Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 30-04-2021, 06:10   #1
Registered User
 
LakeSuperior's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Boat: Teak Yawl, 37'
Posts: 2,979
Images: 7
Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Indonesian officials working to determine how a military submarine with 53 crewmembers sunk earlier this month during a training exercise said the vessel may have been hit by an internal solitary wave in the treacherous waters off Bali.

Australia’s ABC.net.au reported that such waves are invisible but have the strength to drag a submarine down to dangerous depths. The report said that there have been several theories, but evidence seems to point to the wave that would not be evident on the surface of the water.

The report said Indonesian naval officials consulted satellite images from the region and determined that these massive waves were in the area at the time of the sinking.

Rear Adm. Iwan Isnurwanto, the commander of the Indonesian Navy Command and Staff School, told the station that the wave may have "moved up from the bottom to the north, and there’s a trench between two mountains."

"There was nothing that they could do, no time to do anything... if the sub was brought down by such a wave. It likely angled [downward], causing all the crew members to roll down," Isnurwanto said, according to Nikkei Asia. "We have to do further investigation, but that is most likely what happened."

From https://www.foxnews.com/world/doomed...er-wave-report
LakeSuperior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 06:16   #2
Registered User
 
Alan Mighty's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Moreton Bay
Boat: US$4,550 of lead under a GRP hull with cutter rig
Posts: 2,135
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Perhaps.

It does not change the facts that it was (1) an old boat, well past its use-by date; and (2) overloaded with personnel.

So the solitary wave story is a convenient way to shift the blame, nicht wahr?
__________________
“Fools say that you can only gain experience at your own expense, but I have always contrived to gain my experience at the expense of others.” - Otto von Bismarck
Alan Mighty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 06:17   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Panama
Boat: Norseman 447
Posts: 1,625
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Or maybe it was a UFO? Anything except a mistake on the part of the Indonesian navy. Sounds like CYA to me.
Bycrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 06:43   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 831
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

I wonder how long it will be before we see a B-movie on this incident on the SciFi channel
mako is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 06:46   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Bellingham
Boat: Outbound 44
Posts: 9,319
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Or a seam burst on a 40 year old submarine
__________________
Paul
Paul L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 07:51   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Panama
Boat: Norseman 447
Posts: 1,625
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

When Russian and American subs sank, it took years if not decades of investigation before they talked about what actually caused it. When planes crash, even with external radar and communications data, recovered data recorders and easy accessibility to the leftovers, it can still take a months or years long investigation. It took over a year to investigate the two collisions of US Navy surface ships with commercial ships.

So I find it less than reasonable that we should believe that after a couple of weeks of investigation and a few blurry photos, they can decide that the accident is the result of an extremely rare, essentially unprovable phenomenon that just coincidentally allows everyone in the government, the navy chain-of-command and all the suppliers and shipyards to just raise their eyes to the heavens and mumble "Inshallah."
Bycrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 08:51   #7
Registered User
 
Dougtiff's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: San Rafael, Ca.
Boat: Gaff rigged Ketch[Spray]37' on deck
Posts: 602
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Having worked in Indonesia for 15 years, its a joke having a submarine, they can't maintain surface vessels, let alone a sub, anyway, they don't need submarines, such a waste of money.
Dougtiff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 09:36   #8
Registered User
 
Boatyarddog's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Olympia, Washington
Boat: 1979 Mariner Ketch 32-Hull 202
Posts: 2,124
Images: 2
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Quote:
Originally Posted by LakeSuperior View Post
Indonesian officials working to determine how a military submarine with 53 crewmembers sunk earlier this month during a training exercise said the vessel may have been hit by an internal solitary wave in the treacherous waters off Bali.

Australia’s ABC.net.au reported that such waves are invisible but have the strength to drag a submarine down to dangerous depths. The report said that there have been several theories, but evidence seems to point to the wave that would not be evident on the surface of the water.

The report said Indonesian naval officials consulted satellite images from the region and determined that these massive waves were in the area at the time of the sinking.

Rear Adm. Iwan Isnurwanto, the commander of the Indonesian Navy Command and Staff School, told the station that the wave may have "moved up from the bottom to the north, and there’s a trench between two mountains."

"There was nothing that they could do, no time to do anything... if the sub was brought down by such a wave. It likely angled [downward], causing all the crew members to roll down," Isnurwanto said, according to Nikkei Asia. "We have to do further investigation, but that is most likely what happened."

From https://www.foxnews.com/world/doomed...er-wave-report
FAUX News report??
HORSEHOCKY
SV Cloud Duster
Boatyarddog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 09:41   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 353
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Indonesia has been working for years to establish themselves as a credible Nation, possibly they tried too hard and overextended their ability.
Never the less, the loss of 53 Sailors is a major loss to the Navies of the World and Sea Goers everywhere.
oleman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 10:03   #10
Registered User
 
AndyEss's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Sea of Cortez/northern Utah/ Wisconsin/ La Paz, BCS
Boat: Hans Christian 38 Mk II
Posts: 948
Images: 2
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougtiff View Post
Having worked in Indonesia for 15 years, its a joke having a submarine, they can't maintain surface vessels, let alone a sub, anyway, they don't need submarines, such a waste of money.
Indonesia needs a navy, especially submarines, as China is on a territorial annexation spree.

He who controls the outlet of the Malacca Straits, controls China’s imports and exports.

The British didn’t build their flawed fortress/major naval base at Singapore for no reason. Same as Gibraltar - and former British control over Suez.
AndyEss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 10:04   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Boat: Westerly Conway 36ft
Posts: 961
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Invisible underwater waves.. Hmmm. Don't think so.
Submarining is dangerous & unforgiving. Maybe the boat failed from age & lack of maintenance, or maybe someone on board just made a critical error. Hopefully lessons will be learned.
Either way, 53 sailors died, for which we offer our sympathy to their families. Looks like it was quick, at least.
Clivevon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 10:24   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Lansdale, PA
Boat: Chrysler 22
Posts: 80
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Heard that a strange water condition between Maui and Hawai’i exists. Apparently ships have bee lost there because of a vertical water swirl or something similar exists there. Why not a similar phenom in Indonesia?
Every country wants a submarine in their navy. Bragging rights. Besides that, a 40 year old boat is only a target for China.
chasmains is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 10:38   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Kingston / Thousand Islands, Ontario
Boat: C&C 35 Mk.II
Posts: 343
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Quote:
Originally Posted by oleman View Post
Indonesia has been working for years to establish themselves as a credible Nation, possibly they tried too hard and overextended their ability.
Never the less, the loss of 53 Sailors is a major loss to the Navies of the World and Sea Goers everywhere.
Credibility on the international stage comes not just from having planes and ships, but from demonstrating that you – as an organization – know what you're doing.


As Bycrick pointed out earlier, investigating an incident like this, to the point where you understand the root cause and can draw meaningful lessons from it, takes months or years. Saying "whelp, must have been an internal wave, too bad" after such a cursory examination effectively tells all the other naval forces in the area that not only do you not know what you're doing, your organization isn't even self-aware enough to realize that it doesn't know what it's doing. That is an *awful* position in which to put yourself, if you're aspiring to be a local geopolitical power.
__________________
Matt Marsh
marshmat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 10:44   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Boat: Westerly Conway 36ft
Posts: 961
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Quote:
Originally Posted by marshmat View Post
Credibility on the international stage comes not just from having planes and ships, but from demonstrating that you – as an organization – know what you're doing.


As Bycrick pointed out earlier, investigating an incident like this, to the point where you understand the root cause and can draw meaningful lessons from it, takes months or years. Saying "whelp, must have been an internal wave, too bad" after such a cursory examination effectively tells all the other naval forces in the area that not only do you not know what you're doing, your organization isn't even self-aware enough to realize that it doesn't know what it's doing. That is an *awful* position in which to put yourself, if you're aspiring to be a local geopolitical power.
Makes sense.
Clivevon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30-04-2021, 11:32   #15
Registered User
 
Cadence's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: SC
Boat: None,build the one shown of glass, had many from 6' to 48'.
Posts: 10,208
Re: Invisible Force Sinks Sub

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mighty View Post
Perhaps.

It does not change the facts that it was (1) an old boat, well past its use-by date; and (2) overloaded with personnel.

So the solitary wave story is a convenient way to shift the blame, nicht wahr?
An old diesel boat in all likely hood, it may have gone down as the result of age? I doubt a government will admit to that?
Cadence is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Invisible active users Gisle Forum Tech Support & Site Help 0 12-05-2003 07:38

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 20:30.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.