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Old 15-09-2020, 23:24   #106
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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A couple I met in Nuku Hiva arrived in Bundaberg Australia 2 days back.

The 83 year old and his 72 year old wife sailed direct from Tahiti ,34 days, no stops.

They had a covid test upon arrival which came back negative but are still in quarantine. Unless something changes they'll be doing 14 days at a cost of $3,700.

Now I may have missded something so just ignore if already covered. These people left 34 day ago from Tahiti. They arrived in Australia and now must do the 14 days qurantine. Its not stated but if it was me I know I would have contacted the proper authorites to obtain the requirements to enter Australia. If they accepted the terms to come then what is the big deal. They did not have to come to Australia, no one forced them (to my knowledge) This is a requirement by the government - non negotiable. My wife and I are cruising the Queensland Coast of Oz at the moment, we are allowed to return to our home state but "will" have to go into quarantine if we returned. We chose not to, our decision and happy with it.
It these times you just have to adapt. Its not going to change anytime soon.


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Old 16-09-2020, 00:25   #107
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Well if you think that sharing a post on facebook about an anti government protest is seriously breaking the law and requires handcuffing a pregnant woman and removing her from her home in front of her family or that the mentally ill patient that was wondering around who got run over and then his head stamped on by police is OK then you are seriously part of the problem of this country.
The mentality ill have been the object of excessive police violence for decades now in every state of Oz. Of course it is wrong and should be called out each and every time but it has nothing to do with corona virus or quarantine controls. It has very much to do with lack of funding of mental health and lack of training of police procedures.
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Old 16-09-2020, 00:26   #108
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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And if you honestly believe that "inciting" others to break the laws, be they old or recently enacted laws, is not in itself wrong and illegal then perhaps you should re evaluate your understanding of the concept of legal positions re the community.
Very few enjoy the somewhat draconian position that we all find ourselves in here but by far the majority are working towards a better long term outcome, hopefully for us all.

Yes Incitement is the Law they are using - It's an incredibly heavy handed use of the law - Its a sledgehammer when a feather could have been used. Its because people do not stand up to the abuse of power and others like you freely encourage it that police and over bearing states are created - How do you think Nazi Germany started?



I have many friends all over Europe and none of them can believe what is occurring in Australia, especially Victoria - They liken it to Eastern Germany - For those of us who Grew up in Europe and can remember, you really do not want to go there and currently with all the tracking, curfews, facial recognition permits/papers, restrictions on leaving (Australia) an so on, we are well on our way there.


If you think that these new powers and laws will be relinquished in the future, you really are being very foolish. I fail to see the better long term outcome.
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Old 16-09-2020, 00:41   #109
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Yes Incitement is the Law they are using - It's an incredibly heavy handed use of the law - Its a sledgehammer when a feather could have been used. Its because people do not stand up to the abuse of power and others like you freely encourage it that police and over bearing states are created - How do you think Nazi Germany started?



I have many friends all over Europe and none of them can believe what is occurring in Australia, especially Victoria - They liken it to Eastern Germany - For those of us who Grew up in Europe and can remember, you really do not want to go there and currently with all the tracking, curfews, facial recognition permits/papers, restrictions on leaving (Australia) an so on, we are well on our way there.


If you think that these new powers and laws will be relinquished in the future, you really are being very foolish. I fail to see the better long term outcome.
Fair enough, you have your belief however I am a little more pragmatic, my view is that it is more like renovation a house, sure there are difficulties living there during the renovation, adjustments need to be made however afterwards the results are usually well worth it.
My belief is that should things not return to normality relatively quickly afterwards that the Australian voting public will return the favour and bid those politicians that have proven themselves incapable and, dare I say it, incompetent, a not so fond farewell. We are after all still a democracy.
Your beliefs may differ and you are very welcome to them.
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Old 16-09-2020, 01:04   #110
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Now I may have missded something so just ignore if already covered. These people left 34 day ago from Tahiti. They arrived in Australia and now must do the 14 days qurantine. Its not stated but if it was me I know I would have contacted the proper authorites to obtain the requirements to enter Australia. If they accepted the terms to come then what is the big deal. They did not have to come to Australia, no one forced them (to my knowledge) This is a requirement by the government - non negotiable. My wife and I are cruising the Queensland Coast of Oz at the moment, we are allowed to return to our home state but "will" have to go into quarantine if we returned. We chose not to, our decision and happy with it.
It these times you just have to adapt. Its not going to change anytime soon.


Greg H
Your comparing staying in Qld rather than going back to NSW , to this couple that choose to come home to their own country from 1000's of NM's away because the world changed dramatically while they were under way?

As Australians they are only able to stay in French Polynesia for 3 mths, you can not extend it. There is no where for them to store their boat currently in French Polynesia , it's full (I checked).

Also if they had of been able to store the boat theres no guarantee they could get back, Australia isnt allowing their citizens out.

They are in the age bracket that has been hit hard by covid, they probably feel some comfort getting back to Australia where they have a health care system that they arecoart of.

Do you really think your situation is comparable?
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Old 16-09-2020, 01:22   #111
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Fair enough, you have your belief however I am a little more pragmatic, my view is that it is more like renovation a house, sure there are difficulties living there during the renovation, adjustments need to be made however afterwards the results are usually well worth it.
My belief is that should things not return to normality relatively quickly afterwards that the Australian voting public will return the favour and bid those politicians that have proven themselves incapable and, dare I say it, incompetent, a not so fond farewell. We are after all still a democracy.
Your beliefs may differ and you are very welcome to them.



Just to look at it from a non emotional perspective...


Based on the death rate % per Population of the USA, Australia would have had 14,862 deaths from Covid if we had been as open as the USA, although in reality with our much lower population density it would have more than likely been considerably less.


In a bad year in Australia approximately 6,000 die from the flu and Pneumonia, so that would be an extra 8,862 deaths from Covid, this can be further reduced by the fact that we know people who die from Covid have in general serious 2nd, 3rd or more life threatening health issues, so many of them would have died from their other illness this year (and probably did, but got recorded as Covid) - This we can not put a figure on, but it would be reasonably substantial.


As we know its these people that are at risk, the management of Covid should surely be one of protecting the at risk individuals, through isolation and proper management to further reduce the amount of deaths, through which we could get the % of the population who would die from Covid down to under 0.02%.


So working under this assumption that we are protecting less than 0.02% of the population, why are we crucifying over 99.8% - What ever happened to the good of the many?


Do you really think that the massive generational debt, the destruction of jobs, livelihoods, small businesses, the creation of mental health issues, alcohol and drug abuse, the destruction of families and the creation of an over bearing police state, is really worth that very small percentage? The fallout from those issues will probably cause more deaths than from Covid within Australia anyway.
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Old 16-09-2020, 01:52   #112
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Originally Posted by daletournier View Post
Your comparing staying in Qld rather than going back to NSW , to this couple that choose to come home to their own country from 1000's of NM's away because the world changed dramatically while they were under way?

As Australians they are only able to stay in French Polynesia for 3 mths, you can not extend it. There is no where for them to store their boat currently in French Polynesia , it's full (I checked).

Also if they had of been able to store the boat theres no guarantee they could get back, Australia isnt allowing their citizens out.

They are in the age bracket that has been hit hard by covid, they probably feel some comfort getting back to Australia where they have a health care system that they arecoart of.



Do you really think your situation is comparable?


You betcha I do, for reasons I will not go into on this site !!! I truly feel for the couple and their circumstances but at the moment thats just the way it is.


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Old 16-09-2020, 01:56   #113
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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The mentality ill have been the object of excessive police violence for decades now in every state of Oz. Of course it is wrong and should be called out each and every time but it has nothing to do with corona virus or quarantine controls. It has very much to do with lack of funding of mental health and lack of training of police procedures.
Outright crap mate. Go do a week with a coppa here in Oz and see how the real world goes round.


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Old 16-09-2020, 02:18   #114
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Outright crap mate. Go do a week with a coppa here in Oz and see how the real world goes round.


Greg H
I have very good long term friends in both Qld and WA who are coppers. Some are low and some high ranked. I stand by what I wrote. Some of these coppers agree with my POV, others not so much. I support their work but some of them (including one friend ) go OTT.

I can only go by media reports for the other states.

Plenty of mentally ill causing problems on the streets - the answer isn't violence (at least not in Oz).
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Old 16-09-2020, 02:35   #115
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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You betcha I do, for reasons I will not go into on this site !!! I truly feel for the couple and their circumstances but at the moment thats just the way it is.


Greg H
They were in a country they legally couldn't stay in and there is no where to leave the boat thus they couldn't fly home, you are in Queensland, can leave the boat in a number of places and fly home (2 hours) , you wont be sailing in the Pacific ocean for 34 days.....its hilarious that you see this as being the same or even remotely similar....its not even close.
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Old 16-09-2020, 02:50   #116
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

Just to be clear about Qld.

No lockdowns in force in Qld and very few restrictions.

Qld population ~5.1 million
Qld total CV cases - 1,150
Qld total CV deaths - 6
https://www.qld.gov.au/health/condit...ovid-19-update

compare with say Louisiana
Population ~4.7 million
Total cases - 157,947
Total deaths - 5,252

14 day quarantine on entry to Qld seems like a reasonable deal but YMMV.
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Old 16-09-2020, 02:57   #117
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Originally Posted by UFO View Post
Yes Incitement is the Law they are using - It's an incredibly heavy handed use of the law - Its a sledgehammer when a feather could have been used. Its because people do not stand up to the abuse of power and others like you freely encourage it that police and over bearing states are created - How do you think Nazi Germany started?



I have many friends all over Europe and none of them can believe what is occurring in Australia, especially Victoria - They liken it to Eastern Germany - For those of us who Grew up in Europe and can remember, you really do not want to go there and currently with all the tracking, curfews, facial recognition permits/papers, restrictions on leaving (Australia) an so on, we are well on our way there.


If you think that these new powers and laws will be relinquished in the future, you really are being very foolish. I fail to see the better long term outcome.
I have a sister living in London who is horrified by what is happening here. She and her husband were intending to return to Australia to live but have changed their minds as a result of what is happening here. Fortunately she has dual citizenship.

As for the pregnant lady handcuffed and arrested. That could have been dealt with by summons. Obviously the police wanted to use her to send a message.
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Old 16-09-2020, 04:02   #118
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

Yep, these folks may not be able to enter Australia but they are still free to go wherever they please on the worlds oceans. Spare a thought for the five million or so inhabitants of Victoria, pretty well under house arrest, can't go outdoors between 8 pm and 5 am the next morning, many of them in solitary confinement, likely to be assaulted in their homes if they object etc.

Who would you rather be?
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Old 16-09-2020, 04:24   #119
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

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Yep, these folks may not be able to enter Australia but they are still free to go wherever they please on the worlds oceans. Spare a thought for the five million or so inhabitants of Victoria, pretty well under house arrest, can't go outdoors between 8 pm and 5 am the next morning, many of them in solitary confinement, likely to be assaulted in their homes if they object etc.

Who would you rather be?
Sorry.... but that is not Victoria.... that is Melbourne....

Rural Victoria? Different place....

Meanwhile back to regular programing...

4000 returning Australians arriving each week... by air...

Maybe half a dozen people a week arrive on yachts...

Last half dozen to arrive in Qland.... from Vic?

https://www.news.com.au/national/bre...60c17966bdabe5

Dirty wake.... dirty arse....

Entering from the Pacific? It is what it is.... live with it....
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Old 16-09-2020, 04:46   #120
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Re: Australian Quarantine is crazy

When the health department tells us what sort of anchor to use then maybe we will be able to validly criticize their methods of controlling a pandemic.
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