USA Expat-a Good Place to Go?

[delmarrey]

Just to clear things up, my use of expat was to discribe someone who lives or works outside of their own country w/o taking up new citizenship and plans to return to their homeland on occasion.

Although, I've only heard the term used when leaving an English speaking country, not when entering it. Otherwise I'd be an American or Yank. So I use it loosely.

As to where to go? Like Canibul said "just head south", I'm thinking Baja would be a good start since its on the way to other locals anyway.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by delmarrey

As to where to go? Like Canibul said "just head south", I'm thinking Baja would be a good start since its on the way to other locals anyway.

That's sorta my plan, and if I like the place stay awhile, otherwise, move on.

My take is Expat is temporary, retains citizenship, returns "home", Expats are often there to work, they are there legally. Immigrant is permanent

[Wrong]

Truth is, no matter where you aim the boat you'll have to deal with visa restrictions. In some places a quick trip across the border and back will get you a new stay. In others you must not return for a pre-determined period of time. To further complicate matters, some countries require you to use an agent, often at no small expense.

If you plan on dividing your presence between say the U.S. and another country in 'off season' fashion, arrannging a safe place to leave your boat may not be so easy. Especially in areas affected by cyclones, hurricanes, typhoons... Of course, if losing your boat is not of any great concern.... Leaving your boat behind in some countries may be a limited possibility due to import restrictions, possible seizure and tax assessments...

Our choices would be much greater were it not for the fact many otherwise lovely locations are subject to these storms.

Carefully consider the prevalence in particular of mosquito borne disease. Various types are spreading in tropical and sub-tropcal countries and islands, including the Caribbean. Disease of all sorts should be considered a potential liability.

My motives behind finding an idyllic, warm place to continue my sailing, liveaboard lifestyle would not include rejoining the crowd of so-called ex-pats... Quite the contrary. So the presence of large groups of Americans on boats would be a deterrent, not an attraction.

You may want to consider how foreigners are received and tolerated in countries too. Some posters have commented on the subject, but hardly enough. It could be an ugly scenario if one day the undercurrents of resentment are unleashed... Especially in areas where the source of conflict is religious, ethnic and or tribal.

Reality does not always correlate well with our idealistic vision of living happily forever in some far away, warm place.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Canibul

I think the term 'expat' is a purely brit phrase, and it should be used to describe british people.

There is certainly nothing "ex" about being a US taxpayer. Uncle Sam collects federal taxes from US citizens no matter where they live, or for how long they have lived there.
We're not 'ex' anything.

The "ex" in "expatriate doesn't mean "previously", it means "out of"

An expatriate is just someone who is living outside of their native country.

[cards26]

Wrong, you're right,....about the visas, that is.

That's why I like Uruguay; every six months, you can just take a boat ride to Buenos Aires and check in there, and then return the same day to Uruguay, and you're good for another six months. No need for expensive visas.

Income tax is another problem. The U.S. taxes by citizenship, and basically everywhere else taxes by residency, with few exceptions. So I have to pay income tax in Colombia as a result of being here more than 183 days a year; and I have to pay income tax on the same income to the U.S. because I'm a U.S. citizen. It stinks.

[SV Sailfish]

Hey... I have an idea.

All of you that see problems or dangers or hassles in finding the "perfect place" to go, well... just stay where you are and keep spreading the "dangers" and "rumours" of this place or that. It just leaves more room and fun for those of us that are already out here and doing it!

Delmarrey... get on that big, beautiful yellow boat of yours and "come on down!" We'll leave a light on for ya!!

Cheers!

[Wrong]

There's just one not so small problem with the "just head south" mentality. The farther south you go the more difficult it is to get back north, no matter how far north that is. Well, you could always go via Hawaii which is your only logical choice once you're as far south as the Panama Canal. Once past Australia "getting back" to the Americas is best done by sailing the rest of the way 'round, whether via the Suez Canal or bottom of South Africa. So, before "just heading south" it'll be a good idea to research the pros & cons of possible destinations before throwing off the lines. Find out EVERYTHING good and bad about Mexico in particular before going. There are cheerleaders for most everything. Cautionary tales are frequently hard to come by. But for starters check out information related to the most recent hurricane to affect Baja. Find out about the more than 300 boats that were impounded by a new tax agency in Mexico. Find out about developments related to the drug cartels in Baja Sur (south).

Same for anyplace else on you list of possibilities.

Lemmings will be lemmings. Smart people make smart, well informed decisions before taking the leap.

[Charlie]

HI Del:
Haven't been on CF much lately. Sorry to hear about your "D" I'm going thru same thing now. La Paz is a pretty great place for Ex Pats. I had Ohana there for a season and the folks were really nice and it was easy to get to some pretty much excellent cruising and fishing grounds. Problem is hurricane's. I don't have experience further south.

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by SV Sailfish

Hey... I have an idea.

All of you that see problems or dangers or hassles in finding the "perfect place" to go, well... just stay where you are and keep spreading the "dangers" and "rumours" of this place or that. It just leaves more room and fun for those of us that are already out here and doing it!

Delmarrey... get on that big, beautiful yellow boat of yours and "come on down!" We'll leave a light on for ya!!

Cheers!

Although I agree with the concept...aren't you the one that just bought the boat in Mx in the Sea? If so...how are you..."those of us that are already out here and doing it!" I'm just sayin. But if you're not...my apologies.

[SV Sailfish]

Originally Posted by Celestialsailor

Although I agree with the concept...aren't you the one that just bought the boat in Mx in the Sea? If so...how are you..."those of us that are already out here and doing it!" I'm just sayin. But if you're not...my apologies.

Well C'Sailor... apology accepted. Just click on that little button that says... my profile. No need to list my 60k+ ocean miles here. (Oops, just did) And FYI... We are allowed to buy new boats even after we have racked up lots of miles in others owned previosly. It's what makes boat brokers happy.

and Wrong... Chicken Little could not have said it any better.

Oh and by the way... once you get to NZ or OZ... you can come back to the good ol' USA. It's called head north to Japan and keep on circlin'. Try it, it's a fun trip!

Now, back to the OP's plans. Again I say, you have a beautiful boat and you have done a lot of hard work getting her ready. It would be a shame to sell her before experiencing what she and you are capable of. Good luck to you whatever you decide!

Cheers!

[Canibul]

I don't much like it when some brit or australian calls me a "yank" either. It's an insult.

Kinda like me calling someone from Scotland or Ireland an Englishman.

[Wrong]

Originally Posted by SV Sailfish

Well C'Sailor... apology accepted. Just click on that little button that says... my profile. No need to list my 60k+ ocean miles here. (Oops, just did) And FYI... We are allowed to buy new boats even after we have racked up lots of miles in others owned previosly. It's what makes boat brokers happy.

and Wrong... Chicken Little could not have said it any better.

I've sailed maybe 1/3 less the distance you claim to have, so have a pretty good idea of what possible hazards sailors should consider when planning their itinerary. Don't know how you accumulated your alleged sea miles, but mine were accumulated over the course of two near global circumnavigations in a 27' sloop. I've seen cruisers infected by mosquito borne disease in the Caribbean and Tahiti. I've followed events in locations affected by hurricanes and am aware of cruisers who've lost their boats. I've witnessed first hand cruisers affected by import rules affecting their boats and ability to leave... Chicken Little?

Oh and by the way... once you get to NZ or OZ... you can come back to the good ol' USA. It's called head north to Japan and keep on circlin'. Try it, it's a fun trip!

Go back and read my post. I said once you're beyond Australia. Furthermore, your depiction of the route back to the U.S. via Japan is misleading. Cyclones are possible at any time in the Sea of Japan and the remainder of the distance to the 'good ol' USA' can be quite hazardous. I have friends who took that route and hit something so hard it dislodged the auxiliary diesel from the engine mounts... Fortunately he built the steel boat and had the know how and materials onboard to make repairs sufficient enough limp back to New Guinea where the boat was sold...

Now, back to the OP's plans. Again I say, you have a beautiful boat and you have done a lot of hard work getting her ready. It would be a shame to sell her before experiencing what she and you are capable of. Good luck to you whatever you decide!

Cheers! [/QUOTE]

[SV Sailfish]

Ok... I give.

It's just too damn dangerous.

[Wrong]

Originally Posted by SV Sailfish

Ok... I give.

It's just too damn dangerous.

Truth is it was more dangerous when I left the U.S. in 2009 than when I left in 2000. And for a variety of reasons it's a lot more dangerous now. Mosquitos in the Caribbean only carried Dengue fever until Chikungunya appeared and spread throughout the islands over the last year. Previously, as long as you stayed out of areas with heavy vegetative growth and were inside before dark you were pretty safe from Dengue. However, the mosquito carrying Chikungunya bites during the daytime...

While improving relations between the U.S. and Cuba will no doubt lower the heat between the U.S. and some Central American countries, there an element of resentment against Americans that is real in some of these countries. And those who harbour such resentment more militant.

Increasing incidents of attacks on cruisers in the Caribbean, particularly while anchored should not be ignored.

Anyone who says crime against foreigners in Mexico is imaginary, or too infrequent to be of any concern is fooling themselves. I was lucky when Hurricane Rita roared through Orange, Texas where I managed to find a narrow water way sheltered by trees both sides before she hit. My boat survived that one, but only because I was lucky. You can't always find that sheltered spot in time, if ever. My preference was to have been far away from the hurricane zone before there was any danger, but circumstances beyond my control prevented me from leaving.

It's an unfortunate fact that while some countries are developing policies to attract foreign investment and applications for residency, others are pulling in the welcome mat by raising port fees and requiring cruisers to use agents. Of those countries in the first group, how many are actually targeting all cruisers? My impression is their looking for deep pockets professionals interested in building homes and starting businesses. Anyone serious about retaining the reins free cruising lifestyle may not be attracted by making such a commitment. Ain't that where y'all left from?

I don't need to expound on why some countries are less safe than others. Read the news.

Would I go again today? I never say never because it's hard to resist the pull toward adventure and I abhore sitting still. But, guaranteed, I'll think long and hard about the differences between then and now before casting off the lines...

[Dpinky]

Sea of Cortez is a great place to try. We keep our boat at Marina Costa Baja and absolutely love it. Some winters we move to Puerto Vallarta but we always go back to La Paz.


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