosquitos do not bite humans and are not vectors.

So if the human population is protected from infection by vaccination, or by natural immunity from prior exposure and recovery, then there is less potential for humans to be a co-vector of the virus to a mosquito which then becomes a parasitic vector.

If a human is vaccinated for Sars-cov-2 then they are foremost protected from becoming severely ill from the virus but to date it is not proven that the vaccinated human is immune from being infected and protected from being contagious, a.k.a. a vector for Covid. The infected human is the vector for Sars-cov-2 transmission, lets hope the virus does not become a mosquito transmitted disease, that is all we need to finish up 2020.

Ditto, for Zika and dengue fever, yellow fever, chikungunya and West Nile virus which are all human to mosquito to human transmission systems.

[cyan]

Originally Posted by Montanan

There is community wide benefit from being vaccinated by all the mosquito vectored viruses.

Covid and malaria both need a vector be transmitted. In the case of malaria the virus is transmitted from an infected person to a female mosquito when she bites and draws blood and the virus in the blood of an infected person and then later she bites an uninfected human and delivers the virus with her bite. The guy mosquitos do not bite humans and are not vectors.

So if the human population is protected from infection by vaccination, or by natural immunity from prior exposure and recovery, then there is less potential for humans to be a co-vector of the virus to a mosquito which then becomes a parasitic vector.

If a human is vaccinated for Sars-cov-2 then they are foremost protected from becoming severely ill from the virus but to date it is not proven that the vaccinated human is immune from being infected and protected from being contagious, a.k.a. a vector for Covid. The infected human is the vector for Sars-cov-2 transmission, lets hope the virus does not become a mosquito transmitted disease, that is all we need to finish up 2020.

Ditto, for Zika and dengue fever, yellow fever, chikungunya and West Nile virus which are all human to mosquito to human transmission systems.

I stand corrected on malaria. Thanks.
It should be noted that the phase 3 tests for one of the vaccines did include early data on transmissibility with weekly tests. A figure of 60% reduction was published. No doubt we will learn more soon.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by cyan

I stand corrected on malaria. Thanks.
It should be noted that the phase 3 tests for one of the vaccines did include early data on transmissibility with weekly tests. A figure of 60% reduction was published. No doubt we will learn more soon.

Indeed, the limited data that I noted from Moderna was that there was fewer percentage of positive test results for the Covid virus of those who were vaccinated versus those given placebo. So hopefully we will see reduced community spread from persons that are vaccinated in addition to the personal benefit of deriving protection for the person that is inoculated from the adversities of the disease.

Hoping that by this time in 2021, that the community spread is greatly reduced and greater "new normalness" can be achieved wherein we have less risk and restrictions. Albeit I perceive the disease will be endemic and it will take a long time, years, for the entire world be return to the new normal of its existence.

All the best, everyone.

[Montanan]

Pondering this,

[Thumbs Up]

Originally Posted by cyan

.....The vaccine Mosquirix has an effectiveness of ALMOST 50% in some places. ..........

Mosquirix is a scandal that should go on the list of crimes against humanity. You wouldn't know from looking at these websites though:
https://www.gavi.org/gavi-statement-...andidate-rts-s
https://www.theglobalfund.org/en/new...vaccine-pilot/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTS,S

I think that if we made CEOs and board members (and perhaps even share holders) of large corporations criminally responsible for their company's crimes the world would be a much better place!
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/ful...49475520916978
https://www.bmj.com/company/newsroom...cal-standards/
https://archive.hshsl.umaryland.edu/...=1&isAllowed=y

[deathcruzer]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I assume you're looking in the mirror while writing this.

And yes, you are proving to be one not worth conversing with.

I’m all broken up about that....my life is in ruins....

[deathcruzer]

I think when everyone talks about effectiveness you have to remember this vaccine has just hit the ground....In my humble opinion its far too early to tell...give it a few years then we will see.

[waterman46]

Originally Posted by NPCampbell

Technically, in an outbreak, those who won't take the vaccine are only a threat to those that haven't taken the vaccine. Since I plan on taking the vaccine I don't give a damn what they do just as long as I don't have to pay for their medical care.

We should all care a lot that everyone gets the vaccine ASAP. On a humanitarian scale, the vaccine prevents untold suffering. And you will have to pay for medical care of the un-vaccinated. In the long run, hospitals stay in business by charging those who can pay to cover cost of uncollected bills from those who can't pay. To say nothing of the huge tax increases we can all look forward to, for funding the Covid relief bills. And if you need care of any sort, you may not be able to get into a hospital overrun by un-vaccinated Covid patients.

[waterman46]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Ahh.!!!
Trolling again.. Brexit or if we were still in the EU the elites will always jump the queue.. Another wasted post..
Just look at the saviors of America jumping to the Frontline of the Vaccine line.. Biden, Pelosi and others.. meanwhile Kamala Harris states..
US VP-elect Kamala Harris said that Biden-led administration will provide 'free' COVID-19 vaccine for all after a 'safe & effective' vaccine is available.. and to date does not trust Trumps vaccine.
Makes one wonder if all these pillars of **** are really just getting a Placebo..

Very disappointed that the otherwise promising Harris seems to be publicly expressing such ignorance about the current vaccine's origins and safety. There is enough distrust, for valid reasons, among people of color without her fueling baseless conspiracy theories.

[El Pinguino]

Oh dear... three month old news misquoted by Fox....
What she actually said...
'In an interview excerpt broadcast by CNN on Saturday, Harris said Trump had a track record of suppressing expert opinion about the coronavirus pandemic and she worried that might happen again in the case of a prospective vaccine.

"I would not trust Donald Trump," Harris said, saying she would be convinced of the efficacy of a vaccine only if someone credible were vouching for it as well.'

People... please try to keep up with the herd....

Me .... I would not take Trumph's word for anything at all...ever....

[DomPerignon]

Enough talking and more walking.
As soon as my name comes up the list I will get that vaccine vial and put it up at auction. Starting bid $100.
Just pm me .

[Mike OReilly]

Thankfully, an increasing number of Americans say they will take the vaccine:

[Davy J]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

.... I would not take Trumph's word for anything at all...ever....

So what are you saying......... you won't take the current vaccine or not..??

They said there wouldn't be one by the end of the year, yet here we are....

Did he not say that.....

[chrisr]

Originally Posted by mikereed100

I have not read past this post because there really is no need to. As a front line health care worker I was one of the first to receive the Phizer vaccine and could not get it fast enough. I cannot express the relief I feel now that I don't feel like I'm risking my life and those of my family just by showing up to work. It saddens me when my patients and neighbors explain to me that Covid does not exist and that the vaccines are part of a vast conspiracy whose aim is...I don't even know.

I urge people here to get their medical information from their doctor and medical science and leave social media for birthday greetings.

[chrisr]

Originally Posted by DomPerignon

Enough talking and more walking.
As soon as my name comes up the list I will get that vaccine vial and put it up at auction. Starting bid $100.
Just pm me .

fortunately (or unfortunately, depending on your point of view), it doesn't work like that...

cheers,