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Old 27-08-2013, 23:04   #31
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Re: Do I need a survey on 2 year old boat?

A meathook is a broken wire that sticks out enough to hook or stab you. It's a clear indication that that piece of rigging needs to be replaced.
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Old 28-08-2013, 03:28   #32
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Originally Posted by Wendi View Post

Pat, that is what I am trying to create in the contract. The reasonable expectations. But how to make that into legaleeeeze, well that is hard.
I think the boat is a great deal, is fairly new, and I don't want any surprises. If you could create this expectation of reasonableness, how would that be expressed on a contract? Any ideas?
Wendi, from reading I understand you are looking to purchase a boat for over 300'000 EUR in Spain.
Get a good surveyor probably something like 3000 EUR, for this money he/she should deliver a first class report.
If you can't find one in Spain, or there is a language problem, fly in someone from UK, this might cost you an other 1000 EUR including flight and lodging
Engage a lawyer to make the contract, lets say an other 2000 EUR, he / she can make the contract according to Spanish law and hopefully all aspects will be covered, depending how well you brief the lawyer.

All in all you spend 6000 EUR for professional services .... Or 2% of the amount you are prepared to spend on your new boat.

I bought without survey, but the value of my boat was one zero less than yours, and I knew I had to spend a substantial amount to upgrade anyhow. As it turned out, I exceeded "my" budget in no time with some "unexpected" issues.... Still fine for me because it is within acceptable limits and she is a 25 year old boat. With a boat in your price category I would rather spend the money on professional advice and services and deduct any findings from the agreed price.
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Old 28-08-2013, 04:34   #33
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I would start with the Florida Yacht Brokers Association contract, an go from there. The contract is used a couple 1000 times a year...

No sense in trying to reinvent the wheel...
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Old 28-08-2013, 12:22   #34
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Re: Do I need a survey on 2 year old boat?

Originally Posted by gspeak View Post
My knowledge only stems from our purchase of an ex-charter L380 2 years ago. I have no legal training etc & I am only basing my advice on what we went through. Considering the amount of money involved I believe that you need to seek as much legal advice as possible, & remember that you are the buyer & that there are a lot of boats for sale out there.

On our Purchase & Sale Agreement which was signed after our offer had been accepted there were clauses to the effect:

The sale of the vessel is subject to satisfactory personal inspection, survey, sea trial.
In the event this sale is subject to survey, the Buyer acknowledges and agrees: All costs of the survey shall be at Buyers expense; written acceptance or rejection of the vessel must be made by the Buyer on or before .......
In the event of rejection the deposit shall be returned to Buyer.

In our case, after our survey, we presented a list of items that the survey revealed, this list was then incorporated into our Acceptance of Vessel as items that had to be repaired / replaced before final settlement date. All was attended to prior to settlement.

I think it is very important that you have the option in writing to withdraw from the purchase dependant on the survey, sea trial & inspection.

Thank you for this Dave. That is just what I felt it should be and what the dealers seem to do. This seller was objecting strongly to a survey and I sent him my text to add to the contract about the survey that would allow me to cancel the deal if there was structural, mechanical or safety issues. THis morning he decided that this was much too complicated to add to the sale. Hmmmm... I guess that is a red flag!
So now I am looking at a 380 that is looking good!

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Old 28-08-2013, 12:51   #35
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Re: Do I need a survey on 2 year old boat?

Normally if a seller doesn't want to get a surveyor involved there is a pretty good reason... Which 380 are you looking at now???
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Old 28-08-2013, 13:11   #36

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Re: Do I need a survey on 2 year old boat?

If even one strand of wire has broken on a cable, usually you discover the first one when you grab the cable and it tears into you. A small tear, but a painful surprise. In the States we call those "meathooks" and if there is even ONE on the surface of a cable, it means there are more broken strands inside, out of sight, so the cable really should be condemned and replaced even if someone says "but there's just one".
You can take a bit of white t-shirt or terry cloth rag, rig it to some line (up & down haul) and run it up and down the rigging to find those aloft. They'll tear off some of the cloth so it flags them easily.
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Old 28-08-2013, 13:35   #37
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Anyone taking legal advice from an Internet forum will find it worth even less than they paid for it. Wendi, you need an attorney knowledgeable in local law of purchase contracts for sure. And you also will need a surveyor but the attorney is more important. A good attorney might steer you away from this deal before the surveyor is even needed.
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