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Old 27-01-2025, 11:29   #1
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Endeavour saliboats opinions

Im considering purchasing a sail boat for Lake Michgan.

Some of potential boats ive found locally are Endeavour 33, Endeavour 35, Endeavour 37, Catalica 36. All boats were build in 80's (maybe mid 80).

Can you share your experiences and optinions with any of those boats?
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Old 27-01-2025, 11:58   #2
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

We owned an 84' Endeavour 40 CC for just over 6 years. I can't say its exactly the same but I'm sure there are similarities. What info can I help with?
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Old 27-01-2025, 12:13   #3
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

Basically im trying to buy my very first boat. and im little scared of making terrible mistake while doing it. I want to know if those boats are good first boat for new sailor, good quality, strong, easy to sail and enjoy. One on the concerns is ill use it on Lake Michigan and from i understand that this lake can be very stormy and unpredictible. As the result i do not completely understand if i need to look for coastal cruiser, or blue water boat. (i realize my worries are most likely unfounded)
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Old 27-01-2025, 12:53   #4
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

Buying your first boat is frightening. The bottom line is you are buying someone else's problems and trying to mitigate, or minimize, buying their mistakes.

Regardless of the boat, you have to get aboard and scrutinize it. If it has a nice pretty coat of bottom paint on it, you have to figure out a way to see if it (the hull) has water. There are devices that can find out if the hull contains water in the fiberglass. You need to look for signs of water intrusion from every single port, every single place and space, from above deck. Walk around the entire boat feeling for soft spots, especially near hatches, ports, and deck hardware. Here is a reference: https://www.boatingworld.com/questio...ll-is-damaged/

So here is something we learned about ANY boat made in the 70s and 80s in regards to fiberglass bottoms. They were inconsistent on how the bottom was made! A person standing there spraying the chop-strand on a Friday afternoon ready to leave for the day might not have quite gotten the layers right properly completed.

If this is your first boat, and you don't know what you are doing, you really ought to have someone who does, help you. Or find the very best surveyor you can to tell you everything they can find about it before you buy it.
If you are dealing directly with the current owner, then recognize that unless you're lifelong friends hanging out at each others house and you both value the friendship... you probably cannot trust anything they say. They are trying to sell you the boat, not tell you everything they screwed up or hate about it.

Familiarize yourself with 12V systems, examine the batteries, bring along a multi-meter. Look at the back of the 12V breaker panel. Do you see nice organized wiring or does it look like a horizontal plate of spaghetti?

Look for signs in the bilge of water sitting, like lines around the sides. Our boat usually had water in the bilge. It came down the keel stepped mast, so there was no stopping it. That said, if left unchecked, it go higher and higher. High enough and it starts touching other things, like fuel tanks, water tanks, etc. If the boat still has its old tanks, look for corrosion.

Regarding the fuel tank, look to see if the engine sits atop the fuel tank. Meaning the fuel tank is housed in the stern area bilge. If it does, was the tank ever replaced? Is it metal? A known issue with Endeavour was positioning the fuel tank in the water... where over time it corroded and would eventually leak diesel into the bilge.

Regarding how it sailed. The Endeavour 40 CC was a wide boat, she had a big belly. Very roomy on the inside, we loved it. Loved the aft cabin! Back to the sailing, she sailed well enough. As I recall we were able to wing-on-wing nicely as needed. She would get overpowered and weatherhelmed once the upper teens of wind was encountered. Our boat came equipped with a huge geneoa, it was very overpowered we came to realize. We learned early on to reef early and often. That was specific to our boat. As a heavy boat, it felt good moving through and over the waves. I'm not sure how a 33' would feel. She definitely wasn't the fastest boat but we always felt pretty good about the sturdiness. I wanna say 5, 5.5, maybe 6 knots high end? She wasn't a speedy boat.

Of course you have to do a good inspection of the engine. There is so much that can go into this that your better off doing an internet search on what to look for. Basics would be close inspection of the fuel filters, are they nice and pink and clear? Seeing how the owner cares for the boat is a really good indicator of how they previously took care of it.

The best advice I can give you is to be ready to walk away. And again, having someone who knows boats is invaluable, or a good surveyor. You sorta want your surveyor to talk you out of buying the boat by providing you a punch list of all the things you need to fix if you buy the boat.
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Old 27-01-2025, 16:01   #5
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

Thank you so much for your thoughtful answer. This will definitely help me to mitigate mistakes

Seems that at least freshwater boats in the northern latitudes may be a bit less susceptible to rust and hopefully osmosis. Also, the boating season is pretty short here. So hopefully the boats are a little less used then normal given the age
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Old 27-01-2025, 17:43   #6
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

Quote:
Seems that at least freshwater boats in the northern latitudes may be a bit less susceptible to rust and hopefully osmosis.
On the other hand, any trapped water is likely to have frozen during the winter and the resulting expansion can do serious damage. Rudders are particularly susceptible to such events as are cored decks.

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Old 27-01-2025, 18:24   #7
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

Great point. I guess moisture meter should help determining water intrusion
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Old 27-01-2025, 18:51   #8
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

I was boat shopping in 2019-20. The Endeavor 32 was on my short list, and I looked at 4 of them. Three had decks that had large areas of water intrusion and freeze damage. The 4th was a nice boat, but had a botched blister repair job on the bottom.

There are good ones out there, but in that age group, they are vastly outnumbered by the ones in need of far more work and money than makes any sense. Read through this to get a bit of background: Marine Survey 101, pre-survey inspection

In the end, I bought the boat I found in the best condition, a 1979 O'Day 30. She is older than I wanted, but in pretty nice shape.

Lake Michigan is definitely considered "Coastal". If the boat has a working motor, a safe port is always less than 1 day away. The lake can be mean and somewhat unpredictable, but about 99% of the boats here are "coastal".
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Old 28-01-2025, 04:00   #9
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

Since you're talking about this being your 1st boat, I'm guessing there will be a 2nd one at some point. Do you have an "end game" in mind ? Are you working toward a specific goal, i.e. Bahamas or crossing an ocean ?

Is there a reason you are leaning toward larger boats ? An Endeavour 37 is a pretty hefty boat. As they are older maintenance costs will be an issue. Do you have a budget in mind ?

FWIW, if you can do with something slightly smaller I always suggest a Catalina 30. They are great boats with great factory support. If it's in your budget get a newer model. The current one is the Catalina 316.

If you're going to sell it at some future point to get a bigger cruising boat after you've learned more about what you want in a boat, having a smaller and newer boat will be an easier sell.

A smaller newer well maintained sailboat will be better than an older bigger boat that may have issues. You sound like you want to sail. There will always be maintenance to do and learn, but that's better than projects.

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Old 28-01-2025, 05:53   #10
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Oldmanmirage makes a lot of good points! Actually all of the others did. 100%
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Old 28-01-2025, 06:28   #11
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

All definitely great and very helpful thoughts, I can’t stress it enough. Traveling from Chicago to Caribbean by sailboat does sound appealing, but if I am honest with myself its not likely with my first boat. The only experience sailing to date is on Colgate 26 (very small boat in my opinion). The Lake Michigan is very large and I think I would like to cross it, also possibly traverse great lakes would be appealing. The reason so the larger boats in my view would be to use in like a floating condo for the summer besides its primary use – sailing. The height of the ceiling would be important (over 5.8), the costs of mooring are the same for anything under and including 35 feet. Visually I simply have not seen many sailboats under 35 feet on Michigan. One of the reasons I was looking for very inexpensive boats (everything I’ve listed seems in good shape on photos and all of it is between 17 – 23k) So I was thinking its easy to get into financially and I could survive to lose the entire investment. To summarize I would use this boat with my wife, hoping for comfortable boat to live on part time and safe enough in the storm should we get caught in one. So those are the reasons for me looking at the selection I was. I will definitely expand se search to 30 footers. Do you have any opinions on Hunter 290/295? Seem much newer, affordable and large inside……
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Old 30-01-2025, 05:03   #12
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

I have no problems with Hunters. I worked for a marine electronics dealer in the 90's and we would regularly go to the Hunter factory near Gainsville and install autopilots and such for people buying the boats. Hunter has had issues in the distant past but I would say later productions boats are fine.

30 feet is a good size for a couple. You will have plenty of room and storage for weekend and week-long cruising. More than enough boat to learn what you like and don't like. And learn to sail, anchor, dock, cook, eat, sleep and generally all the things you could and would do on larger boats - without the added cost.

20K should be able to get you a very nice 30 foot sailboat. And always remember a well maintained boat is what you want. If you run across one that the owner has receipts going back to day 1, a logbook with oil changes and things like that - jump on that one !

I found this Catalina 30 on Craigslist...
https://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/b...815089391.html

The interior looks amazing, engine is clean. Not many exterior shots but I would think anyone who kept the interior this nice has probably maintained the boat pretty well. Might be worth a look.

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Old 30-01-2025, 06:48   #13
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

Thank you so much for your guidance and assistance. I will definetly go Crowely Boatyard to take a look at the catalina you have reffered me to. Thats where ive found this Endeavour 33 also

https://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/106879

There is also Catalina for sale by owner here seems in decent shape under 10K

https://www.boats.com/sailing-boats/...na-30-9656398/
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Old 30-01-2025, 08:14   #14
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

Sounds like you're on your way! Good luck to you!
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Old 30-01-2025, 08:45   #15
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Re: Endeavour saliboats opinions

As someone who went from 27' first boat to a 36' "keeper" I would highly recomend having 1st boat in 30'-33' range. That way she can still be a "keeper" if she proves herself good fit for your use or you can move up to 34-40' range to suit your changed future plans. Or even downsize if needed. Had I known then (almost 20 years ago) what I know now and had my cruising plans not been derailed by life, I would've been better served by getting a 30-33 footer for the first and keeper boat altogether.

Also keep in mind that in the 80s range basically you will find both the 70s design models and newer, 80s ones. So for example 1984 built with 70s design and layout 32' will be less roomy than 1984 32' with 80s style design. Thus if you get a late 80s Catalina 30 it will feel roomier (and probably sail better) that 32' 70s design boat. OTOH - condition, condition, condition - beats all other factors by far. If you want to sail and not linger on the hard fixing stuff or paying someone else an arm and a leg if not a DIY person.
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