KISS Ocean Passage Lithium Setup

[Moontide]

as far as the charger goes, 30 amps at 110 is close to 300 amps at 12 volt so your shore power is not an issue. Size of charger relates more to how fast do you want to charge the batteries. Presume you know but need to make sure that the charger totally shuts off charging when batteries are full. A float charge will fry LiFePO4 batteries (and maybe all lithium?)


Might want to check out Morningstar charge controller. Fully user programable and can moniter through a ethernet connection to a router (bluetooth on newer models?). With a wireless router I can see status and change parameters on my computer.

Also great customer service and a US company. Have had one for 10 years and only problem is when a hose broke and it got sprayed with salt water. Other than that have been perfect the whole time.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by DDabs

Pardon my ignorance- but can I run a larger charger than 20A from the shore power? I figured 30A was my max if I only have one single 30A shore power connection. I'm sure once I get to the Med, I won't be able to use that anyways, so I may need to think about that...

1. Don't confuse 30amp shore power with 20amp battery charger. The battery charger rating is at 12 volts. The shore power is at 110volts. You can easily run a 50 or 100amp battery charger on a 30 amp shore power circuit.
2. You can certainly use your 110v battery charger in Europe or other 220-240v countries. You'll need a transformer which changes the voltage from 230 to 110. It won't change the cycles from 50hz to 60hz, so check the battery charger specs to see if it will still operate. I've had two in 35 years, both ran fine on 110/50hz which is what came out of my transformer.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by DDabs

Pardon my ignorance- but can I run a larger charger than 20A from the shore power? I figured 30A was my max if I only have one single 30A shore power connection. I'm sure once I get to the Med, I won't be able to use that anyways, so I may need to think about that.

I have come to a few hard decisions:
-batteries I am leaning towards the company lythbattery, who will build me two 230ah batteries with Daly BMS. Grade A cells. $2000 shipped to my door. This seems like my best option at this point. I will have a 460ah house bank. starting battery will be a 12v AGM FLA. I have not decided on the starting battery yet and could use suggetions. Do most people use a starting battery, or a dual cycle in case of a shutdown of the main house bank?
-solar panels have been acquired- I went with the company Soltronix, who makes semi flexible panels right here in the USA. Their junction boxes are nice and sealed and the build quality seems much better than what is on amazon. price is $379/panel for 100w. Pricier than amazon, not as much as a $800-1000 solbian panel.
-mppt- still up in the air about victron mppt's. I really like the genasun gv-10 controllers but I want to be able to see whats going on. What is the best way to do this?

Technically 30A @ 120v should be able to push a 300A @ 12v charger. Probably not a charger available that could do that at a reasonable price. 100-125A is probably more available. 50A is no problem to find that will run off of both US & EU mains.

I would use the house bank for starting, eliminates various complications related to charing it. If you do use a separate battery for starting I would find a place to permanently mount a 20-40W panel using a PWM controller to keep it charged. Even a large engine uses less than 1Ahr per starting attempt. If you have a Group 27 battery you should have the juice for at least 20 attempts before drawing the battery below 80%SoC. A 20W panel will average about 5Ahr/d production which should be good for 5 or more starts per day depending on engine size. If I were to use the house bank for starting I would get a LiOn jump starting pack from Costco or a supercapacitor jump pack or make a DIY crank pack as a backup. Whether you use a starting battery or a marine hybrid battery fo starting kinda depends on how big you engine is.

No opinion about your solar panels.

No opinion about the GV-10 but it is sized correctly to have 1 per panel which would be my suggestion rather than wiring all panels to one large controller which would no cope with shading nearly as well.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by DDabs

So far my potential setup would be:
-(2) 206ah SOK batteries
-(3) 110w sunpower flexible panels
-(3) genasun gv-10 mppt controllers
-1 starting SLA AGM battery
-victron orion B2B charger

I am still researching options for a wind generator/hydrogenerator to make up for the lack of solar. I don't want to do an arch and I do not have a bimini. I could perhaps put more panels on the foredeck but id rather not run wiring from that far forward

My simplified suggestion would be:
400AH made out of 4x400AH Winston Lifepo4 cells, simple and state of the art cells ( you get 480-500AH as these cells are underrated)
Daly 200A Smart BMS (simple and good, forget the reviews about the Smart Version)
Victron Battery monitor BMV 712 smart (control the lifepo and additional high/low cut off)
Victron MPPT Smart solar controller
Victron Phönix smart IP43 charger in 50A Version (shorepower and charge via Honda genny)
Victron smart B to b charger
Inverter: Giandel in the size you want, google giandel inverter. No need for Victron here, comparable Victron ones cost 3-4 times but aren‘t better.
Forget flexible panels, they don’t deliver and die fast for 4x times the money.
get Bifacial solar panels for Bimini or davits or Reling.they work with difussion light instead of direct sunlight, much less prone to shading. Bifacials are mounted vertical in solar farms, so can you do on the reling
Starter battery: don‘t waste money and get a good FLA that suits the engine. AGM is bad here, If you have to much money: Optima blue or yellow top.

Everything is Bluetooth so you can program, adjust and control everything via tablet or smart phone. All Victron smart stuff is communicating via VE.net with Bluetooth with each other and exchanging data.

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by DDabs

Pardon my ignorance- but can I run a larger charger than 20A from the shore power? I figured 30A was my max if I only have one single 30A shore power connection. I'm sure once I get to the Med, I won't be able to use that anyways, so I may need to think about that.

I have come to a few hard decisions:
-batteries I am leaning towards the company lythbattery, who will build me two 230ah batteries with Daly BMS. Grade A cells. $2000 shipped to my door. This seems like my best option at this point. I will have a 460ah house bank. starting battery will be a 12v AGM FLA. I have not decided on the starting battery yet and could use suggetions. Do most people use a starting battery, or a dual cycle in case of a shutdown of the main house bank?

-mppt- still up in the air about victron mppt's. I really like the genasun gv-10 controllers but I want to be able to see whats going on. What is the best way to do this?

Most modern chargers will work on 120 or 230 volts. 40 or 50 amp is fine.

Buy cells from Lythbattery. My 400 AH of Calb cost $902 US landed. Buy a BMS separately. The price you got for the package is too high by a lot.

Calb CA180 (200 AH) cells for $80 US.

I have 100 AH CA100 on order for $54 US.

For a BMS I would choose the Electrodacus SBMS0 which I have - controls loads and charging separately - about $130US https://electrodacus.com/
Controls all Victron products - unlimited current handling.

Or second choice the Overkill Solar BMS. I am using one for my electric outboard pack.

I sell both Victron and Genasun. I would choose the Victron controller.

[DDabs]

That price I was quoted was from Lythbattery... however that is fully built with BMS- not just the cells

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by DDabs

That price I was quoted was from Lythbattery... however that is fully built with BMS- not just the cells

My prices are also LythBattery - as recent as 2 weeks ago.

A good Daly BMS is less than 200 or so.

Best you build your own system - you will need to know how it works anyway.

Adding a BMS to cells is easy.

[DDabs]

Alright- I have been convinced to go the Victron route for most of the control equipment. Just ordered two 75/15 controllers for the two 100w panels going on the dodger. I will add a 55w panel to the coachroof as well with its own 75/15 shortly. I plan on using the smart shunt from Victron- should I still use a BMV712? or can I access all of this info using the app at this point?

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by DDabs

Alright- I have been convinced to go the Victron route for most of the control equipment. Just ordered two 75/15 controllers for the two 100w panels going on the dodger. I will add a 55w panel to the coachroof as well with its own 75/15 shortly. I plan on using the smart shunt from Victron- should I still use a BMV712? or can I access all of this info using the app at this point?

You do not need the Smart Shunt and the 712. Pick one.
Both have the phone app.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by mitiempo

You do not need the Smart Shunt and the 712. Pick one.
Both have the phone app.

Correct, i would use the BMV 712 as its showing you permanently whats going on with the battery and more importantly the alarms and you have all on the phone too.
Yes if have an old phone or tablet that can do the same but is it really always on? You need to install a USB port too then.

[TheOffice]

Ddabs

I’m also trying to choose batteries. I was also leaning towards the SOK. What do you know about Lyth?

[more]

Originally Posted by DDabs

Pardon my ignorance- but can I run a larger charger than 20A from the shore power? I figured 30A was my max if I only have one single 30A shore power connection. I'm sure once I get to the Med, I won't be able to use that anyways, so I may need to think about that.

shore power 240v x 30A = 7200W max 12v charger 600A max 24v /300A //48v 150A


shore power 120v x 30A = 3600W max 12v charger 30A ///24v 150A ///48v 75A max

[EngineerRetired]

Possibly a silly question but are you planning an all 12vdc system?

[DDabs]

SOK seems like a decent battery- however the more I researched about cells and what not, I just don't really know anything about what is inside the SOK. It has gotten great reviews, however I figure I may as well have customization from a BMS. Lyth has been great so far regarding putting together a battery for me. I think I am going to go that route.

[DDabs]

Originally Posted by EngineerRetired

Possibly a silly question but are you planning an all 12vdc system?

Yes everything on board is 12V, except the water heater and air conditioning that use 110v. I am looking for a very simple shore power charger/inverter to have on the boat so that I can use an AC outlet at sea if I need to, this is the only thing I can think of where I would need to use the inverter at sea. Otherwise yes the entire boat will be 12V.