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Old 14-09-2020, 12:57   #1
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Australian Quarantine is crazy

A couple I met in Nuku Hiva arrived in Bundaberg Australia 2 days back.

The 83 year old and his 72 year old wife sailed direct from Tahiti ,34 days, no stops.

They had a covid test upon arrival which came back negative but are still in quarantine. Unless something changes they'll be doing 14 days at a cost of $3,700.
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Old 14-09-2020, 13:04   #2
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

https://coronavirus.nt.gov.au/travel...quarantine-fee


Not sure if the provinces have different fee structures. The fees have been well publicized and no one should be taken by surprise that there is this entry requirement and cost. Part of cost for the privilege of traveling in a Covid Pandemic.

FYI, for the Northern Territory.

How much is the fee
The quarantine fee for an individual is $2,500 for the full 14 day period.

A family rate of $5,000 applies for family groups of two or more people in shared accommodation.

People in mandatory supervised quarantine will also be subject to testing before exiting quarantine. If you refuse a test, there will be 10 days added to your quarantine time.

If you are required to undertake an additional 10 days of quarantine, a further fee will be charged of $1,750 for an individual or $3,500 for a family.

When and how to pay the fee
If you are required to complete mandatory supervised quarantine you will receive an invoice for your quarantine fee which will include details of how to pay. The fee will be due 30 days from the invoice date.

Payments can be made online, by credit card, over the phone or in person at a Receiver of Territory Monies. You can find these details on the invoice.

You will not need to pay when you check in at your quarantine accommodation.

If you are an Australian resident on a low income
Australian residents with a low income may be eligible for a reduced quarantine fee of:

$1,250 per person or
$2,500 per family of two or more people sharing accommodation.
The low income threshold requirements are:

singles - $52,706
families - $68,894
Low income earners will be required to provide their most recent Australian Tax Office tax assessment notice or a statement from Centrelink.

Your application for the low income reduction will need to be submitted within 14 days of the invoice date to the following email address: DebtManagement.Dcis@nt.gov.au

If your application for low income status is approved, the invoice amount will be reduced and a revised invoice will be sent to you. If your application for low income status is not approved, you will be notified of the outcome and you are still required to pay the full quarantine fee.

Payment plan for Australian Residents
If you are unable to pay the full amount of the invoice in one transaction, you will be able to set up a payment plan. You will need to call the number on the invoice to discuss and arrange payment options. Low income earners are also able to use payment plan options.
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Old 14-09-2020, 13:17   #3
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

It's not the money, it's the lack of critical thinking that is the issue.

These people were traveling prior to covid, they have been trying to get home, got caught at Panama, 44 day sail to French Polynesia, then 34 days to Australia. They have had 2 negative tests and there time at sea is much greater than any 14 day quarantine period, there route can be proved via AIS....take emotion out of it and explain to me what possible risk they pose to the Australian public?....they are locked up against thete will and have to pay for it.

I posted purely to make some noise about what I believe is peak stupidity and draw attention to how Australia IMO has become a population of sheep, I though more of us.

Extremely disappointed.
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Old 14-09-2020, 14:24   #4
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

I think you're looking at it from the wrong perspective. Think you work for AQIS (which is not a "service" like CBP). How can they know for sure that the couple in question did not stop somewhere along the way and be exposed? Also, as dear to my heart as leniency to cruisers is, there is little real world reason to expect special treatment.

Although, based on our own experience, AQIS has not seemed to be flexible, possibly an appeal all the way to the top in Canberra might lessen their burden for your friends. We did that, once, with favorable results, a long time ago.

Ann
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Old 14-09-2020, 14:26   #5
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

After doing 78 days of sea time, a couple of weeks in a hotel doing isolation and watching Aussie TV probably won't bother them much.
The rules might not be that logical to this case, yet this case is a tiny amount of the people arriving into Australia. Probably too small a number to bother coming up with special rules.
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Old 14-09-2020, 14:35   #6
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

I agree with Ann (not saying she agrees with the below ).

I don't mean to defend the govt; I do mean to ask consideration of what happens when others hear about the Tahiti couple (or those like them) and cry "You're forcing us to pay and our ABC travel history is as benign as the Tahiti couple for XYZ resons...it's not a fair application of the rules...why do you apply common sense to them and not us? I want to speak with your manager. I want to speak to the police. I want to speak with the police manager." A Karen in born. Then you have to create Karen court to hear all the appeals to deal with special cases.

If you've ever been in a position where you are personally required to uphold rules, then you know that the human capacity for people to reason themselves into being one of the "exceptional [Karen] cases" is practically unlimited. The easy solution is a hard line, which is not to say that it is the most scientific, but it's damn easy to enforce. So either get rid of the rules altogether, or advocate to raise taxes to pay for the bureaucracy to deal with Karen cases.
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Old 14-09-2020, 14:55   #7
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

In nearly every other place, the EU, the Caribbean, your sea time verified by AIS track is credited. The issue I see is that the politicians don’t perceive a difference between cruisers and cruise ships. Throughout the Caribbean, places like Antigua have recognized this and that the cruisers account for a near zero rate for the entire zone. We elderly boat driver - retirees also don’t night club or participate in other high risk activities. If only Trinidad could do this and let us help feed their some-thousand marina workers and specialty trades.

We are weighing our return to the Caribbean now regarding tickets and rallies. We will fly into Antigua with a negative test and self reported daily Temperature taken. After two weeks, you are on your own. Rally boats are credited with transit time and a negative test.

The purpose of the quarantine and isolation was to flatten the curve. That means reduce the serious rate requiring hospitalization to a tolerable level. It will NEVER conquer the disease. Politicians however seem to have lost that thread. They are willing to continue to fall on their collective swords and torture their people at the expense of all reason and logic. In the end, more will suffer greater harm than the disease could inflict, including starvation and economic ruin. Perhaps the government’s want their ‘subjects’ dependent on them forever.
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Old 14-09-2020, 14:58   #8
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPA Cate View Post
I think you're looking at it from the wrong perspective. Think you work for AQIS (which is not a "service" like CBP). How can they know for sure that the couple in question did not stop somewhere along the way and be exposed? Also, as dear to my heart as leniency to cruisers is, there is little real world reason to expect special treatment.

Although, based on our own experience, AQIS has not seemed to be flexible, possibly an appeal all the way to the top in Canberra might lessen their burden for your friends. We did that, once, with favorable results, a long time ago.

Ann
Hi Ann, if yacht has a transmitting ais it is very easy to know where that yacht has been.

When I arrived in Fiji customs new exactly where I had been . They asked me why my ais was turned off in Mexico for 4 weeks (I was in the marina. When I was in Mexico I had no plan to come to Fiji therefore theres no way Fiji started tracking me back then.

I didnt realize upto recently that authorities are able to look your vessel up, your track has been recorded. ie Peter Mott of Pacific Guardian will supply me a record of my movements from Fiji back to oz, hes not tracking me but he has access to the data, I just send him a email and he will provide my recorded journey to me that I can then pass on to authorities.

So , it is absolutely possible to prove to authorities that you have not stopped.
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Old 14-09-2020, 15:00   #9
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicholson58 View Post
In nearly every other place, the EU, the Caribbean, your sea time verified by AIS track is credited. The issue I see is that the politicians don’t perceive a difference between cruisers and cruise ships. Throughout the Caribbean, places like Antigua have recognized this and that the cruisers account for a near zero rate for the entire zone. We elderly boat driver - retirees also don’t night club or participate in other high risk activities. If only Trinidad could do this and let us help feed their some-thousand marina workers and specialty trades.

We are weighing our return to the Caribbean now regarding tickets and rallies. We will fly into Antigua with a negative test and self reported daily Temperature taken. After two weeks, you are on your own. Rally boats are credited with transit time and a negative test.

The purpose of the quarantine and isolation was to flatten the curve. That means reduce the serious rate requiring hospitalization to a tolerable level. It will NEVER conquer the disease. Politicians however seem to have lost that thread. They are willing to continue to fall on their collective swords and torture their people at the expense of all reason and logic. In the end, more will suffer greater harm than the disease could inflict, including starvation and economic ruin. Perhaps the government’s want their ‘subjects’ dependent on them forever.
Ah, refreshing, a independent thinker...bravo.
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Old 14-09-2020, 15:13   #10
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
I agree with Ann (not saying she agrees with the below ).

I don't mean to defend the govt; I do mean to ask consideration of what happens when others hear about the Tahiti couple (or those like them) and cry "You're forcing us to pay and our ABC travel history is as benign as the Tahiti couple for XYZ resons...it's not a fair application of the rules...why do you apply common sense to them and not us? I want to speak with your manager. I want to speak to the police. I want to speak with the police manager." A Karen in born. Then you have to create Karen court to hear all the appeals to deal with special cases.

If you've ever been in a position where you are personally required to uphold rules, then you know that the human capacity for people to reason themselves into being one of the "exceptional [Karen] cases" is practically unlimited. The easy solution is a hard line, which is not to say that it is the most scientific, but it's damn easy to enforce. So either get rid of the rules altogether, or advocate to raise taxes to pay for the bureaucracy to deal with Karen cases.
Hmmm, I suppose then the Fijians with their "Blue Lanes" protocol have got it all wrong, their courts must be filling as we speak.....bummer, it seemed so successful.
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Old 14-09-2020, 15:20   #11
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

LOL. Thats aus. The australian people want government to be their mother, and when you want that, you get a very overbearing mother.
It's just as simple as that.
The australian people as a whole are very happy with a government that is there to subjugate them.It was the original purpose of the government and that never changed. They will argue all day long that the laws ,ALL OF THEM, are there for the common good. There for their protection. Laws to make life safe.
And it's great, awesome in fact that they are so happy with it that way!
If you dont like it, dont go.
I honestly would prefer to neck myself than reside in australia again, but thats me.
Pointing out the obvious is a waste of time, just as complaining about it is.
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Old 14-09-2020, 15:39   #12
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Hmmm, I suppose then the Fijians with their "Blue Lanes" protocol have got it all wrong, their courts must be filling as we speak.....bummer, it seemed so successful.
Ask for an Australian TV investigative report to look into the unfair treatment and plight of cruisers on their private yachts returning from Panama via Tahiti being asked to quarantine like everyone else. Go ahead and ask for a spotlight to be placed on the cruising community, and the cost/benefit of supporting cruising activities to the average Australian. Nothing to fear, right? No one will start asking about why the govt is wasting money supporting cruising activities when the rest of the economy is suffering, right?

It's easy enough to compare one's home country to an effective banana republic and ask "why do we have so many stupid rules" and it's easy to lament "we're going Orwell." Presumably no one wants to live in a banana republic while Orwellian references are nonsense in a world that pretty much universally has lost faith in govt institutions. IF the Orwellian belief is true, it ought to be quite clear that cruisers keep quiet. So which is it.
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Old 14-09-2020, 15:47   #13
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

AQIS is a contract organization tasked with a job. Where is it written it should be applied "reasonably?" Maybe left that out of the contract? Who knows.

I agree tracking is possible. I wrote about that months ago, now. To Dale, as a matter of fact. But it is ever so much easier to enforce something on people that is simple, clear cut, and exceptions are often viewed as "unfair."

I don't think appealing a decision is necessarily a "Karen" deal. But whoever appeals one should be prepared for a "no" answer, and to accept it. Imo, asserting oneself when one receives unfair handling is almost a duty, so as to leave a clean wake.

Ann
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Old 14-09-2020, 16:07   #14
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

Quote:
Originally Posted by JPA Cate View Post
AQIS is a contract organization tasked with a job. Where is it written it should be applied "reasonably?" Maybe left that out of the contract? Who knows.

I agree tracking is possible. I wrote about that months ago, now. To Dale, as a matter of fact. But it is ever so much easier to enforce something on people that is simple, clear cut, and exceptions are often viewed as "unfair."

I don't think appealing a decision is necessarily a "Karen" deal. But whoever appeals one should be prepared for a "no" answer, and to accept it. Imo, asserting oneself when one receives unfair handling is almost a duty, so as to leave a clean wake.

Ann
If third world AND EU can manage this then one must assume Australia does not want to, does not care, prefers to be difficult. This is easy and all of the tools are readily available. The EU did this months ago for yachts arriving from the Caribbean.

In engineering, this is a decision tree. That they have unerringly chosen the most illogical, difficult intractable choice must be considered deliberate. One need only figure why or who stands to gain. This is follow the money or follow the power grab. There is nothing to be gained in this regarding the non hazard to the Australian people.
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Old 14-09-2020, 16:26   #15
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Singularity View Post
Ask for an Australian TV investigative report to look into the unfair treatment and plight of cruisers on their private yachts returning from Panama via Tahiti being asked to quarantine like everyone else. Go ahead and ask for a spotlight to be placed on the cruising community, and the cost/benefit of supporting cruising activities to the average Australian. Nothing to fear, right? No one will start asking about why the govt is wasting money supporting cruising activities when the rest of the economy is suffering, right?

It's easy enough to compare one's home country to an effective banana republic and ask "why do we have so many stupid rules" and it's easy to lament "we're going Orwell." Presumably no one wants to live in a banana republic while Orwellian references are nonsense in a world that pretty much universally has lost faith in govt institutions. IF the Orwellian belief is true, it ought to be quite clear that cruisers keep quiet. So which is it.
How is this a cost to the Australian government????? Who's asking for support???, adding consumers back into the country that have done quarantine at sea that can be proved is a cost to Australia...there's that lack of critical thinking again.

I'm not suggesting they shouldn't do quarantine, that would be unfair, I'm suggesting time at sea counts, think about it.
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