110v 220v definitions WHY?

[tarian]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Not at all, if you stay in one country. Travel around even Europe as many of us have done and its a real pain even just changing plugs on every household item, never mind dealing with voltages and frequencies. What I did in the end was use lots of extension leads so you only have to change one plug. Fire risks? well lets not go there

Indeedy dod da

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mains_...ity_by_country

One should always adopt the UK plug and voltage and then we would be alright

[Pansatonic]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Not at all, if you stay in one country. Travel around even Europe as many of us have done and its a real pain even just changing plugs on every household item, never mind dealing with voltages and frequencies. What I did in the end was use lots of extension leads so you only have to change one plug. Fire risks? well lets not go there

Every country in Europe is 230v 50hz nominal standard. Only plugs and tolerances are different and the tolerance differences are in practial non existing betweeen countries in Europe. So plugs issue yes, voltages no.

[Pansatonic]

Originally Posted by blubaju

Think all your questions are answered HERE:
https://www.worldstandards.eu/electr...ndard-voltage/

Article states "Europe and most other countries in the world use a voltage which is twice that of the US. It is between 220 and 240 volts, whereas in Japan and in most of the Americas the voltage is between 100 and 127 volts."

True if you count for anomalies, but Europe is 230v, with a tolerance of some. Europe as been a 230v standard compatible a long time. Anomalies exist but does not explain why people for example write an sales advert like "Boat has a 220v inverter".

[Pansatonic]

Originally Posted by tarian

Indeedy dod da

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mains_...ity_by_country

One should always adopt the UK plug and voltage and then we would be alright

I agree on the plug, but voltage standard we already have, those are 120v and 230v.

[Kelkara]

Originally Posted by Pansatonic

True if you count for anomalies, but Europe is 230v, with a tolerance of some. Europe as been a 230v standard compatible a long time.

Well kinda ... its 230V +10%/-6% ... that range includes both 220V and 240V ... so when they "harmonised" the voltages across countries to 230V ... countries that were generating 220V carried on generating 220V, and countries generating 240V carried on generating 240V ... both complying with the new "230V" standard. Which is why the nominally 230V electricity in the UK is generally referred to as 240V ... because that's what it is.

[tarian]

Originally Posted by Pansatonic

Every country in Europe is 230v 50hz nominal standard. Only plugs and tolerances are different and the tolerance differences are in practial non existing betweeen countries in Europe. So plugs issue yes, voltages no.

I know were leaving the EU union because of Brexit (or not ) but us in the UK are 240 volt its all the pesky Jonny foreigners that keep changing it around

[Pansatonic]

Originally Posted by Kelkara

Well kinda ... its 230V +10%/-6% ... that range includes both 220V and 240V ... so when they "harmonised" the voltages across countries to 230V ... countries that were generating 220V carried on generating 220V, and countries generating 240V carried on generating 240V ... both complying with the new "230V" standard. Which is why the nominally 230V electricity in the UK is generally referred to as 240V ... because that's what it is.

This is "wong", countries in Europe has not "carried on" with old standards. They have actually changed. For example scandinavia that had 220v is 230v and this was changed 20years ago. 20years ago!

I am ofcource without exact measurments for every households in all europe, but dont for a second think this is only a "230v eu standard on paper" discussion. Its real...

Becouse its a open goal... Brexit might reverse UK to 240v everything is possible there.

[Pansatonic]

Originally Posted by tarian

I know were leaving the EU union because of Brexit (or not ) but us in the UK are 240 volt its all the pesky Jonny foreigners that keep changing it around

Do you really have 240v at you incoming? I have UK friends and they are 230v plus minus some.

[Cadence]

I hope someone can substantiate this. It would seem the European system is more like three phase in the US, where single phase is the norm. for other than industrial applications.

[oleman]

In my technical reference library is a copy of The "Dranetz Field Handbook for Power Quality Analysis" dated 1991.
I highly recommend that owners with power distribution questions, beg borrow or steal a copy of this text book.
Every thing about USA domestic AC mains distribution from power generation to the equipment that requires it.

Glossy pages, oscilloscope waveform diagrams, color pictures and technical data.

[Kelkara]

Originally Posted by Pansatonic

I am ofcource without exact measurments for every households in all europe, but dont for a second think this is only a "230v eu standard on paper" discussion. Its real...

The plan might be to make it real, but it's optimistic to think that electricity infrastructure was all replaced overnight ... it's gonna take decades at best.

I know wikipedia isn't really authoratative but it's all I can be bothered to look up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mains_...Voltage_levels

Following voltage harmonisation, electricity supplies within the European Union are now nominally 230 V ±10% at 50 Hz.[11] For a transition period (1995–2008), countries that had previously used 220 V changed to a narrower asymmetric tolerance range of 230 V +6%/−10% and those (like the UK) that had previously used 240 V changed to 230 V +10%/−6%.[12] No change in voltage is required by either system as both 220 V and 240 V fall within the lower 230 V tolerance bands (230 V ±6%). Some areas of the UK still have 250 volts for legacy reasons, but these also fall within the 10% tolerance band of 230 volts. In practice, this allows countries to continue to supply the same voltage (220 or 240 V), at least until existing supply transformers are replaced.

So you had better be prepared to find anything from 220V-250V in the EU (higher voltages mostly in UK and Ireland).

The real benefit of the harmonisation to a nominal 230V is that the standard also applies to appliance manufactures who have to make products that can handle the full range of voltage ... so we the consumer don't have to worry about whether we are getting 220V or 240V.

[jmschmidt]

Japan is 110-120 at 50hz for domestic use. Or it was when I was there fifty years ago.

Also, to produce 110-120 at 60hz your genset must run at 1,800 RPM where as for 50hz it runs at 1,500 RPM. 60hz from a genset is a little noisier and my burn a little more fuel at small loads that at 50hz. Most reactive loads (electric motors and such) are sensitive to frequency but most other items don't care. Electronics usually work fine and 50 or 60hrs. and with a wide range of voltage.

Most transport category airplanes produce 120VAC VAC 400hz. It is split up between other AC and DC voltages for various onboard applications by various transformers and rectifiers. Don't plug a household vacuum cleaner into a 400hz. outlet. Saw it done once, it burned up in about a second.

[Pansatonic]

IEC 60038

Fo exampe http://www.cired.net/publications/ci...ers/5/5_25.pdf

"In 1983, the International Electrotechnical Commission,IEC, initiated a program to achieve an international standard 50Hz supply voltage (at the consumer's terminals) of 230/400 volts +- 10% by the year 2003."

"It appears that the post 2003 definition of a 230V supply voltage will be met by all European Economic Community members and most members of UNIPEDE (International Union of Producers and Distributors of Electrical Energy)."

230v standard implemented since 2003 in many many countries, Australia, Europe, UK and others.

Other voltages in a household outlet may exist according to the tolerances but should be considered a anomaly and reported to the energy provider.

I guess its not common known.

[Pansatonic]

Originally Posted by Kelkara

The plan might be to make it real, but it's optimistic to think that electricity infrastructure was all replaced overnight ... it's gonna take decades at best.

I know wikipedia isn't really authoratative but it's all I can be bothered to look up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mains_...Voltage_levels

So you had better be prepared to find anything from 220V-250V in the EU (higher voltages mostly in UK and Ireland).

The real benefit of the harmonisation to a nominal 230V is that the standard also applies to appliance manufactures who have to make products that can handle the full range of voltage ... so we the consumer don't have to worry about whether we are getting 220V or 240V.

UK was included in this IEC. And 2003 was a sort of deadline. I have no statistical facts but i am confident that UK has already migrated. At least the two persons i know in London has 230v.

[Djarraluda]

IEC attempted to clarify and harmonise, most national standards fell into line, but those pesky people of the world will not get their languaging right, still!
3 phase is the base system, single phase being a simple Root 3 on that. Poms used to be 415 (240V single phase), Europe typically 380. Back in 70s and 80s, Hong Kong was weird, 346V (200V). Originated from the first power supplies which were private generation for a shipyard I believe. it stuck. Adoption of 380 V was a gradual tweaking of the tappings on transformers, the public effectively did not know. It was based on the globalisation of equipment. 346 was at extreme bottom end of permitted tolerance for 380V equipment and as demand grew, if voltage dipped below the 346V it created excessive starting currents. Both the 346 and 415 work with a 380V supply and this permits one motor spec for a large market.
Roger