2 Inexperienced Girls Wanting to Work Hard and Travel

[heronspeak]

I agree that giving a bit of a heads-up isn't patronizing. That is certainly not my intent. Because one would think that two young people looking for crewing opportunities who are willing to work hard and pull their weight shouldn't be subjected to unsolicited sexual advances. But that's just the way it is all too often. I have met far too many misogynistic a-hole "captains" who have no idea what it means to value and respect women. Given that I don't know these women or where they come from or their particular life experience I prefer to err on the side of caution.

[Goosebumps]

point taken, agreed advise ips good, i know i could have used it. I think the advise should be about POWER abuse, lots of likeable people become power freeks when given the unique opportunity to tell other people what to do and how to do it like in captain crew relationship. This power issue enters into the sexual abuse part to. I know crew can be irritating, they dont seem to want to learn or do things on our yachts the way we want them done. But our way is not the only one... My point being that both crew and captain need to grill test each other, go on short sails, go on backpack hike, go to disco, get tipsy together, get in situation where food becomes an issue, observe how other treats me,bers of other sex, and yes i mean also how some women can use power!


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[Old Snipe]

Originally Posted by sailingodyssey

Really atoll? I CAN tell you this...I just bought my FIRST sailboat in March of this year, with little sailiing experience. I only sailed with my boyfriend on his boat for a year. I bought a 30 foot Hunter - yes a 30 ft sailboat. I still consider myself a novice but I can launch, dock AND sail my boat ALONE!!!!!! I can sail her at 6.2 knots with the rail 6 inches from the water. When I get more experienced nad better at sailing, the rail will be under the water. I work on it ALONE, I sail it ALONE, raise the sails ALONE, take the sails down ALONE, replace the sheets, topping lift and furling line ALONE!! I adjust and tune the rigging ALONE. Change belts and oil ALONE. Sand and refinish the teak ALONE! Drop the 35 lb CQR anchor and retrieve it ALONE! And guess what???? I didn't sleep with ANYBODY to be able to do that. I take offense to what you said. I also belong to the local Yacht Club and there are SO many women that sail and boat there that we have our own group - Women on the Water. Shame on you for insinuating that sailing is male dominated - ESPECIALLY to two girls that are interested enough and brave enough to post on this forum. I'm not a young girl either, so if I can do it any woman can - if that is what they WANT to do. Anyway - just my two cents. Maybe you just posted those comments to stir up trouble on here. If so...shame on you - again.

As a retired Navy Engineman, I have spent a lot of years around smaller service craft. Tugs, MK6, MK8, Gigs, and various other service craft. I have had dozens of young female sailors on deck and down in the engine rooms.

The ones that "took to it" where every bit as valuable to me as any male . There were a few that were afraid to break a nail or take on hard labor, but they were the exception.........not the norm. I have been around many female "boatswain mates" that were very impressive in their knowledge and expertise. Some of these ladies went on to running their own boats. I was lucky to have served with them.

[Goosebumps]

Originally Posted by Old Snipe

As a retired Navy Engineman, I have spent a lot of years around smaller service craft. Tugs, MK6, MK8, Gigs, and various other service craft. I have had dozens of young female sailors on deck and down in the engine rooms.



The ones that "took to it" where every bit as valuable to me as any male . There were a few that were afraid to break a nail or take on hard labor, but they were the exception.........not the norm. I have been around many female "boatswain mates" that were very impressive in their knowledge and expertise. Some of these ladies went on to running their own boats. I was lucky to have served with them.

good for you thats the spirit, have similar experience just not in the navy


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[jtsailjt]

Originally Posted by Old Snipe

As a retired Navy Engineman, I have spent a lot of years around smaller service craft. Tugs, MK6, MK8, Gigs, and various other service craft. I have had dozens of young female sailors on deck and down in the engine rooms.

The ones that "took to it" where every bit as valuable to me as any male . There were a few that were afraid to break a nail or take on hard labor, but they were the exception.........not the norm. I have been around many female "boatswain mates" that were very impressive in their knowledge and expertise. Some of these ladies went on to running their own boats. I was lucky to have served with them.

No one has suggested that females are inherently less capable in the engine room or in any other crew position aboard a boat, once they learn the job. But as far as we know, these two particular females have not yet learned the job or even begun to learn the job or to do anything else to prepare themselves to someday become the type of crewmember about whom their shipmates will say I was lucky to have sailed with them or that their expertise was impressive. Also, these 2 young ladies have inquired about sailing on yachts, NOT about enlisting in the Navy. Yes, both are done on the water but that's about where the similarities end. In so many ways, crewing on civilian yachts is a whole different world from the sort of lifestyle you lived in the Navy.

Some on this forum have tried to help them by stating what is obvious. Since they currently have NO expertise around boats, someone offering them a crew position may well be more interested in other abilities or characteristics they may possess, other than their non-existent sailing or crewing expertise. Just a heads-up to them that the way it is out there and they can do with that info what they want and it's pretty important that they realize it exists. But nobody has said that females in general aboard a boat have value only as sex objects or that they can't eventually learn to become just as trusted and valuable crew as any man.

[fatherchronica]

Latitude38.com regularly publishes instructions on how to hitchhike around on boats. Where to go, what to say. They also have a crew list on their website where you can sign up to crew or travel, and they give advice on how to fill it out. Good luck, maybe we will see you out there someday.

[Goosebumps]

Originally Posted by jtsailjt

No one has suggested that females are inherently less capable in the engine room or in any other crew position aboard a boat, once they learn the job. But as far as we know, these two particular females have not yet learned the job or even begun to learn the job or to do anything else to prepare themselves to someday become the type of crewmember about whom their shipmates will say I was lucky to have sailed with them or that their expertise was impressive. Also, these 2 young ladies have inquired about sailing on yachts, NOT about enlisting in the Navy. Yes, both are done on the water but that's about where the similarities end. In so many ways, crewing on civilian yachts is a whole different world from the sort of lifestyle you lived in the Navy.

Some on this forum have tried to help them by stating what is obvious. Since they currently have NO expertise around boats, someone offering them a crew position may well be more interested in other abilities or characteristics they may possess, other than their non-existent sailing or crewing expertise. Just a heads-up to them that the way it is out there and they can do with that info what they want and it's pretty important that they realize it exists. But nobody has said that females in general aboard a boat have value only as sex objects or that they can't eventually learn to become just as trusted and valuable crew as any man.

isnt it very obvious that there is a chip on our shoulders when we have to keep talking about those "females" and evaluate their capacities to sail. Why we dont warn, care about young boys who are as vulnerable to similar abuse as ladies, no no advise for "boys"


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[jkindredpdx]

Originally Posted by ontherocks83

Ouch! We don't even know if English is their first language yet.

They must be American to make that mistake.


JimK

[jtsailjt]

Originally Posted by Goosebumps

isnt it very obvious that there is a chip on our shoulders when we have to keep talking about those "females" and evaluate their capacities to sail. Why we dont warn, care about young boys who are as vulnerable to similar abuse as ladies, no no advise for "boys"


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Well the thread was started by two ladies, not by two boys so that's one rather obvious reason, rather than a chip on anyone's shoulder, why the discussion/advice is mostly tailored to inexperienced females working aboard boats. I also think you are 100% wrong about young men or boys being equally likely to be hired or exploited because someone thinks they are cute or hopes to sleep with them. I'm sure it happens occasionally, but it's a fact that this is overwhelmingly a female issue because most of the sailors they might work for or be taken advantage of by, are heterosexual males.

[Coops]

Well, it seems that this thread has run it's course. As the op has never returned we can only assume that they have either been driven away by all our sensitivity or they were never bothered much anyway.

Before it descends any further into any kind of animosity between the factions we can all go and have a little drink and wait for the next event,

Thank you to the participants. See you on the next one.

Coops.