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Old 02-12-2017, 04:51   #16
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

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Originally Posted by fstbttms View Post
I believe the hull/keel joint issue is what we call "burnback" and it is due to improper priming of the underlying metal.
That may be possible, but I had seven coats of Interprotect 2000e on the keel, and seem like that would explain the similar symptoms at the metal through hulls that are connected by the bonding wire which were also coated with Interprotect? Also seems odd that it would affect both sides of the keel in the location of the same keel bolt - the one with the bonding wire attached to it.
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Old 02-12-2017, 05:01   #17
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

In the linked article, the author suggests decoupling the VHF antenna from the DC ground system by means of an inner/outer DC block. This is not a dime store piece of equipment and I am wondering why mounting the VHF whip on a non-conductive bracket wouldn't accomplish the same goal? The only issue I can see is that with the author's method the mast (and stays) are connected to the keel for lightning "protection", and the antenna whip would then be isolated from this system. Even if this means the DC grounding system is then vulnerable via the antenna whip, it seems that in practical experience this protection system is at best unreliable since most of the instruments in a strike are wiped out anyway?
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Old 02-12-2017, 08:58   #18
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

As a boat is supposed to have only one common ground point, decoupling the VHF is exactly what I did.
Operation is unaffected.
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Old 02-12-2017, 12:08   #19
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

Question for BoatPoker or other knowledgeable person: why is a large conductor (ie 8 ga) required for bonding? Surely the currents involved are very small, so voltage drop would be infinitesimal, so I'm wondering. And why is an insulated conductor needed? And finally, if the "wrap and clamp" method is not good enough (and I can see that it is quite prone to corrosion in a damp bilge), what is the best means of connecting to a typical through hull and valve setup as seen on most production boats these days? No handy bolts there for a ring terminal...

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Old 02-12-2017, 13:26   #20
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

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Question for BoatPoker or other knowledgeable person: why is a large conductor (ie 8 ga) required for bonding? Surely the currents involved are very small, so voltage drop would be infinitesimal, so I'm wondering. And why is an insulated conductor needed? And finally, if the "wrap and clamp" method is not good enough (and I can see that it is quite prone to corrosion in a damp bilge), what is the best means of connecting to a typical through hull and valve setup as seen on most production boats these days? No handy bolts there for a ring terminal...

Jim
ABYC does not require an insulated conductor although that is an acceptable option.

The big issue is resistance. Given that many of these conductors may be in bilge water at some point (Corrosion) and distances between bond points may be significant and the very low voltages involved, the heavy conductor helps ensure the current will flow as required.

I'll be happy to respond with a copy of the Cathodic Protection Standard if you email me boatpoker@gmail.com
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Old 03-12-2017, 09:33   #21
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

Boatpoker Post #20
You are correct about trying to minimize resistance in the bonding circuit. However; per the current ABYC E2 "Cathodic Protection":
Quote:
2.5.8.1Cathodic bonding conductors shall be oil resistant insulated, tinned,stranded copper wire, or uninsulated copper strip. Copper braidor copper tubingshall not be used for this purpose,
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Old 03-12-2017, 10:03   #22
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

Just as I said, insulated conductor is not required.

2.5.8.1Cathodic bonding conductors shall be oil resistant insulated, tinned,stranded copper wire, or uninsulated copper strip. Copper braid or copper tubingshall not be used for this purpose,
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:23   #23
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

and what's wrong with copper tubing??
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:29   #24
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

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and what's wrong with copper tubing??
ABYC forbids it.
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Old 03-12-2017, 11:40   #25
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

given ABYC's track record, I have to ask why?

If copper strapping is OK, why not flattened copper tubing?
Why not unflattened copper tubing?
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Old 03-12-2017, 13:24   #26
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

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ABYC forbids it.
The ABYC can't require anything they can only recommended .
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Old 03-12-2017, 13:26   #27
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Re: Bonding, electrolysis questions

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given ABYC's track record, I have to ask why?

If copper strapping is OK, why not flattened copper tubing?
Why not unflattened copper tubing?
Don you can actually do it with whatever you have or want to do it with.
There are no rules to follow for it .
The ABYC can only make recommendations.
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