Australia to Europe routes?

[Intifada]

Hi all, I currently reside in Australia while having an EU passport so was planning on returning to Europe and sailing from there back to Australia via the Atlantic and Pacific routes. I'm now thinking though that if I buy a boat here, I have more time to work/save money while getting to know my boat and do some sailing and could instead sail to Europe (and then maybe on again to Oz).
My question is what routes to take? I really don't want to do the roaring forties or cross the Pacific west to east but I'm finding it hard to get information on Australia to Europe. Anyone have any info on sailing this way? Or am I better off going back to Europe to stick to my original plan? Thanks in advance!

[Topspin]

Hi Intifada,
welcome to the forum.
Better get a boat in the Med and go from there:


1. Boat prices in OZ are seriously expensive.

Prices in Mediterranean are considerably low

2. If you don´t want to go east you can go

2.1. Gulf of Aden and through the red sea
There will be pirates.....

2.2. Around cape agulhas in South Africa
Pretty chalenging conditions. I think this is, what most cruisers do
nowadays.

3. You might get around the European VAT but you have to consider problems when importing your boat in Oz (lots of discussions somwhere in this forum). You could also sell the boat outside of Oz......

4. By starting in the med, you will sail the easiest part first.



5. Big Boats are expensive (berthing + insurance) so getting familiar with the boat will be expensive. Maybe better buy the boat and start immediately.


Regards,

-Richard (VK4WRS)

[mcarthur]

You've said "sailing", so that helps.

Going the "downhill" route would be EU to Caribbean to Panama to Marquesas to Oz. If you want to be closer to land than the big jumps, then EU to Egypt to Aden to India to Malaysia to Australia means much smaller jumps are possible. On the first route there's dangers from long jumps, piracy off Panama (non-government kind ). On the second route, there's dangers from piracy off the red sea, and going through more countries that have different rules and costs. Both routes would need careful checks on timings to take most advantage. Via Asia is shorter (at least to Oz landfall at Darwin!).

Oz to EU is a different beast. You could go Hawaii and across to US, down to Panama to Cuba to Bermuda to Azores to EU. But the first half would be trickier and need careful planning for wind. The other way is across the wild and uninhabited expanse of the southern Pacific and up the coast to Panama. Both are longer. Without going Cape of Good Hope, you'd have to either go up Indonesia and across to Sri Lanka to Aden to Med to EU, but you could head west across the Indian before going north and visit the Maldives via Cocos Is and then to Africa/Gulf.

Either way there's not many cruisers who traverse the Gulf of Aden in the last 5 years or so - I think there was less than20 per annum, as against 300+ for South Africa. Note that the route does seem to be calming down according to reports (like noonsite).

We're on a powercat and planning the EU Suez Asia Oz route "in a few years"...

[UFO]

Originally Posted by Topspin

1. Boat prices in OZ are seriously expensive.

Prices in Mediterranean are considerably low

Can't agree with that - The Aussie Dollar has crashed and makes shopping outside of Australia very expensive - I just spent the last 18 months trying to buy a Cat in the Med and gave up in the end and bought one here in Australia. Found one in fantastic condition for the same price as an ex charter Cat in the Med. But yes now I need to sail it over - There are worse issues to be faced with

[Tillsbury]

Is the Cape that bad? If you go up the east coast of Australia there are some lovely places to hop across some of the Indian ocean and then aim for the East coast of South Africa. Can't you wait in Durban and Port Elizabeth for good conditions? After that the route across the Atlantic isn't so bad. Again a couple of pretty exotic destinations on the way.

[Fore and Aft]

Jimmy Cornell’s book shows plenty of routes and distances and is well worth buying.
https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Boo...-srp1-_-title7
Cheers
“Where is GordMay?”

[tarian]

Originally Posted by Fore and Aft

Jimmy Cornell’s book shows plenty of routes and distances and is well worth buying.
https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Boo...-srp1-_-title7
Cheers
“Where is GordMay?”

+1 for the book
Your easiest route avoiding pirates is the Indian Sea round the Cape up to the Caribbean , then across the Atlantic to the Med.

[daletournier]

I took the Indian ocean route, very doable on a well founded boat, weather reports are good and the easiest way is across the top of Madagascar. Most no longer go south of Madagascar, guaranteed you will get at least one gale. Going the top of Madagascar allows you to pick your windows quite easily.

Many are now back doing the red sea route, more than most realize.

[philiosophy]

I believe the New Zealand Australia area is the best bet by far for buying. Both price and build quality. As far as the route goes it's very doable with a good boat and a bit of care.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by philiosophy

I believe the New Zealand Australia area is the best bet by far for buying. Both price and build quality. As far as the route goes it's very doable with a good boat and a bit of care.

I'm not sure what you mean by build quality as the Australian market has many types of boats from many manufacturers.

The aud sinking has definitely made it more feasible to buy in oz. I sold my last boat overseas and was looking for my next anywhere, I was surprised to find that when I took our depreciated dollar into account I was better to buy at home if I could find the right boat.

At the time the same boat was selling in the states for between 180k-220kusd. When I did the conversion I was able to purchase mine in Mooloolaba for $135k usd, the aud has dropped more since then. My boat was also fully imported saving me more money.

Another advantage is you then get to refit or do what ever you need to do in a country you understand.

[Fore and Aft]

Exactly Dale, the Aussie dollar has taken a bit of a hammering and being able to refit in a Country you understand is a big benefit.
Tarian I wonder how many non offshore cruises buy Cornell’s book? I have a copy that I love to read when imagining voyages that will never happen.
Cheers

[Barra]

Originally Posted by UFO

Can't agree with that - The Aussie Dollar has crashed and makes shopping outside of Australia very expensive - I just spent the last 18 months trying to buy a Cat in the Med and gave up in the end and bought one here in Australia. Found one in fantastic condition for the same price as an ex charter Cat in the Med. But yes now I need to sail it over - There are worse issues to be faced with

yep agree. times have changed oz boats used to be expensive on an international basis - you could sail one back from EU or US and sell for a profit . Now its cheaper to buy a boat in oz. (but still more expensive to berth etc)

[Barra]

on the route I would go the indian ocean via the cape also. great adventure and no spooky nights in the gulf of aden. Malaysia is a good option for a refit if needed. Anyone needs crew I am still a few years off my next boat

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Fore and Aft

Exactly Dale, the Aussie dollar has taken a bit of a hammering and being able to refit in a Country you understand is a big benefit.
Tarian I wonder how many non offshore cruises buy Cornell’s book? I have a copy that I love to read when imagining voyages that will never happen.
Cheers

When I left Oz on my last boat in 2011 the aud was 1.10 to the usd, it's now 68 cents. Since I started cruising away from home my money had lost 40% of its purchasing power, I and other aussie's are noticing it.

The other thing is inflation is happening all around the world, not just at home. I'm not finding labor rates as cheap as they used to be, yes still generally better than home but not what they were when I first got to Thailand in 2011.

In Columbia at the moment, a nice marina but nothing special at Santa Marta is 81 cents (usd) a foot.

[CassidyNZ]

Australia going west is part of the “milk run” with very good sailing conditions in the trades. I would go Aus to Cocos Keeling, biggish jump to Chagos, then either to Seychelles or Mauritius. Seychelles would take you over the top of Madagascar where you can have a nice stop at Nose Be then down the Mozambique Channel. Another nice stop for those wanting something iconic is Zanzibar.

Going via Mauritius would essentially drive one south of Madagascar on to any of the ports in a South Africa. Possibility of gales no more likely than when doing the Channel except that the Channel would provide significant current advantages heading south. Strong headwinds in the Channel against the Agulhus Stream is a far bigger threat than open-sea gales. Pick your poison.

But understand that this is a very long route to get to Europe. Reaching Cape Town is not a lot past halfway.

Mediterranean to Australia via Suez Canal is a serious challenge unless you get the season exactly right. I’ve done Seychelles to Australia (most of the trip) and would never consider doing it again. If that was the only route open to me I would sell/abandon the boat, no kidding. I did it non-stop but I believe India/SriLanka provide little facility for cruising sailors.