24 V DC Genset?

[stefano_ita]

Hi all

I saw that around here some people need 110 v ac /220 v ac for domestic appliance, and i don't think you want to turn on a genset maybe for 2 minutes just to run a 1500watt coffee machines;

Meaning i guess everybody here (especially liveaboard) has 12 or 24 v dc home battery pack with a inverter to AC, and maybe some add a second large alternator on the main engine to keep the battery charged during more consuming time, but, what about a small single cylinder, with heat exchanger for hot water coupled with a 12 or 24 v dc big truck alternator (let's say 200 amp)?

I asked for this 720 USD, included 24v starter, waiting for a quote for shipping to europe

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/hot-sale-vertical-single-cylinder-diesel_685485778.html

It will work as close circuit with the boiler, and adding a thermostatic valve on the pipe returning to the engine to make the cooling water pass throught the original radiator to cool it down (radiator inside a closed pipe with a fan in front of it, discharging hot air outside the engine room/ ouside the hull)

With a 2:1 pulley, lets run it 1800 rpm (on 2300 rpm max), x 2= 3600= full power from alternator.

I known people who did it but with air cooled grasscutter GASOLINE engine, not with a strong diesel (ok chinese)


What do you think about it?

Thanks
Stefano

[stefano_ita]

Get the quote for sea shipping, 4 month (if i understood well)for 75 USD!

[chris in SG]

I like the idea and have often considered trying a similar arrangement. The weight of the engine is disappointing though - 136kg? That's excluding the frame you will need to build and the alternator itself. The total package will be more than 150kg. I would be inclined to do some research on lightweight diesels before you decide..

[Hobie_ind]

Where are you thinking of mounting it?

A couple considerations come to mind:
- In an engine room, the radiator (instead of a normal marine raw water/coolant exchanger) will add to the heat load in there. (Edit...sorry I just reread your post and see your hot water heater/ducting plan)
- Routing the hot exhaust is a consideration unless you work up a raw water pump and water lift muffler setup, but there's additional cost and complexity you're trying to get away from.
- Parts availability...now and a couple of years down the road. I know it's cheap and could almost be thought of as disposable, but there's also the investment (time and money) in installation that needs to be considered as you may not find that same unit for replacement a few years down the road.

It may be a great idea, but I think I'd spend the money on solar and a high output alternator for the main engine before adding a generator.

Even on our boat (which is a heavy power user!), with the solar we added last year, our generator time has dropped so much I'm not sure I'd replace it if it packed it in. I'd probably spend the money on a Watt & Sea hydrogenerator and lithium batteries instead. (But don't tell the other Amel guys ;-) they'll think I've lost my mind, and want to take away my club membership)

Mark

[Krilleonnova]

be careful customs might take it at the border if it does not have CE marking and emission cert compliant with EPA or EU directives
Chinese seldom comply

You need heatexchanger if you are in salt water You need wet exhaust for fire protection

How big battery bank you have no use for more than 25 Amps per
100 Ah as the batts will not avccept more unless you go above
14.8 Volt (12 v system) or 30v (24v) and if you do that you cook your batts.

In. Sault ste Marie Canada(by the locks to lake Superior) a guy by the name of Philip has started developing a neat unit called RUDOLF
Rudolf Diesel i persume

At max 150 amp 12V. or 75 amp 24volt weight around 30 kgs it looks like
the perfect unit for battchargeing avoiding glased liners in you prop engine due to long hours low load low themp
It has dual watersystem and the generator is watercooled and wet exhaust
so you can install it enclosed only need combution air take an old vacuum vleaner hose for that
send me you co-ordinates to Mapleboat@yahoo.ca and I hook you up with Phil.

I think he want 3-4 times what you indicate above but then it has CE and is ready to drop in.

[stefano_ita]

Thanks all for the answer

Weight is not a problem, it will be in a new steel motorsailer 46 ft, 28.000 kgs, (56.000lbs)...

I found lighter diesel but all air cooled, it's very hard to find small water cooled diesel (any idea, advice on brand? links?)

Mounted in the engine room, in the bilge, no problem for space, but honestly i didn't thought about the heat from the exhaust manifold; for sure covered with heat protection and what if i connect it directly to the exhaust system of the main engine (dry exhaust, it would work),

About the reliability, i've read that sometimes have problem on starting motor, but for all the rest they are bulletproof, used for years no stop in small tractor in the farm in china and all the asia...it's 1 liter for 13 hp, low revving...Less sprinted than any heavy duty engine

For sure i will buy some resplacement parts with the engine...

I would want it because i don't want to run the main engine, without pratically any load on it, maybe for a pair of hours every 2-3 days, if not more, just to recharge the battery with a bigger alternator...

The use would be full time liveaboard, with everything, from air conditioning, to induction coocking, washing machine, wife's hair dryer ...

I already included 2x 400 watt wind generator and 4 x 250 watt photovoltaic panels; i don't want to waste diesel (especially here in italy where is about 1,5 euro/liter, so no webasto) but for example during winter when at 4 pm is dark and no wind, you need a hot shower, a warm place, than 2 seabass in the oven (30 minutes at 2000watt;D)...Heat and energy in just one machine, especially to do not need to produce heat with electricity...


Thanks krillernoova,

8 x12 v 200 amp pb battery in parallel series, 24 v 800 amp at 19,2 kwh, with pure sine wave 230v ac inverter..No problem even with 2 x 200 amp alternator...

[Dougtiff]

I have in my engine room a " Ample Power " DC generator, which comprises of a Kubota water cooled single cylinder 9 HP, driving a large frame 150 Amp. alternator, charging my battery's, sips diesel, very quiet, love it.

[stefano_ita]

Originally Posted by Dougtiff

I have in my engine room a " Ample Power " DC generator, which comprises of a Kubota water cooled single cylinder 9 HP, driving a large frame 150 Amp. alternator, charging my battery's, sips diesel, very quiet, love it.

Thanks, saw it looks nice...but 4-5 thousand dollar

I still have a very big dubt about the small 24 v dc genset or 2 bigger alternator on the main engine

[Hobie_ind]

Given your load list I see where you have to have a generator. I can also see where reliability would be an important factor.

Does your current boat have an electric stove/oven? We've got some friends with a boat equipped very similarly to what you're describing. the electric stove/oven they've had to change plans significantly over the past year as they've been marina-bound on and off for over 4 with nagging generator issues (waiting on parts, troubleshooting, etc, etc,). It's severely limited their movement this year..

I understand the safety considerations, but I do like having a propane stove as cooking becomes one of the few heavy electrical loads that turns the generator into a 'critical' item if your stove is electric. For the record, I also have a small two burner hot plate that can run off the inverter or generator as a backup if we have major propane issues.

Just a thought for consideration?

[stefano_ita]

Hi Hobie,

i even thought, ordinary induction coocking, a 2 place old style resistance electric (feeded by another inverter) coocker, and a methane (easy to find and quite cheap here) 2 fire burner, just to be sure that whatever happen there is a redundancy.

Yes also electric oven wich we use it quite often...