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Old 17-04-2020, 13:18   #1
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Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

I still have some hope that I can go and live off anchor for a few weeks this summer in Turkey and need to be thoughtful of my water usage. I know when I am in the marina, I go through a considerable amount of water but I cannot afford to do that at anchor.


I am wondering if I can keep the boat and myself clean after going ashore by seimming back to the boat. Will saltwater clean the virus off of a person like washing with soap and water would do?
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Old 17-04-2020, 13:27   #2
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

Get soap that works in salt-water.

Anyway, if it's just a few of you and there's nothing potentially contaminated on the boat, you only need to wash your hands rigourously when you return from being among people.
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Old 17-04-2020, 13:39   #3
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

No, because the soap breaks down the lipid layer surrounding the virus, and sea water doesn't do that. However, you can wash in salt water using any detergent, and that should do it, I think. Don't really know. Use about 1 c. fresh water to rinse your hair and body afterwards.

You can also wash dishes in salt water. If they air dry, they'll have salt on them. You can either sacrifice towels, which will eventually require washing, or some fresh water to rinse them. I rinsed them.

If you have pressure water. Brush your teeth with toothpaste, then only put a little in the glass to rinse. Never leave water running.

You can save a lot, by doing the dishes and your body in salt water.

On our 30 footer and our 36, we used to carry a jerry jug full of water, in case we ran out. Five gallons will get you quite a long way. In the hot places, we got by on 2 qts./day per person. Almost all of that was drinking water plus a morning pot of coffee and tea per each.

It helps some people to relegate a set amount to a solar shower, and consider that your only shower water. Light rinse after last swim of the day, only.

Ann
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Old 17-04-2020, 14:47   #4
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

Add a salt water washdown pump off your engine raw water supply. Use the cockpit as a shower stall for saltwater bathing, soap and hair wash, then finish up with a final rinse using a gallon jug of freshwater. Punch holes in the jugs cap to make a hand held shower - you can live for quite a while off your freshwater tankage.
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Old 17-04-2020, 15:28   #5
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

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Originally Posted by JPA Cate View Post
... However, you can wash in salt water using any detergent, and that should do it ...
Ann
Indeed.
Most dish-washing liquids (ie: Joy) will lather in salt water.
However, lather isn't really required for cleansing.

Most soap lather is artificially created (foaming agents, like sodium lauryl sulfate), because of customer demand, not because it is needed for cleaning.
It is the slip and friction that carries the dirt, and germs away. Scrubbing you hands creates friction, which helps lift dirt, grease, and microbes from skin.
On a psychological level, people like to see something happening, but all you’re seeing is soap molecules trapping air in spherical pockets. Trapped air in pockets doesn’t clean. The soap molecules in the water are what’s cleaning.
As evidence of this, automatic washing machine powders contain foam suppressants, to prevent the machine filling with suds.
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Old 17-04-2020, 15:36   #6
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

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Indeed.
Most dish-washing liquids (ie: Joy) will lather in salt water.
However, lather isn't really required for cleansing.

Most soap lather is artificially created (foaming agents, like sodium lauryl sulfate), because of customer demand, not because it is needed for cleaning.
It is the slip and friction that carries the dirt, and germs away. Scrubbing you hands creates friction, which helps lift dirt, grease, and microbes from skin.
On a psychological level, people like to see something happening, but all youíre seeing is soap molecules trapping air in spherical pockets. Trapped air in pockets doesnít clean. The soap molecules in the water are whatís cleaning.
As evidence of this, automatic washing machine powders contain foam suppressants, to prevent the machine filling with suds.

Interesting.


Similar idea - It's entirely possible to make antiseptics that don't sting, but then people complained that they didn't think it was working.
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Old 18-04-2020, 03:51   #7
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

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Interesting.
Similar idea - It's entirely possible to make antiseptics that don't sting, but then people complained that they didn't think it was working.
Indeed. Another example come to mind.
P&G spent millions developing a colorless, odourless, cheap-to-manufacture liquid, that could be sprayed on a smoky blouse, stinky couch, old jacket, or stained car interior, and make it odourless.
The original Febreze deodourant product had no scent. Proctor & Gamble had to add a perfume, to make the product sell.
Febreze sold poorly, until P&G realised that people become accustomed to smells in their own homes, and stop noticing them, even when they are overpowering (like the smell of several cats in a single household). The marketing then switched to linking it to pleasant smells, and good cleaning habits instead, which resulted in a massive increase in sales. Only after the product became well established, in the marketplac,e did the marketing go back to emphasising odour elimination (it's entire raison d'Ítre) properties as well.
Marketing – the Febreze story | The Geekrebel Blog
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Old 18-04-2020, 05:17   #8
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

We were once offshore and about a week into the delivery when everyone begins to smell bad - so we had a "one kettle challenge". Each of us got to use one kettle of boiled (hot) water to get as clean as possible.

I washed my then-short hair, shaved my legs and washed my entire body.

(I won.)

It's all about sequencing... and using a washcloth!
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Old 18-04-2020, 06:02   #9
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

In the Army we were taught to use a steel pot (helmet) full of water to shave and wash with, it can be done of course, just isn’t fun
Then later on in the Desert we used baby wipes, and I hate those, they don’t really clean.
Finally I gave up and set up a shower with camo poles in a tripod and a shower bag which was a canvas bag with a sheet tin shower head, but worked better than you would think. WWII device probably
We washed our clothes with a waterproof bag, a military version of a dry bag.

All that nonsense is long gone now, even the Army finally realized that a real shower and laundry is such a morale booster that they are common place now.

Too late for you now I guess, but we wouldn’t cruise without a watermaker. With a watermaker we use a phenomenal amount of water, and in my opinion it’s a real morale booster to not have wash your hair with a 1 L bottle of water or go several days without a shower. Even on the small passages we do, we shower every night as long as the sea state isn’t real bad of course, but getting clean both cools you off tremendously and allows you to sleep much better, who sleeps well covered in dry sweat and stinking?

So while there are ways to really save water, it’s really a luxury to not have to.
One way to save is after you wash the dishes in salt water, use a spray bottle to rinse them off, the spray bottle uses very little water but will actually rinse.
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Old 18-04-2020, 10:20   #10
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

I just watched an episode of Sailing Uma from before their head remodel. They used a pump spray bottle. They type you use to spray insecticide or spray water seal on a wooden deck.

Seems like a good idea since you can control whether you get a mist, spray or stream from the wand. You can also budget your water by only putting what you're willing to use in the bottle before the shower.

They fill it with hot water from the tea kettle.... all the comforts of home. I'm tucking this idea into my future feature list. It beats just using a wash cloth.
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Old 18-04-2020, 10:48   #11
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

Lived for more than a year washing down with sea water pulled from the ocean with a bucket and soap. Would rinse off with a pot of fresh water if I felt the need but mostly just dumped a bucket of saltwater on me after sudsing up. Took our first fresh water shower in Papeete after we had to leave the Marquesas to renew our 6 month visa, felt weird.

We typically spent a couple hours everyday snorkeling so really didn't need to rinse off to be clean. As others have said, you do need to use soap to kill the Covid virus. The virus has an oily exterior protective covering that is destroyed by soap killing it.

For two of us 40 gallons of freshwater would last a month.
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Old 18-04-2020, 10:57   #12
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

In Europe there is a german product called Sea Soap, widely available across whole of Europe. You use it as a shower soap &/or shampoo with sea water, then dive back into the sea to rinse off, then a short use of the transom shower to get rid of the salt water. Saves so much of the onboard fresh water. Magic. I am sure there must be an equivalent in the US. I always keep 2-3 bottles onboard.
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Old 18-04-2020, 11:01   #13
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

Quote:
Originally Posted by StoneCrab View Post
I just watched an episode of Sailing Uma from before their head remodel. They used a pump spray bottle. They type you use to spray insecticide or spray water seal on a wooden deck.

Seems like a good idea since you can control whether you get a mist, spray or stream from the wand. You can also budget your water by only putting what you're willing to use in the bottle before the shower.

They fill it with hot water from the tea kettle.... all the comforts of home. I'm tucking this idea into my future feature list. It beats just using a wash cloth.

This works amazingly well. I lived with one of these for quite a few years on my 33 foot monohull, even with a small watermaker. No one who used it needed more than a gallon to five quarts to shower, including washing hair. I could carry it around my 33 foot monohull and wash the boat in 7 gallons. The shower was very comfortable. Fast forward to Irma, and we quickly went to the hardware store and got one. Four of us lived ashore and used that shower for everything from showers to dishes. It's crucial to get the right size. Small enough to handle easily, and large enough that one "pump up" does a complete shower. You get sweaty if you have to pump mid-shower. Around two gallons seemed about right, maybe two and a half. One and a half is too small, and three is very cumbersome.
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Old 18-04-2020, 11:07   #14
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

I haven't read the entire thread but I'll throw my two cents in....No.

At the risk of stereo typing , one of the reasons I prefer women onboard is generally they are more conscious of their personal hygiene.

Us guys can get lazy and think a swim will cut it, or just rinse the shirt out when I have a shower. I've had guys onboard that dont have a shower for 5 days while on passage....this dosent work for me in a small space, inevitably I have to say something.

Now I may have a long passage coming up, a good a mate onboard and a kiwi lady. Before taking off we are going to talk about rules to help us enjoy (survive) the trip.

Each person must shower once a day and use soap. Each person must have a clean set of clothes each day, once per week we wash those clothes with washing detergent and hang them in the sun , and we start again....body odour when your spending weeks at sea gets old fast, wash with soap and clean your clothes properly.
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Old 18-04-2020, 11:12   #15
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Re: Instead of washing rigorously, can I just swim?

It will, if you have a soap that leathers well in salt water.


The point is that the soap is there to break up grease as this is what the virus is shielded in.


Most dish washing liquids foam pretty well in salt water. The problem is that few dish washing liquids are bio degradable. Those that are, do not foam in salt water ...


Not so long ago we had some conversations here about how really bad it is to discard chemicals overboard. And now suddenly we are so fine with it. Our hypocrisy matches that of our elected leaders. ;-)



BTW the amount of fresh water required to wash hands thoroughly is so minimal, that I do not know where your problem actually is, unless you boat is very very wee.


Cheers,
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