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22-01-2025, 10:19
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 16
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OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
O worked fine with OpenGL on 5.8.4 but on update to 5.10.2-0+12e5712 crash occurs when zooming in to max standard zoom.
Old Dell Laptop with Windows 7, 4GB RAM, Graphics probably Intel HD 4400 I coulld not find any later driver updates.
I may be able to find OpenGL version on next visit to the boat.
Crash occurs with or without any plugins, raster or vector charts displayed.
I am just wondering what might have changed within O update that might be incompatible with my system.
Last start section of Log and ini files attached.
Looking forward to your thoughts and advice, I have had many year's use of O, great work, thanks all!
Ian
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22-01-2025, 13:18
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#2
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,708
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
In the log, I see Dash Tactics enabled, with some warnings.
Please confirm crash with no plugins active.
Also, what charts are shown when it crashes?
Thanks
Dave
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22-01-2025, 18:48
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 16
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Dave,
Many thanks for your prompt response. I did try with all my usual plugins disabled, but not uninstalled. Same crash with with CM93 charts displaying or with Visit My Harbour raster charts.
I did a number checks of alternating back and forward from 5.8.4. The section of log I posted was the last run of O when not much was being input to the laptop, but there were many more tries earlier with all the nav equipment connected.
Happy to do any more checks you suggest on my next visit to the boat.
Thanks again for your help.
Ian
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22-01-2025, 22:10
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: San Francisco
Boat: Morgan 382
Posts: 3,644
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
I know that the developers want to support Windows 7, but seriously, the last time Windows 7 was sold was in 2014. Do not expect new software to run on an operating system more than 10 years old. Microsoft doesn't support it, Dell doesn't support it, and as libraries are updated some things just won't work. Expecting that is just completely unreasonable. If version 5.8.4 worked fine then go back to it.
Or, better yet, get a newer laptop. Windows 10 enterprise support ends this year, and companies are throwing away otherwise perfectly good, much faster, much more reliable, and much better Windows 10 Laptops. You should be able to find one for almost free, if not free. Swap in a new SSD for $25 and you will have a very fast laptop that will last until you need to repeat the process and get another free laptop.
Or, buy a brand new Windows 11 laptop for as little as under $200 from Amazon. ( I recommend better, but I would take the cheapest W11 laptop over any W7 laptop, every day.)
There is just no reason at all to still have anything on Windows 7.
__________________
-Warren
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23-01-2025, 06:49
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 16
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Warren
Yes of course you are absolutely right, I am in the dark ages and should just stick with 5.8.4 on my trusty Navigation only laptop. It is expecting too much to continue to support O updates for my Win 7 machine. I have a complicated set up with many USB inputs and a priority system for position data. I use VSPE. Also NAVmonPC to dampen the wind information fed to O so that the dashboard needles are steadied, so it would be a faff to change laptop and start from scratch. Hey Ho!
Thanks Warren
Happy sailing
Ian
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24-01-2025, 13:02
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 99
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
There is a file in the main OpenCPN directory named "opencpn-glutil.exe" which checks if your Dell's graphics are up to the latest OpenCPN spec. This solution worked for me - disable this file by renaming it to "opencpn-glutil.REM" so that the graphic's check step is bypassed. Remember to check after an update as the file is likely to be restored then. I appreciate the developers like to improve this great chartplotter, but those old Dells are great too.
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24-01-2025, 15:49
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: San Francisco
Boat: Morgan 382
Posts: 3,644
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dynamo
Warren
Yes of course you are absolutely right, I am in the dark ages and should just stick with 5.8.4 on my trusty Navigation only laptop. It is expecting too much to continue to support O updates for my Win 7 machine. I have a complicated set up with many USB inputs and a priority system for position data. I use VSPE. Also NAVmonPC to dampen the wind information fed to O so that the dashboard needles are steadied, so it would be a faff to change laptop and start from scratch. Hey Ho!
Thanks Warren
Happy sailing
Ian
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Sorry if my post came across arrogant. The reality is that the difference between Windows 7 and the current version is *immense* More than 10 years of Microsoft changing how some part of the operating system works or is accessed, then hardware drivers need updated, software libraires need updated, etc. to remain compatible. Most of those updates for Windows 7 stopped years ago, but Microsoft keeps improving security, updating features, etc. It gets to a point where updating to the latest software is just going to break something, and there isn't much the developers can do about it, as OpenCPN relies on other libraires which in turn rely on other libraries, and support for Windows 7 in those libraries just isn't 100%
OpenCPN 5.8.4 was a good stable version. There is no reason to upgrade if it worked. If the blocking factor for a new PC is the amount of configuration you will need to do, at least your Windows 7 laptop works for you to use while you spend time getting the new one how you like it. And to use as a reference. If you wait until your current laptop fails, you might be in for a real difficult challenge.
I do understand your position. I manage hundreds of computers at work. Most are in the process of being upgraded to Windows 11, because Windows 10 support ends this year. I have 2 computers still on Windows 7 because of compatibility issues with the software on them that prevented upgrades. FINALLY they are resolved and will be upgraded to W11 in a couple weeks.
__________________
-Warren
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25-01-2025, 09:26
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 16
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Maelruan
Thanks for the tip about "opencpn-glutil.exe" I shall give it a try. Yes the Dell has been very good.
Ian
Warren
I didn't take anything you wrote the wrong way, sorry if my post read like that. I was very pleased you responded. I did feel guilty for troubling Dave who is always really helpful to everyone. Amazing efforts of Dave and the team and I always enjoy trying the updates. I will take your advice to upgrade my system whilst maintaining the old Dell. Well done for sorting your W7 to W11 software compatibility issues. I reckon I shall have to learn about scripts to replace my start-up batch files!
Thanks again
Ian
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25-01-2025, 11:41
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Boston, MA
Boat: 1981 Bristol 32 Sloop
Posts: 18,210
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Ian wrote: "I reckon I shall have to learn about scripts to replace my start-up batch files!"
It is surprisingly easy. Install BASH cmd prompt, and use Copilot to rewrite your batch files to be sh files. Then review them before running them.
For compiling PI we have found the BASH prompt to be able to handle the the job more completely than the Cmd prompt.
It is always a lot of work to move to a new computer. It's just a fact of life.
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25-01-2025, 11:59
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 99
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Dynamo,
I have 2 Dell E6410's on W10, and a 3rd to keep those going. Latest 5.10 still crashes when OpenGL is invoked, or CM93 or O Charts are being loaded, unless the graphics check above is disabled, & notwithstanding the config file switches suggested in an earlier thread. The graphics check indicates that the graphics are OpenGL capable, but they are not, & there is Intel has no driver to provide that feature.
If you do find a capable replacement for the Dell please let us know. (There was another thread on a suitable PC issue). Also trialing a HP Elitebook which lacks the in/out sockets of the Dell's which have 4 USB sockets, Line-In & Out, 12v DC 24/7, SIM/Internal GPS module, etc. HP Elite has just 2 USB sockets plus a USB-C which takes an extension that's mechanically unsound, needs a separate little USB sound card for Lin In/Out, SIM/GNSS Sensor module no longer supplies GPS strings, etc. On the other hand the Dells use up to 95 watts (so more solar panels) & need extra cooling, where as the HP is much lighter in both weight & power (maxes at 65 watts) & no extra cooling so far.
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25-01-2025, 12:16
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Boston, MA
Boat: 1981 Bristol 32 Sloop
Posts: 18,210
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Quote:
Latest 5.10 still crashes when OpenGL is invoked, or CM93 or O Charts are being loaded, unless the graphics check above is disabled, & notwithstanding the config file switches suggested in an earlier thread. The graphics check indicates that the graphics are OpenGL capable, but they are not, & there is Intel has no driver to provide that feature.
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Was the check done using GLview? https://www.realtech-vr.com/home/?page_id=142
Quote:
Thanks for the tip about "opencpn-glutil.exe" I shall give it a try.
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Software based opengl. Slower, also depends on update.
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25-01-2025, 12:58
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 99
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rgleason
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See copy below of msg #30 12th Aug last in thread Re: OpenCPN Version 5.10 Released. I disable opencpn-glutil.exe with each update.
"OpenCPN 5.10.0 could be loaded & O-Charts read when the opencpn-glutil.exe is disabled on a device with Win10 & Intel HD Graphics. When the utility is run independently gl_caps.json says the device is capable of using opengl, so if that means a driver problem then such could not be found so far. Also, to get 5.10 to run, the opengl entry in opencpn.ini is set to 1, but that changes back to 0 when it starts. The "Display>Advanced" drop down menu has the OpenGL option grayed out. Then, when opencpn-util.exe is restored, all works correctly, even with the openGL option becoming available. However, clicking that box causes the programme to crash. When the opengl utility is disabled again opencpn opens in safe mode, and when this is closed it can be reopened in normal mode, albeit with the OpenGL option grayed out."
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25-01-2025, 13:13
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 99
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Just installed GLview on a Dell E6410 & it reports OpenGL Unsupported
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25-01-2025, 13:14
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Boston, MA
Boat: 1981 Bristol 32 Sloop
Posts: 18,210
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Quote:
Display>Advanced" drop down menu has the OpenGL option grayed out.
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I believe that is because OpenCPN has detected that that feature is not available on the machine/graphics hardware/software drivers.
If you can find updated drivers for your graphics card it is the better route to take I think.
When the software OpenGL.exe is started, then there is some support for OpenGL because it is software based.
We used to have something called "Display List processing" for CAD when it was enabled the redraw of graphics was much much faster. Initially it was a separate program that we had to load in DOS, then it became integrated with our software.
This software version of OpenGL is similar, and depending on how old it is, it may not provide full modern support of all OpenGL features.
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25-01-2025, 14:07
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Boston, MA
Boat: 1981 Bristol 32 Sloop
Posts: 18,210
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Re: OpenCPN 5.10.2 repeatable crash after updating from 5.8.4, OpenGL selected.
Quote:
Just installed GLview on a Dell E6410 & it reports OpenGL Unsupported
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There's an answer. Aren't there any drivers for the graphics card that can be updated?
Look on the manufacturer's website or the computer manufacturer's updated drivers. Dell has a very good website for this.
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