Crew Wanted: Atlantic Crossing: Bahamas > Bermuda > Azores > France

[CaptTL]

Originally Posted by Scottuk

Now there is the rub = you are not asking for money whereas you are from your ad. There is a big difference between the two.

I guess asking people to help subsidise your trip just doesn't sit well with me. I think it is taking advantage of them.

What Scottuk said.

And I might add...
Yes, I used to do deliveries and I know how hard they can be. You should have experienced crew for such a trip. You may find experienced crew who will go along for the ride if expenses are paid, but I doubt many will pay for the privilege. So, then you get inexperienced crew, and you put the boat, you and them at risk.

[Yorki]

Sounds correct to make a contribution, its not the same as asking for a fee.......

[brownoarsman]

This discussion has been had before. Crew contributing in a small way to operating expenses is a common practice, and ranges from bringing the day's beer, to dinners ashore, to monetary contributions. $30 per day is less than buying the captain/owner a nice meal at a shoreside restaurant in many parts of the world. I always bring the supplies when I go out on friends' boats, and not once has anyone turned it down for fear of violating their insurance and I've never heard of this as a pretext for insurance denying a claim. We'll also all chip in for the diesel. Nor, during the times I've interacted with the USCG on the water, have they ever asked if any of my passengers were making any monetary contributions to the trip.

If his insurance company accepts it, it's really a supply and demand thing. If you pay your crew, you have your choice of the best, if you offer a free trip, you'll probably be looking at an experienced but not professional crew, if they contribute to expenses, you'll have a lot of amateurs thrown into the mix as well - which it sounds like you're okay with, so no big deal. For what it's worth, if I had the time, I'd gladly join under the above description!

[brownoarsman]

And just to correct some blatant misinformation in this thread for anyone else reading it, the USCG defines a 'passenger for hire' (i.e. a passenger for whom you'd need a USCG license to carry) as:
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"passenger for hire" means a passenger for whom consideration is contributed as a condition of carriage on the vessel, whether directly or indirectly flowing to the owner, charterer, operator, agent, or any other person have an interest in the vessel.
"consideration" means an economic benefit, inducement, right, or profit including pecuniary payment accruing to an individual, person, or entity, but not including a voluntary sharing of the actual expenses of thevoyage, by monetary contribution or donation of fuel, food, beverage, or other supplies."
Source: http://www.uscg.mil/d7/sectmiami/pdf/6PackCheckList.pdf
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I realise you're not cruising the US, but just for US readers, in the US, you likely shouldn't use any of that contribution to buy your satellite phone, but probably could use it to pay your satellite phone subscription plan.

Now can we let the poor man peaceably look for crew who will voluntarily share expenses without chastising him for being honest enough to ask?

[CaptTL]

Originally Posted by brownoarsman

Crew contributing in a small way to operating expenses is a common practice, and ranges from bringing the day's beer, to dinners ashore, to monetary contributions.

You are precisely correct. I contribute to the boat also without being asked while on a day sail or a couple of days out on the water. However, I think you miss the fine distinction here. A fee is being required upfront as a condition for boarding the boat. The original poster's words exactly:

"This is not a paid position so a daily contribution will be required (but should be lower than 25€(30$)/day, depending on real costs) and you will need to find your own way to and from the boat."

[Scottuk]

Now can we let the poor man peaceably look for crew who will voluntarily share expenses without chastising him for being honest enough to ask?

It is not 'voluntarily' by any definition of the word.

I have done a lot of racing including offshore in OPBs in a number of different countries. I have never been asked to make a financial contribution. I do pay for my share of the food and usually bring along booze etc for the after race debriefing. On boats I have been racing on for a number of years I have paid for various minor things but I was never asked to.

How I read the OP and others like it is: I need help moving my boat, going to a place(s) I have pre-determined and need some financial help to get me there.

[Hoofsmit]

I think the op's sentence needs to be rewritten

"Having taken a year off, I left France for an atlantic loop in July '13, and I will be needing a crew to go back."

[tominny]

Are you guys sailors or lawyers....???

[Scottuk]

Are you guys sailors or lawyers....???

This adds what to the discussion?

[Jacana]

From their comments I would guess neither sailors or lawyers.

[Scottuk]

From their comments I would guess neither sailors or lawyers

Care to justify your comment or do you have nothing to add to the discussion too.

[Jacana]

Originally Posted by Scottuk

This adds what to the discussion?

A boat is made available to anyone to have an amazing experience with little cost .To read stupid comments from people who don't even have a boat ie the old armchair sailors when if they had an ounce of intestinal fortitude and realised that taking up such a generous offer would be probably the best experience in their lives.Yes a small cost to help with expenses-nothing compared with having the guts to go and buy and maintain a boat.
Either do the trip or keep your petty comments to yourselves.

[Scottuk]

Quite a few assumptions there when you do not know what you are talking about, though by your definition I do have guts.

Either do the trip or keep your petty comments to yourselves

What would make my comments petty? I also have to ask what makes you an arbitator of who is a sailor and/or a lawyer?

[Scottuk]

stupid comments

generous offer

I forgot to mention generousity implies nothing in return.

[Jacana]

Originally Posted by Scottuk

Quite a few assumptions there when you do not know what you are talking about, though by your definition I do have guts.



What would make my comments petty? I also have to ask what makes you an arbitator of who is a sailor and/or a lawyer?

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