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Old 04-07-2022, 00:28   #1
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Lithium Batteries, better to

Hi guys I will have about 3x550 watt solar panels =1650 watts total on my 34' catamaran. I want to have 4800 watt hours of lithium batteries. I originally wanted to just get 2x 24Vx100AH lithium batteries but the local battery supplier only has 12Vx14AH batteries in stock, so I would need 28 of those batteries to get the 4800 watt hours I want. Are there any advantages or disadvantages to using 28 of the smaller batteries (12Vx14AH) vs just 2 of the bigger (24Vx100AH) batteries. Price is about the same. I figure with the 28 batteries, if a few of them were to be defective, it would be much easier and more affordable to replace than the bigger lithium batteries. Are there any upsides to having the bigger batteries.


I'm in a 3rd world country so trying to import the 24V x 100AH lithium batteries would be a logistical nightmare that I have yet to solve. It would be much easier to buy the smaller batteries here.

Thanks in advance for any advice!
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Old 04-07-2022, 01:47   #2
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

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Originally Posted by sailor4life7777 View Post
Hi guys I will have about 3x550 watt solar panels =1650 watts total on my 34' catamaran. I want to have 4800 watt hours of lithium batteries. I originally wanted to just get 2x 24Vx100AH lithium batteries but the local battery supplier only has 12Vx14AH batteries in stock, so I would need 28 of those batteries to get the 4800 watt hours I want. Are there any advantages or disadvantages to using 28 of the smaller batteries (12Vx14AH) vs just 2 of the bigger (24Vx100AH) batteries. Price is about the same. I figure with the 28 batteries, if a few of them were to be defective, it would be much easier and more affordable to replace than the bigger lithium batteries. Are there any upsides to having the bigger batteries.


I'm in a 3rd world country so trying to import the 24V x 100AH lithium batteries would be a logistical nightmare that I have yet to solve. It would be much easier to buy the smaller batteries here.

Thanks in advance for any advice!
where are you from. do you https://www.aliexpress.com delivery to your contry
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Old 04-07-2022, 06:21   #3
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

Assuming these are drop in units with internal BMS's.



It is my understanding that there is a limit to the number of batteries you can parallel because of the individual BMS's ability to balance all the cells. Also if for some reason one battery is down or going down then there is a possibility that the BMS on that battery would not be sized sufficiently to cope with the full charging current if all the other BMS had reached full charge condition.


I maybe completely wrong so anyone with more detailed knowledge please chip in because every day is school day.


Can't help but think that since you are in a 3rd world country that conventional batteries would be the way to go.
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Old 04-07-2022, 06:32   #4
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

You seem to have a mismatch between your solar array size and the battery capacity you are designing for.

I’d expect a 1650 Watt array to produce 5000 watt hours a day of power. Without knowing anything else about your electric needs, either your array is too big or your battery specification is too small.
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Old 04-07-2022, 18:16   #5
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

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You seem to have a mismatch between your solar array size and the battery capacity you are designing for.

I’d expect a 1650 Watt array to produce 5000 watt hours a day of power. Without knowing anything else about your electric needs, either your array is too big or your battery specification is too small.

The balance of 5KWh of solar daily and 4.8kWh of lithium storage sounds reasonable. If he's using around 5kWh per day (call it 400Ah @ 12V nominal) , half the output goes to loads during the day, the other half goes to replenishing the Ah used during the night - a bit over 50% discharge of his 400AH batteries each night.
(If he was using LA, then he'd probably want to increase his battery capacity)
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Old 04-07-2022, 21:23   #6
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

We can discuss and argue about having a few batteries in parallel vs one larger battery, but I think 28 small batteries is quite excessive. I think you would run into problems.

The specifics of the batteries, how they are constructed, what type of BMS is used, etc. would affect how well they would work. Make sure they are LiFePO4, and under no circumstances use something else. You really don't want to use a battery only because it was what was in stock.

Don't forget to consider in the cost of enough wire to wire all of those batteries, with equal lengths to each one, bus bars, fuses etc. Copper is expensive, and you would need a lot of it.

I would look at known quality brands, and approach your local battery supplier and see if he can get them. He might be knowledgeable and willing to go through the hassle and expense of importing them for a large sale. If that doesn't work, put in the effort yourself. Maybe they can be shipped to another cruiser that is headed your way. Or maybe you can pay the duty and ship them directly to you.
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Old 04-07-2022, 21:29   #7
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

Quote:
Originally Posted by ItDepends View Post
You seem to have a mismatch between your solar array size and the battery capacity you are designing for.

Id expect a 1650 Watt array to produce 5000 watt hours a day of power. Without knowing anything else about your electric needs, either your array is too big or your battery specification is too small.
Nothing wrong with that. He won't produce 5kW every day, and during the day he will be powering loads in addition to charging the battery. If his power needs are high, he could find that he has enough battery, and needs more solar.
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Old 05-07-2022, 00:49   #8
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

From my experience I would avoid the 48 cell option and wait till you can get big cells.
My first installation was a 180 Ah "battery" (built in BMS) that had an array of 9Ah cells. It's fine till something goes wrong. If any of the cells get compromised you lose capacity in that bank and your BMS will struggle. If you need to replace a cell you need to get one that matches your others. If yours have a few years under the belt a new one of the same won't match. I had an issue and the supplier managed to find some older cells that more or less matched mine.
I now run 4x 300Ah cells, much better. I also noted that most "Battery"offerings have large capacity cells and not arrays of small ones.
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Old 05-07-2022, 03:27   #9
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

Based on not knowing your location or circumstances, and given good advice from others, Id consider using what you have (or dropping in a couple of AGMs and taking a cruise to somewhere, hopefully not too far, where you can get a quality LiFePo setup. Possible?
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Old 05-07-2022, 03:45   #10
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

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Originally Posted by sailor4life7777 View Post
.


I'm in a 3rd world country so trying to import the 24V x 100AH lithium batteries would be a logistical nightmare that I have yet to solve. It would be much easier to buy the smaller batteries here.

Thanks in advance for any advice!
What 3rd world country?
Perhaps others have experience.
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Old 05-07-2022, 09:34   #11
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

Depends on what third world country ? I bought 4 Winston 400amp hour cells and they were flown in and delivered to my door with an all in price up front to a third world country within 10 days. China has a way to move things quickly in third world countries ..
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Old 07-07-2022, 07:27   #12
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Re: Lithium Batteries, better to

Thanks for all the advice guys I really appreciate it! And thanks for the aliexpress suggestion, they do ship to my country!! I'm looking at this lithium 24vx100ah battery, but the case doesn't look like it would be good for a marine environment, what do you guys think? I included the product link below. I was thinking I can make a waterproof container for it either with styrofoam/epoxy (although not sure styrofoam would be a good idea due to heat retention) or wood/fiberglass/epoxy. What do you guys think?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give!!!


https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005...69486449%21sea
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