What caulk to use, now that 3M 101 is no longer available, to seal the toe-rail-to-d

[roverhi]

Originally Posted by roverhi

LifeCalk is polysulfide the same as 3M 101. Have been using it since the '70s with great success. Super easy clean up with mineral spirits.

5200, 4200, Sikaflex are all polysulfide. Do not like working with the stuff and unused remainders in tube go off wasting it.

You need to read what I meant to write. Big screw up on my part, those other caulks are indeed polyurethane. Only LifeCalk is polysulfide.

Mahalo for pointing out my error. Teach me not to try and post from the phone.

[Alan Mighty]

See #10 at http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ht-159518.html

[sailingfarmer]

Life Calk?

[s/v Jedi]

Wow, what a confusion

Just to make sure, to answer the original question: Life Caulk from Boatlife is a direct replacement for 3M 101.

That said, I use this, besides butyl-tape, for bedding hardware that is also mechanically fastened.

For a seam, we were supposed to use a product like 3M 4000UV but it appears to fail to do it's job, so to replace this, I would suggest using Boatlife Life Seal instead of Life Caulk. Check both these products before making a decision

I do like Dow Corning 795 which is a structural silicone but suggest it only be used for windows, hatch lenses etc. i.e. glass, Lexan, Perspex etc.

[basssears]

Originally Posted by roverhi

LifeCalk is polysulfide the same as 3M 101. Have been using it since the '70s with great success. Super easy clean up with mineral spirits.

+1 for LifeCalk as long as you're looking for sealant only, not adhesive... I have been very happy with it.

[PeteHalstedc]

Originally Posted by roverhi

Do not like working with the stuff and unused remainders in tube go off wasting it.

FYI, Try placing in a plastic bag and keeping in the freezer. Prolongs the life quite a bit and keeps it from hardening in the tube.

For the OPs question, specifically for just sealing without rebedding, I think Life Caulk would be the choice.

And also I agree with others, if rebedding anything that has through bolts, Butyl tape is the way to go. I don't like it as well if the item being bedded only has blind screws that can't be reliable retighten a few times to fully bed the butyl like through bolts.

[svJasmine]

3m does not make a polysulfide any longer after 101 is gone. polyurethanes are good for some things, but not bedding. Bedding a toe rail might be fine and I would consider it for there, possibly.

Boatlife is the closest thing to 3M 101. Just make sure you get boatlife that is not past the shelf life. That was the reason 3M quit making it (I think). There are codes and Boatlife will let you know how old it is. DONT TRUST WEST MARINE to tell you how old it is.

Rich

[George DuBose]

Skylark had her oversanded, overCetoled, 35 year old silicone failing teak toe rails completely replace and instead of the original wood screws, we used long bolts, nuts and washers.

Bonding was with the Sikaflex system.

No problems for 7 years and counting.

[ensembull]

Originally Posted by PDScott

I would use butyle tape as it will never harden and is very flexible. Was used by most boat manufacturers as it will not leak if installed properly. I know there are lots of new fangled products out there but sometimes the old ways are best. It is available in white,grey and black. Just my humble opinion on the matter.

I have to agree. I replaced the lexan in my forward hatch last year. Heard from all at the club to use this or that, this primer etc etc etc. I used butyle tape, C&C used it 40 years ago and the only reason it leaked is the lexan cracked. I figure in 40 years when it leaks again I will be dead.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by svJasmine

3m does not make a polysulfide any longer after 101 is gone. polyurethanes are good for some things, but not bedding. Bedding a toe rail might be fine and I would consider it for there, possibly.

Boatlife is the closest thing to 3M 101. Just make sure you get boatlife that is not past the shelf life. That was the reason 3M quit making it (I think). There are codes and Boatlife will let you know how old it is. DONT TRUST WEST MARINE to tell you how old it is.

Rich

I do use Life Caulk for a lot of things but shelf life is definitely an issue. I pulled a couple of cartridges out last week and both were totally solidified. Called Boatlife and coincidentally just got off the phone with a tech support guy who decoded the numbers on the Life-Caulk tube for me.

An example might be 04627. First two digits, 04 is the month. so April Third, 6 the last number of the year so 2016. the last two numbers are Boat-Life's internal lot number. They guaranteed 12 months shelf life but say it should be good for at least 18 months. He did add that as long as you can get it out of the tube it will work but that is not the case with Life-Seal. He recommends Life-Seal as it sets up much faster but if I recall he said that isn't a polysulfide but a polyurethane.

[skipgundlach]

Do you have contact numbers and/or URLs for your support? I'd like to pick their brain, as here and the other 30 or so places where I've posed this question have a clear majority of support for Life vs other products various folk like...

Meanwhile, are you saying that for my type application they recommend the seal vs the caulk for best results long term?

Thanks.

L8R

Skip

[s/v Jedi]

LifeSeal:

A unique combination of marine silicone and polyurethane, formulated especially for fiberglass. LifeSeal® offers a fast-curing, low odor, high adhesion, non-sagging, non-corrosive, non-yellowing formula. It provides a durable permanent watertight seal for joints subject to structural movement. May be used above and below the waterline. Use for sealing decks to hulls, thru-hull fittings, vinyl ports, sealing/glazing windshields and bedding marine hardware. Will adhere to metal, glass, wood, Lexan®, ABS® and certain other materials. Can be removed without damaging gel-coat. Not recommended for ferro cement hulls, impregnated wood or oil-soaked materials. Cures in presence of water. Mildew resistant and acid free. Custom colors available.

LifeCalk:

A long lasting, permanently flexible marine polysulfide sealant which can be sanded, painted***, and used above and below the waterline. Tack-free in 1 to 3 days, excellent resistance to teak oils, gasoline, and diesel fuel. Ideal for teak decks, to bed deck and hull hardware, seal thru-hull fittings, and underwater seams. Will bond to fiberglass, wood, metal, glass, and itself. Cures to a firm flexible rubber seal with excellent waterproofing and adhesion qualities. Can be applied underwater for emergency repairs. Can be applied to damp surfaces.
*** Not compatible with all paints, Sikkens, Cetol, Deks, Olje.

[skipgundlach]

Originally Posted by skipmac

I do use Life Caulk for a lot of things but shelf life is definitely an issue. I pulled a couple of cartridges out last week and both were totally solidified. Called Boatlife and coincidentally just got off the phone with a tech support guy who decoded the numbers on the Life-Caulk tube for me.

An example might be 04627. First two digits, 04 is the month. so April Third, 6 the last number of the year so 2016. the last two numbers are Boat-Life's internal lot number. They guaranteed 12 months shelf life but say it should be good for at least 18 months. He did add that as long as you can get it out of the tube it will work but that is not the case with Life-Seal. He recommends Life-Seal as it sets up much faster but if I recall he said that isn't a polysulfide but a polyurethane.

So, contact numbers (with a name) would be useful. OTOH, if their support is so great that literally any contact through the 'contact us' link would work, that would be useful info as well.

Thanks to Jedi for the marketing materials. Anything with silicone for this application makes me nervous due to the negative aspects of silicone as to future removal/reapplication/whatever-later, so I'd love to get a techie on the phone and press the matter...

[s/v Jedi]

Okay I just changed my mind for the seam with 4000UV that failed... I am going to redo it with SIS-440 which is available in white. This sealant is normally used for teak decks, which is exactly how I want my seam.

This is a semi-permanent "hatch" cover that is part of my cockpit sole and cockpit seat. When removed, it allows the engine to be lifted out.

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by CarlF

As recommended here, I used Dow 795 sealant to seal some leaks between plexiglass and fiberglass. Wow! It was easier to apply and less messy than 101. Six months later it's as white as the day I put it on and sticking great. Bought a cartridge off Amazon for about the same price as 4000 UV.

I'm thinking of trying it for other applications with sun exposure. Has anyone tried this?

http://www.dowcorning.com/DataFiles/...fe801a7bbe.pdf

Back in mid 80s built a 15 story building with walls faced with 3/4 granite glued to metal panels using Dow 795!