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Old 30-05-2023, 15:53   #16
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

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Originally Posted by hpeer View Post
Standard Horizion Gx2400 or GX6000?
2400 $380
6000 $420
I had two GX6000 units for a while, but I removed them and replaced with the M510. This might start a brand war, but in my experience there is no comparison in the radio quality between the two. The ICom is distinctly better. Now that's just the VHF part of the product. As for interfacing, each is it's own brand of hell. For me, the GX6000 was better since I was using only 0183. Loud hailer, "fog horn" etc were built in without some silly wifi POS. But I have heard that the GX6000 N2K interface is a nightmare.


The M510 interfacing is fine except for the stupid wifi box. Again, I don't care if people want wifi and want to operate their VHF via their phone. Knock yourself out. Just put the N2K interface and the loud hailer interface in the base product, hardwired. They did it on the M506, so we all know it's possible.....
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Old 30-05-2023, 16:00   #17
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

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I agree completely. A wifi interface so you can connect to a phone app or other toys is just fine. But to put that in the critical path between VHF and nav data is the most dumb-ass thing I can imagine. And there is no loud hailer either without the wifi gadget. The 605 is nice, but just too big physically. I don't want to dedicate that much panel space to a VHF.
I believe that the M510 uses its own internal GPS receiver for the DSC function, so the critical data is theoretically there whether the wifi link is there or not. I think this has actually been made a requirement (the internal gps receiver that is) for DSC radios going forward as far too many people didn’t feed that information to their radios.

The wifi connection to the external box is still a dumb move, imho. Glad I have an M509. It’s pretty much a perfect radio.
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Old 30-05-2023, 16:11   #18
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

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Ouch. Man radio companies are way overcomplicating things. Yeah I agree for my needs (and most recreational boaters) GX6000 would not be a good choice.

Not sure how radio companies are having such difficulty coming to grips with "modern" N2K based boats. It isn't exactly a new standard. Pretty typical today for boats to have both AIS data (due to transceiver) and GPS data on the network. The radio doesn't even need them internally it just needs an N2K plug to pull it off the network.

A hypothetical "GX2300" which is a GX2400 minus the internal AIS/GPS that pulls AIS/GPS from the N2K network for $100 cheaper would be even better but thanks for your help I think I am going to pull the trigger on the GX2400 plus RAM4 handset.
I just upgraded to the gx2400 w RAM and love it (from 1850). I like the backup internal gps and AIS receiver for stand alone/redundancy. Everything was plug and play on the nmea2000 with Garmin.
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Old 30-05-2023, 16:20   #19
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

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I just upgraded to the gx2400 w RAM and love it (from 1850). I like the backup internal gps and AIS receiver for stand alone/redundancy. Everything was plug and play on the nmea2000 with Garmin.
Glad to hear. I think I am sold on the GX2400 mounted at the nav station with a RAM4 mic for the helm. Honestly I would just buy icom if they had something comparable for ~$500.

Just to confirm you can select AIS target to make DSC call on the RAM4 mic right? I think by my reading of the docs you can but would be good to get confirmation from someone using it.
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Old 05-06-2023, 14:30   #20
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

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So at first glance Icom M510 is about perfect. There is a version which has no AIS onboard but can pull AIS from NMEA 2K network which is perfect.

.
Sorry to be clueless, but are we talking about a radio, and, if so, why would it need ais data?
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Old 05-06-2023, 14:31   #21
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

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Sorry to be clueless, but are we talking about a radio, and, if so, why would it need ais data?
It makes DSC calling useful since you can just pick the vessel you want to call out of the list and have it call them directly.
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Old 05-06-2023, 14:34   #22
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

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Sorry to be clueless, but are we talking about a radio, and, if so, why would it need ais data?
DSC calling of nearby targets. Manually entering an MMSI of adhoc targets like say that containership flying towards you in a nearby cross at 24 knots is so kludgy as to be useless.

However if a VHF has AIS (either internally or sent by other AIS sources of NMEA) then you can get a list of nearby targets. You pick the one you want and make a DSC call. You also have their shipname/callsign as well.

There are essentially three ways to do this:
1) VHF with internal AIS. This is what I settled on despite it being redundant (GX2400).

2) VHF w/o internal AIS but able to pull AIS data from NMEA 2K. M510 would be an ideal option if they had just put a N2K port on the radio. I am not buying a wireless bridge to connected my wired VHF radio to my wired NMEA network when the two are three feet apart.

3) A compatible chart plotter where you start the DSC call on the chart plotter not the radio. This is proprietary and so only works if both the radio and chart plotter are the same brand (i.e. garmin radio and compatible garmin chart plotter).
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Old 06-06-2023, 12:21   #23
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

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DSC calling of nearby targets. Manually entering an MMSI of adhoc targets like say that containership flying towards you in a nearby cross at 24 knots is so kludgy as to be useless.

However if a VHF has AIS (either internally or sent by other AIS sources of NMEA) then you can get a list of nearby targets. You pick the one you want and make a DSC call. You also have their shipname/callsign as well.

There are essentially three ways to do this:
1) VHF with internal AIS. This is what I settled on despite it being redundant (GX2400).

2) VHF w/o internal AIS but able to pull AIS data from NMEA 2K. M510 would be an ideal option if they had just put a N2K port on the radio. I am not buying a wireless bridge to connected my wired VHF radio to my wired NMEA network when the two are three feet apart.

3) A compatible chart plotter where you start the DSC call on the chart plotter not the radio. This is proprietary and so only works if both the radio and chart plotter are the same brand (i.e. garmin radio and compatible garmin chart plotter).


Excellent summary!
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Old 06-06-2023, 13:07   #24
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

I can't believe they dropped the hardwired nmea port! So stupid!

I've worked in IT most of my life and in my experience, the more someone works in IT the less they like wireless networks for stuff...
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Old 06-06-2023, 14:27   #25
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Re: What is icom smoking and is it legal?

OK, i’ll be the bad guy here. The sooner that a good marine wireless protocol arrives, the sooner we can mitigate lightning damage. VHF is worst case at that. With a lightning rod connected to one port, and the rest of nmea2k connected electronics on the other port a few inches away. Pure insanity.
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