Drop in lithium batteries

[admiralslater]

I have seen a lot of action in the lithium drop in replacement batteries market Brand such as Battle Born and the one from coastal climate offer batteries with built in bms. That are starting to look relatively affordable (I did say relatively).
The bid advantage is the straight swap ,assuming the charging system is appropriate.
Has anyone had experience with these

[folivier]

No experience but I'm currently looking at BattleBorn and LifeBlue LiFePO4's. LifeBlue looks interesting with their 5+5 year warranty and bluetooth interface. But of course the warranty is only as good as the (new) company.
I need to replace 3 8D gel cells in my RV.

[SV THIRD DAY]

No such thing as drop in LiFePO4 batteries.... and a company that claims that there is I wouldn't put much credibility in .....

[john61ct]

That's overstating the case.

I would trust Victron's more than Battleborne for example. But we don't know who makes the cells in either case.

Many cheap Chinese units sold on eBay I'm sure won't last long, may not even be LFP but some other chemistry.

If the internal BMS can isolate without warning, can fry an alt or sensitive load devices.

Using high voltages from stock lead charge sources will mean a drastically shortened lifespan.

So the statement

"If you blindly buy into the myth that you can just drop a unit into your system built for lead, and get all the LFP benefits, you are sadly mistaken"

is certainly true.

But **if** they were half the price per AH of prismatic cells, I think it might be worth designing around their limitations.

But they are not, go prismatic.

PS apparently some vendors allow the unit's internal circuitry to communicate with a central BMS. Was news to me, dunno much.

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

No such thing as drop in LiFePO4 batteries.... and a company that claims that there is I wouldn't put much credibility in .....

All of my study supports this as well. Also, we found that managing several charging systems required new software in every device and significant wiring changes to avoid accidental over charging and other errors. LIFO costs contemplated do not reflect this. We are going Firefly.

[SV THIRD DAY]

Originally Posted by Nicholson58

We are going Firefly.

After 3yrs of my 400AH LiFePO4 bank...I'm planning a swap to Firefly myself for simplicity.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

No such thing as drop in LiFePO4 batteries.... and a company that claims that there is I wouldn't put much credibility in .....

It is not technically impossible, or even difficult really.
Not compared say to electronic engine controls or designing and building a Radar.
I’m surprised there isn’t an affordable one already.
There are many true unsupervised chargers for large Lithium battery banks in existence, have been for a decade at least.
Even the alternator “problem” isn’t difficult to resolve, just cut field power as opposed to simple disconnection.

There must not be enough demand, or some companies are missing out big.

[Jerry Woodward]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

After 3yrs of my 400AH LiFePO4 bank...I'm planning a swap to Firefly myself for simplicity.

Really? Wow, I haven't heard anyone "going back" to LA after LFP. Can you elaborate on the problems you have had?

[Username25]

Originally Posted by john61ct

I would trust Victron's more than Battleborne for example. But we don't know who makes the cells in either case.

Your trust would quickly end after 2 years warranty period is over. Then you are on your own and if something goes south... I do not know about Victron, but their biggest competitor used Winston cells and amazingly marketed 320Ah battery as 360Ah. Or maybe there is some trick 8x160Ah to "convert" to 360Ah. Winston cells have higher capacity vs declared so real capacity was 360Ah. But you get the idea how they squeeze some profit using such grey methods.

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by Username25

Your trust would quickly end after 2 years warranty period is over. Then you are on your own.

Note I am not saying I would ever buy drop-in myself.

I was simply stating that Victron is a maker I trust compared to others.

Battleborn I dunno.

Are you saying you know that Victron's LFP are not as long-lived as Winston GBS CALB etc?

As I said, fact that we don't know who makes the cells is a major reason to stick to the few known-good makers.

What you state above taken literally is true for any battery maker even the best, inherent in the nature if the product.

[redsky49]

Battle Born batteries are apparently assembled and tested in the U.S. - Reno, Nevada.


https://battlebornbatteries.com/


Some terrestrial solar users are starting to provide feedback on the batteries on solar forums. I believe that just one size, 100ah, grp. 27, is currently available.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

After 3yrs of my 400AH LiFePO4 bank...I'm planning a swap to Firefly myself for simplicity.

Interesting. Weren't you actively arguing before on not needing any sophisticed control for lifepo and just setting a low max charge voltage?

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

After 3yrs of my 400AH LiFePO4 bank...I'm planning a swap to Firefly myself for simplicity.

Ok Third day, spill the beans. You have an excellent understanding of the tech stuff, very interested in your reasoning for the change to Fireflys. I was considering Fireflys when I got to south Africa but unfortunately I needed to change prior.

[arsenelupiga]

Originally Posted by daletournier

Ok Third day, spill the beans. You have an excellent understanding of the tech stuff, very interested in your reasoning for the change to Fireflys. I was considering Fireflys when I got to south Africa but unfortunately I needed to change prior.

[Username25]

Originally Posted by john61ct

Are you saying you know that Victron's LFP are not as long-lived as Winston GBS CALB etc?

I'm saying that Victron's major competitor was using Winston cells. I have no info about Victron. Problem is not quality of cells, but the rest. You can easily swap cells, but in case electronics fail... you are f**** if 2 year warranty period is over. Victron's LFP and BMS are separate units, so it is better solution, but the price is astronomical... Lynx Ion BMS 400A >1285€, 1000A > 2045€. PM me if interested, I can show you few pics of an autopsy...