Vaccine Certification Restriction of Travel

[Vasco]

Am I missing something? It seems after being vaccinated you can still contract covid 19. And you can carry and spread it. You may be slightly affected or asymptomatic but in the final analysis you can still be a spreader. So it only protects the vaccinated and will do little to stop the spread. Will we then still require a test (negative) to travel?

[Eigenvector]

Originally Posted by Vasco

Am I missing something? It seems after being vaccinated you can still contract covid 19. And you can carry and spread it. You may be slightly affected or asymptomatic but in the final analysis you can still be a spreader. So it only protects the vaccinated and will do little to stop the spread. Will we then still require a test (negative) to travel?

Which of the vaccines are you citing? You realize they are all based on different technologies?



Provide a link that ends in .gov or .org

[cyan]

Originally Posted by flyingfin

I am old school, will wait for the dead virus Sputnik V vaccine to arrive. But will probably need to leave the US to get it! Not enough money to be made by big Pharma, so the Canadian and US governments wont let it in. Hopefully we can get it in Bahamas, Mexico or BVI

Mmm. There are other "old school" vaccines also awaiting trial results. Sputnik V has yet not completed the all-telling phase 3 trials, so to single that one out right now as your choice is a bit early. There are claims of good efficacy which is highly disputed (impossible) without phase 3 results, and they are not playing by the rules regarding the trials. (double-blind, etc) You can wait for Sputnik V, but based on what? Certainly not accepted test phase 3 results because there are none yet. The anti-Big Pharma thoughts might have merit, but why base your actions solely upon such things? Saving $25 bucks on your shots seems trivial.

Around 95% efficacy for the two US-authorized messenger RNA vaccines (Bio-N-Tech/Pfizer and Moderna) is quite an amazing number. The big concern with mRNA has always been the over-active immune response. After 10s of thousands of Phase 3 volunteers, it only looks like an occasional allergic reaction is the issue.

The Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine is not so conventional either (DNA with a monkey virus vector), but the technology was already used with the Ebola vaccine. The efficacy results vary wildly between low dose/standard dose results (better) and standard dose/ standard dose results. They sort of averaged this and presented a "70%" result, which has been quite criticized.

Personally, I'll take the mRNA shots and hope to quickly forget 2020.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/l...661-1/fulltext
https://www.statnews.com/2020/11/10/...-vaccine-race/
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...9-vaccine.html
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/l...709-X/fulltext

[Eclectic Always]

Originally Posted by DomPerignon

Your employer will force you to get vaccinated to come to the office.
You will not be allowed in any public events, sport , theater, concerts anywhere there’s a crowd without vaccine passport. That is forced vaccination.
Your children will not be allowed in school without vaccine passport , that is forced vaccination.
You will not be allowed to fly or ride any type of public transportation without vaccine passport, that is forced vaccination.
You will not be allowed across any borders without a vaccine passport, that is forced vaccination.

On the contrary. You’re not being forced at all. You’re being given the choice.

If you want to work for that employer, it’s a condition of employment. Given your posts, I’d assume you’re 100% on board with at will employment, so that’s a fit for you if you’re logically consistent.

If you want to send your kids to public school, society may decide that kids need to be vaccinated for Covid just like they are a host of other diseases.

If you want to travel to a country that requires vaccination and don’t want to get vaccinated, you’ve decided that going to that nation isn’t worth that much to you.

Your call, but expecting society to bend to your will instead of the other way around is absurd. Maybe you’d be happier hanging with Ammon Bundy and crew?

[apirate]

I didn’t start cruising full time to stay in the United States. That being said, if getting the vaccine means we can cruise into foreign ports as normal, I’ll happily get the shot.

Both the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines have been highly tested and are shown to be safe. Besides, as sailors we take many risks to live this life. What’s one more?

[barnakiel]

That 'free man' comment above.


Well, the shots I got as a kid (11 types) nobody asked me either. We get most shots before we can say 'hey'.



The yellow fever was obligatory when we sailed in Panama and Brazil. You did not have it, you did not transit. So hey hey free man, stay home (or use Maghellan Straits).



The Covid one (or ones) - note that for a long long time there will not be enough to make them obligatory. There will simply not be enough to go round.


I bet med staff will get them up first, also care givers in old people's institutions, then maybe police people, fire fighters, cab drivers, public bus drivers, teachers maybe, etc.


So I do not think it will be ever obligatory.


The first one we have here (US stuff, Pfizer I think the name) has plenty of side effects. Doctors do not give it to anybody with any kind of allergy by now.


I have a doctor friend here he says they also do not give it to very old people anymore. (I am in Spain).


Our area got (unconfirmed 50k sets). We are 2 million people population here.


barnakiel

[sailorboy1]

If you dont want the corvid vaccine, or any of the others, don't. I get them to protect myself from those like you and it isn't my responsibility if want to get sick.

[Alistair242]

Originally Posted by cooper1991

I have no plans to risk my life with an untested vaccine but it seems like the powers that be will give us a choice (a) take the vaccine, get a certification card and travel wherever you like (b) don't take the vaccine and you can't leave your country. It is an assumption that the covid PCR tests/isolation periods will be phased out putting more pressure on taking the vaccine.

This is without looking at the deaths, palsy and other vaccine side effects so far and not considering the views that there's a global strategy of de-population.

I want to buy a boat. I refuse to take an untested, possibly dangerous vaccine.

For liveaboards and world cruisers, does anyone share my concerns, or are they groundless?

Which vaccine will be untested? Most of us have taken many vaccines over our lifetimes. Surely these will be no different in terms of safety when made available?
The worlds most qualified people are focused on developing safe and effective vaccines to combat this virus. They will be safe and effective. Not sure I would jump straight into the Russian or Chinese versions but those made available in Europe, the USA, other parts of Asia and other developed countries should be fine.

[barnakiel]

Sorry my post is spaced double. It is not intentional just the interface does it.


barnakiel

[AKA-None]

I believe there already are vaccines that are considered required.
I’m more concerned that pharma isn’t sharing what was paid for by the public to get more made across the world

[S/V Illusion]

Originally Posted by cooper1991

I have no plans to risk my life with an untested vaccine

I wouldn't call a vaccine "untested" which has been tested on at least 30,000 people thus far. Your personal choice is your own but please don't refuse the vaccine which has been thoroughly tested and risk being a burden on the health care community by getting infected because of an uninformed opinion.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by DomPerignon

Quantas already announced they will require proof of vaccination to be allowed onboard. That is forced vaccination.

[CarlF]

There obviously is confusion. The truth is that two weeks after you get the first shot of the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines your chances of testing positive for Covid or giving it to someone else become extremely small. It becomes even smaller after the 2nd shot.

Businesses in the US have always been able to choose who to have as customers (except for the nine specific types of discrimination - sex, race, age, disability, color, creed, national origin, religion, or genetic information ). Vacination status is not on the list so private business can do as it wants. It's called free enterprise.

And other countries can have any rule they want before admitting visitors. The US prohibited Chinese from entering the country when Covid broke out. Whether or not that helped, most Americans thought that was a good idea.

[Dsanduril]

Originally Posted by Marinarius

...Currently the vaccines have only been shown to reduce the severity of illness for those who contract covid-19....

Originally Posted by er9

unless my understanding is wrong or not up to date, getting the vaccine doesn't stop anyone from getting covid even those vaccinated. ...

Originally Posted by Vasco

Am I missing something? It seems after being vaccinated you can still contract covid 19. And you can carry and spread it...

I am clearly missing something. Very, very curious where this idea comes from? The whole point of a vaccine is to prevent people from getting and spreading a disease. Pretty much the definition of the word.

There is the idea of a transmission blocking vaccine that only stops you from spreading the disease, but none of the current crop of Covid vaccines are TBVs.

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by DomPerignon

Quantas already announced they will require proof of vaccination to be allowed onboard. That is forced vaccination.

Sorry, mate, but no one requires you to use Qantas. Qantas is only one airline. You are allowed to choose others.

However, the restrictions countries have for people coming in from what I'll call pandemic hot spots, those will also have freedom-limiting quarantine restrictions, and sometimes, severe penalties for not following the rules.

Sort of like CF. We have community rules, too. Failure to comply leads to loss of account access.

Ann