MPPT solar controller: Morningstar Prostar v Tristar

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by Jill on Maya

We charge 2 x 12v battery banks from a 660W solar array (2 x 327W) by using a Xantrex Digital Echo-Charge. It's wired between the house bank and starter battery. It allows up to 15 amps (maximum) of the charging current to pass to the starter battery when that batttery's voltage is .5 to 1 volt less than the house bank. There may be other solutions but this works seamlessly. I don't know how it would work for charging a third battery.

That is another solution (Along with the Balmar Duo-Charge that passes 30 amps to the aux battery) - they work well. The Cyrix will give the same result with less expense though. And yes 2 are needed with either - one for each auxiliary battery to be charged.

[SO49]

Thank you both for your help. The Xantrex Echo Charger is the perfect solution.

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by SO49

Thank you both for your help. The Xantrex Echo Charger is the perfect solution.

FYI

Echo Charger Use Warning from Maine Sail: Xantrex Echo Charger Rant - SailNet Community

[SO49]

My plan is to use two of these Xantrex Echo Chargers to feed each of the secondary banks from the house bank. I think I can leave the diode isolator in place to be used for non-solar charging from shore power, generator and alternator. ( I say this because when charging through the isolator there should be no voltage differential between the house bank and the two secondary banks. As a result, the Xantrex will turn on but won't do anything.)

Jeff

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by SO49

My plan is to use two of these Xantrex Echo Chargers to feed each of the secondary banks from the house bank. I think I can leave the diode isolator in place to be used for non-solar charging from shore power, generator and alternator. ( I say this because when charging through the isolator there should be no voltage differential between the house bank and the two secondary banks. As a result, the Xantrex will turn on but won't do anything.)

Jeff

Best to wire the shore power charger direct to the house bank and let the Echos take care of the secondary banks. Most chargers will not produce current if they do not see a battery.

There will be a small voltage differential between house and secondary banks as there always is with diodes. This is explained in the link I provided in a previous post.

Also see Stu's link above re Xantrex Echo Charge as it is important.

[Jill on Maya]

Mitiempo

As a Victron dealer perhaps you can assist with solution to one or both of the small issues we have with the BlueSolar 100/30 controllers and the VE Direct to Bluetooth Smart dongles.

We have 2 PV arrays and 2 controllers. Using the Victron App on an Iphone both controllers appear on the Discovery screen in the App with identical names “VE Direct Smart MPPT 100/30 ”. There is nothing to indicate which is which. As you can imagine it would be much better/ less confusing if I could tell which controller’s data is on the screen. Do you know if there is a way to rename them or add a suffix (eg port/stbd or 1/2)? The Manual doesn’t list this as one of the setup options. I can try emailing Victron but don't know how responsive they are to questions.

The second problem is that when the controllers are working they create some annoying static on the AM radio band. The controllers are fitted about 1.5m from the radio. The one closest (by about 200mm) to the radio causes more static than the other but I don’t know whether the closer distance is what makes the static worse. Its not practical to move either the radio or the controllers. Do you have a suggestion as to how to prevent the interference?

[SO49]

Originally Posted by mitiempo

Best to wire the shore power charger direct to the house bank and let the Echos take care of the secondary banks. Most chargers will not produce current if they do not see a battery.

There will be a small voltage differential between house and secondary banks as there always is with diodes. This is explained in the link I provided in a previous post.

Also see Stu's link above re Xantrex Echo Charge as it is important.

Yes, I read the whole rant. Most of the issues he mentioned have either been corrected in the current manual or I pretty much figured out from studying the how the manual describes the device.

As I mentioned, the boat is presently configured with all charging sources feeding in through the isolator (shore power, alternator and generator). It's worked this way since we had the generator installed ten years ago. I'm reluctant to re-wire that. Which is why I'm suggesting we wire the solar panel controller output directly to the house battery and add in two Xantrex EC's to charge to two auxiliary battery banks from the house bank.

My understanding of how the Xantrex EC works from the manual and Stu's rant is that;

(1) when the house bank is not being charged by ANY source the Xantrex EC does not turn on since the house bank voltage is under 13.0 volts. Thus, the diode isolator will do its job and prevent one battery bank from depleting the others

(2) when the house bank is being charged by the solar controller (which is wired directly to the house bank and not the other banks) the house bank voltage will rise, exceed the 13.0 voltage threshold and the Xantrex EC's will turn on and start feeding current to the other battery banks being limited to 15 amps

(3) when the other charging sources kick in through the diode isolator the voltages of all battery banks will begin to rise and exceed the 13.0 volt threshold. The Xantrex EC's will turn on and to the extent the house bank voltage is higher than the other banks, the Xantrex's will feed current to the other batteries from the house battery. This will be self-limiting since once the voltage differential disappears or turns the other way the Xantrex will stop charging any secondary bank.

This setup should solve my problem about how to integrate solar. Let me know what you think. Please poke holes.

Jeff

[CarlF]

+1 for the Victron MPPT controllers. Just installed two. The optional $50 bluetooth dongle lets you set absorption and float charge voltages right where you want them. Also has built in temperature compensation. And maintains a history of your charging.

The smaller ones (I got the 15 amp units) can be found for less than $100. A great price for a high quality MPPT controller. MPPT works better if you give each solar panel (or in my case, pair of solar panels installed next to each other), their own controller.

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by Jill on Maya

Mitiempo

As a Victron dealer perhaps you can assist with solution to one or both of the small issues we have with the BlueSolar 100/30 controllers and the VE Direct to Bluetooth Smart dongles.

We have 2 PV arrays and 2 controllers. Using the Victron App on an Iphone both controllers appear on the Discovery screen in the App with identical names “VE Direct Smart MPPT 100/30 ”. There is nothing to indicate which is which. As you can imagine it would be much better/ less confusing if I could tell which controller’s data is on the screen. Do you know if there is a way to rename them or add a suffix (eg port/stbd or 1/2)? The Manual doesn’t list this as one of the setup options. I can try emailing Victron but don't know how responsive they are to questions.

The second problem is that when the controllers are working they create some annoying static on the AM radio band. The controllers are fitted about 1.5m from the radio. The one closest (by about 200mm) to the radio causes more static than the other but I don’t know whether the closer distance is what makes the static worse. Its not practical to move either the radio or the controllers. Do you have a suggestion as to how to prevent the interference?

I searched Victron's site including the blog on the dongles and could find nothing related to an identifier for each controller. I suggest you email Vader at Victron and ask. https://www.victronenergy.com/live/v...h_smart_dongle

As far as the AM radio interference I'm not sure what I would do. Possibly shielding the controller or its wiring may help.

Good luck.

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by SO49

Yes, I read the whole rant. Most of the issues he mentioned have either been corrected in the current manual or I pretty much figured out from studying the how the manual describes the device.

As I mentioned, the boat is presently configured with all charging sources feeding in through the isolator (shore power, alternator and generator). It's worked this way since we had the generator installed ten years ago. I'm reluctant to re-wire that. Which is why I'm suggesting we wire the solar panel controller output directly to the house battery and add in two Xantrex EC's to charge to two auxiliary battery banks from the house bank.

My understanding of how the Xantrex EC works from the manual and Stu's rant is that;

(1) when the house bank is not being charged by ANY source the Xantrex EC does not turn on since the house bank voltage is under 13.0 volts. Thus, the diode isolator will do its job and prevent one battery bank from depleting the others

(2) when the house bank is being charged by the solar controller (which is wired directly to the house bank and not the other banks) the house bank voltage will rise, exceed the 13.0 voltage threshold and the Xantrex EC's will turn on and start feeding current to the other battery banks being limited to 15 amps

(3) when the other charging sources kick in through the diode isolator the voltages of all battery banks will begin to rise and exceed the 13.0 volt threshold. The Xantrex EC's will turn on and to the extent the house bank voltage is higher than the other banks, the Xantrex's will feed current to the other batteries from the house battery. This will be self-limiting since once the voltage differential disappears or turns the other way the Xantrex will stop charging any secondary bank.

This setup should solve my problem about how to integrate solar. Let me know what you think. Please poke holes.

Jeff

That will work well. I don't see any problems with the solar to house and Echos to auxiliary banks. I would replace the fuse holders that come with the Echo as they are terrible. Waterproof ATO holders and fuses are a much better way to go.

As far as the diode isolator its job is to split charge from any source attached to it, typically an alternator. It is a fixed input dual (or more) output device that will not allow current to reverse. Archaic by today's wiring methods but as long as it works its ok. I would rewire the shore power charger directly to the house bank and allow the Echos to take care of the other batteries though. They deserve the proper voltage and this will be reduced slightly with the isolator unless the charger has been adjusted to compensate.

You also state that the generator is wired to the isolator. The generator, unless it is a DC generator, will have a low output I would think. Better to use the generator, if AC, to power the shore charger for better results.

[SO49]

Originally Posted by mitiempo

That will work well. I don't see any problems with the solar to house and Echos to auxiliary banks. I would replace the fuse holders that come with the Echo as they are terrible. Waterproof ATO holders and fuses are a much better way to go.

As far as the diode isolator its job is to split charge from any source attached to it, typically an alternator. It is a fixed input dual (or more) output device that will not allow current to reverse. Archaic by today's wiring methods but as long as it works its ok. I would rewire the shore power charger directly to the house bank and allow the Echos to take care of the other batteries though. They deserve the proper voltage and this will be reduced slightly with the isolator unless the charger has been adjusted to compensate.

You also state that the generator is wired to the isolator. The generator, unless it is a DC generator, will have a low output I would think. Better to use the generator, if AC, to power the shore charger for better results.

I think you're correct about the generator. My mistake. Now that I think of it I have an 'AC' selector on the AC panel that let's me switch between the 30amp inlet, 50amp inlet, generator and 'off'. And then an AC breaker for the charger.

Jeff

[SO49]

On the subject of trying to go totally 'green' I haven't figured out what to do about the hot water heater. Seems a waste to run the generator to make hot water. I guess we could use the inverter for the 120 volts needed to heat water but seems very inefficient.

Any suggestions

[mitiempo]

Originally Posted by SO49

On the subject of trying to go totally 'green' I haven't figured out what to do about the hot water heater. Seems a waste to run the generator to make hot water. I guess we could use the inverter for the 120 volts needed to heat water but seems very inefficient.

Any suggestions

With very rare exceptions running an inverter to heat water or air does not work.

Best to run the engine (if it has a cooling loop through the water heater) for 20 minutes. Or the generator if it is so plumbed.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by mitiempo

With very rare exceptions running an inverter to heat water or air does not work.

Best to run the engine (if it has a cooling loop through the water heater) for 20 minutes. Or the generator if it is so plumbed.

Agree with above but add that diesel heaters are a great option too. Check out Typhoon's posts on the matter. (Typhoon is a CF member)

[Copacabana]

Originally Posted by SO49

On the subject of trying to go totally 'green' I haven't figured out what to do about the hot water heater. Seems a waste to run the generator to make hot water. I guess we could use the inverter for the 120 volts needed to heat water but seems very inefficient.

Any suggestions

A simple solar shower works well too! Very efficient and "green"!