Shore power installation on my sailboat

[n5ama]

I have purchased a 1984 Contessa 32 sailboat built in Canada. The previous owner (there was only one owner prior to my buying the boat) removed the shore power that came in through the bow anchor locker compartment. The boat was moored and used a solar panel to keep the batteries charged.

I see this as a multi part problem. The connection to the battery charger and the connection to the AC outlets (still in place). The original builders control panel is still in place but the wiring from the anchor locker has been removed. This is ok with me because I intend to install the shore connector to a location in the cockpit which would also shorten the path to the charger.

Does it make sense to use this opportunity to install LiPo batteries with a charging system since I would probably be buying a charging system anyway? I’m sure this has been done and I’m not interested in reinventing the wheel. Is there a “kit” with all the compatible components available to simplify the installation and the “conversion”?

I’m handy with electrical and rf stuff so I should be able to handle this. I wasn’t paying enough attention at the last Annapolis sail boat show because I briefly visited several booths in the big tent that were displaying their stuff. At the time I was interested but not ready to pull the trigger on converting my current boat.

The new home for the boat will change from a mooring in Maine to a slip near Galveston, TX. I could continue to charge the current batteries with the solar panel and the Yanmar but it would be nice to have AC available at the slip for the necessities such as wife’s hair drier, my “Tim The Toolman” vacuum cleaner and “well you get the idea” LOL

Any help and suggestions greatly appreciated,
Tom

[capt jgw]

If you want LiPo batteries go ahead and put them in. It really has nothing to do with reinstalling a power inlet and wiring. I assume since you're asking the charger was removed too? It maybe was outdated or inop anyway, and lithium batteries will need a modern charger.
I once had a boat with the power inlet in the anchor well and found it to be a PITA. If I went bow into a slip the cable would reach the pedestal but not stern in. Also because I couldn't see the cable from the helm I tried to back out a couple times with the cable still attached. That didn't work too well.

[Scubaseas]

If you're going to be in Galveston or Seabrook/Kemah you will want AC. Plan accordingly.
Buy a charger that is LiFePo4 capable. It can easily charge AGM . Gels or flooded but not all chargers will charge LiFePo4 safely. Lithiums should not be stored fully charged. I got a Victron Skylla which I am happy with but got it so I can run it in Europe. It has a lithium specific profile in it that allows them to run down to 80% once a month or so.

Consider using a "Smart Plug". They last longer. Cost more too.

Also put in a galvanic isolator. Follow ABYC and NEC codes.

[n5ama]

Originally Posted by capt jgw

If you want LiPo batteries go ahead and put them in. It really has nothing to do with reinstalling a power inlet and wiring. I assume since you're asking the charger was removed too? It maybe was outdated or inop anyway, and lithium batteries will need a modern charger.
I once had a boat with the power inlet in the anchor well and found it to be a PITA. If I went bow into a slip the cable would reach the pedestal but not stern in. Also because I couldn't see the cable from the helm I tried to back out a couple times with the cable still attached. That didn't work too well.

Thanks for your reply!

I guess that is my question. I may use a Lithium battery for the house and the AGM battery for just the starter. I’m told I will need a Lithium battery charger that will provide proper charging and maintenance cycles to maximize the life of the very expensive lithium battery. Is there a provider that can supply what I need without having to go out and buy the system piecemeal?

In a perfect world, I would buy a shore powered charger that optimizes the charging needs of both the AGM and the lithium batteries. I would use the alternator to charge both and the 150w solar panel to provide a trickle charge when shore power goes down, or I’m anchored.

[n5ama]

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

If you're going to be in Galveston or Seabrook/Kemah you will want AC. Plan accordingly.
Buy a charger that is LiFePo4 capable. It can easily charge AGM . Gels or flooded but not all chargers will charge LiFePo4 safely. Lithiums should not be stored fully charged. I got a Victron Skylla which I am happy with but got it so I can run it in Europe. It has a lithium specific profile in it that allows them to run down to 80% once a month or so.

Consider using a "Smart Plug". They last longer. Cost more too.

Also put in a galvanic isolator. Follow ABYC and NEC codes.

Thanks for the reply!!

I’m currently at South Shore and definitely know I need AC. I’ve got a smart plug on my current boat but will be selling it with the boat so will be buying another for this boat. I will definitely obey the codes.

I would like a charger that would handle both a AGM battery for the starter and a lithium battery for the house. I would like to charge both with the engine alternator and trickle charge the whole thing with the 150w solar panel.

This is asking a lot for a system and that is why I’m asking if there is something available without having to go out and buy stuff piecemeal.

[Scubaseas]

The Skylla can charge a LiFePo4 house and an AGM start battery at the same time.

One way is to use the engine alternator running to the start battery and then a B2B charger from Start to LiFePo4 house. Simple, effective. Limited to the B2B capacity but you would also want to put in a temp limiting sensor on the alternator. Ideally you would have a remote alternator regulation. Easy to convert an integral alternator if you don't. Get a good regulator if going LiFePo4. like Wakepseed or Balmar MC618?

If you go engine alternator to LiFePo4 House you will need a smart regulator, heavy cabling, a temp sensor and likely a higher output alternator to run it de-amped to keep it from over heating and you still need a B2B or combiner for the start battery. Lots of ways to do it. The LiFePo4 has a very high acceptance rate and will cook a regularly regulated alternator. Both ways work. If you want the fastest charging then directly from Alternator to house is the way to go but it's also very expensive if done right.

Having lots of solar is one way to solve house bank charging. Lots of threads here on LiFePo4 systems.

[Scubaseas]

Originally Posted by n5ama

Thanks for the reply!!

I would like a charger that would handle both a AGM battery for the starter and a lithium battery for the house. I would like to charge both with the engine alternator and trickle charge the whole thing with the 150w solar panel.

This is asking a lot for a system and that is why I’m asking if there is something available without having to go out and buy stuff piecemeal.

Skylla can do both at the same time. Run alternator and solar to start battery, B2B from start to house battery. Or run solar to House if your solar regulator can be set for lithium. For getting house to start battery use a combiner or ACR on it. Or just keep a jump box on board. Unlikely you'll need to charge the start battery often or much. You're using it as a damper with the above set up.

[n5ama]

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

Skylla can do both at the same time. Run alternator and solar to start battery, B2B from start to house battery. Or run solar to House if your solar regulator can be set for lithium. For getting house to start battery use a combiner or ACR on it. Or just keep a jump box on board. Unlikely you'll need to charge the start battery often or much. You're using it as a damper with the above set up.

Good morning Scubaseas,

Your advice sounds like it will fill my needs without breaking the bank. I will rarely do much more than day sail in and around the northern GOM. I’ll never be very far from help if I get into trouble but since I’m starting from scratch for much of the original hardware, I think it makes sense to replace it with something that is current technology.

I appreciate you taking the time to give me a hand.

Tom

[GreenWave]

n5ama


Victron makes a suite of products that would fit your needs. Lots of flexibility and control with ability to also monitor all parts of the system. You can buy these from various online providers or engage someone local to Kemah area. I am at Watergate and in middle of a lithum upgrade with all Victron stuff. Feel free to reach out if you want to talk more, get some local names, or see what I am doing.

[n5ama]

Originally Posted by GreenWave

n5ama


Victron makes a suite of products that would fit your needs. Lots of flexibility and control with ability to also monitor all parts of the system. You can buy these from various online providers or engage someone local to Kemah area. I am at Watergate and in middle of a lithum upgrade with all Victron stuff. Feel free to reach out if you want to talk more, get some local names, or see what I am doing.

Would you happen to be a Tulane grad??

I briefly checked with Blackburn Marine but just starting to assemble ideas. I would like to talk with you on what you found and why. You have a bit bigger boat than my little Contessa 32 and probably have bigger needs but it would be good to talk about what you are doing.

Thanks,
Tom

[Scubaseas]

5 years ago Blackburn had decent pricing. West is now often cheaper. Add PKYS.com to your data base. They're also very good on advice. No affiliation.

[n5ama]

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

5 years ago Blackburn had decent pricing. West is now often cheaper. Add PKYS.com to your data base. They're also very good on advice. No affiliation.

Thanks for the advise. I usually stay away from West Marine unless I need a hat.

BTW, I see you do some time in south Maine. My boat is currently located in the Harraseeket river at Brewer Marine and I'm watching Lee hoping to truck my boat to Clear Lake on Sept. 21.

My other option was to sail the boat home in June of next year (after the thaw). It sounded like a fun trip but I'm not familiar with the east coast and I would be missing several months of primo sailing here in Texas.

[Scubaseas]

Big Defender fan before they sold. Also Marinehowto.com . I have a boat in Seabrook Marina, sometimes it's worth the wait and expense to ship stuff in. I also have my old boat in my side yard here in Scarborough ME that I should really sell.

The quality of some of the Blackburn hoses versus price bears scrutiny. Not saying it's bad (or good) but if I am paying Shields prices I sort of expect Shields hoses, not some Turkish product I can't find any info on. I went to Blackburn to pickup some Barnacle Buster in May. It was 10% cheaper at West for the same product. Ditto some Blue Seas stuff. Which is not saying West is a good deal.

Good luck on your shipping and fit out.

[GreenWave]

Originally Posted by n5ama

Would you happen to be a Tulane grad??

I briefly checked with Blackburn Marine but just starting to assemble ideas. I would like to talk with you on what you found and why. You have a bit bigger boat than my little Contessa 32 and probably have bigger needs but it would be good to talk about what you are doing.

Thanks,
Tom

Guess my handle gave it away! I'll send you a PM.

[OS2Dude]

We have a 1985 Catalina 30 and added a Webasto FCF Marine Air Conditioner. (16K BTU) It could work on a single 100V 30A shore inlet but if something was already running (Fridge compressor/Cooktop/Microwave) the main breaker would trip when the A/C started. We ended up installing a dedicate 110V 30A inlet just for the A/C.

A big PLUS ONE to using Smart Plugs. Vastly superior to the old-fashioned type of shore power connector.

Having LFP batteries does not have anything to do with shore power. If you have the right equipment, you can charge LFP with just wind/solar and a DC-DC charger to use the alternator as well. (We don't have a plugin battery charger.)