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Old 15-01-2021, 11:00   #1
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Please help a dinosaur

We currently have a Garmin 740s chartplotter/radar/depthsounder unit and we're interested in buying a Raymarine EV400-T70161 autopilot.

We're trying to find out if there's a way to make them compatible. We've been in touch with Raymarine and they advised us that according to their data they should be compatible, but they've had customers that have had mixed success.

We've looked at the FAQ on the Raymarine site and they are using so many acronyms it's of no use to us (LEN has about 6 electronics definitions according to Google).

I know this is probably basic stuff, but we're at a loss. Appreciate any help.
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Old 15-01-2021, 11:07   #2
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

I am familiar with the 740 as I was very interested in getting one for quite awhile.
This has nmea 0183 out and in I believe. Therefore you may need a converter from nmea0183 to nmea 2000, if the rm autopilot does not support nmea 0183.Look at artisense devices.
Hope thar helps.
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Old 15-01-2021, 11:34   #3
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

I don't know about Garmin, but my Raymarine EV1 pilot can not be controlled by my B&G plotter. Despite both the autopilot control head and the plotter having exactly the same control "buttons" the two manufacturers use proprietary NMEA2000 codes for the control. If Raymarine and Navico aren't sharing their codes, it would be interesting if they do with Garmin.

Having said that ... If the plotter is navigating to a waypoint or course, the autopilot will follow ... I guess that uses non-proprietary codes that they all understand ... so I guess that makes it compatible. So be careful that when you discuss "compatible" everyone is talking about the same thing.

btw ... if you haven't worked it out, NMEA2000 (also called N2K) is the same as Raymarine's SeatalkNG, just with different plugs on the cables. To confuse things, NMEA0183 is a completely different system, as is Raymarine's Seatalk, some cross-over between these and NMEA2000 is possible using converters.

btw2 ... if you're just networking a plotter, pilot and a few instrumets, you don't really have to worry about LEN numbers, that becomes important as the network gets bigger.
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Old 15-01-2021, 11:36   #4
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Make sure this is the right one.
https://actisense.com/products/nmea-2000-gateway-ngw-1/
This device knows and uses PGN's and is programmable. A similar but different artisense may help with the b&g issue, but if you are talking about using the b&g screen and controls to control the EVO, no way will it work.
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Old 15-01-2021, 12:00   #5
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Without having tied those two specific devices together...

Both devices support NMEA 2000 (National Marine Electronics Association marine networking protocol 2000 - the older version is 0183). The GPS 740S can transmit PGNs (Parameter Group Number):

129025 Position - Rapid Update
129026 SOG/COG (speed over ground, course over ground) Rapid Update
129029 GNSS Position Data
129283 Cross Track Error
129284 Navigation Data
129285 Navigation Active Waypoint Data
and a bunch more

The Raymarine EV1/EV2 (that should be part of the 400 package) can receive PGNs:

129026
129029
129283
129284
129285
and a bunch more

That may all look like gobbledygook, but the bottom line is that both units claim to be industry certified to NMEA 2000 and to support the same PGNs (i.e. the Raymarine can receive the same data the the 740 can provide). Those are the key PGNs that would be used so the GPS 740, following a route, can tell the EV400 about that route, progress along the route, and where to go to reach the next waypoint.

There are some details in the setup and cabling that would need to be worked out - for instance the LEN is a "load equivalence number" and defines how much power a device takes from an NMEA 2000 network. If these are your only two NMEA 2000 devices then you don't need to be worried, especially since they are both powered independently of the 2000 network. There are a few other things like that, but they should work together with relative ease - that's the whole point of NMEA 2000 certification.
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Old 15-01-2021, 12:02   #6
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Thanks to both of you. We are a fairly straightforward boat, no need to interface lots of equipment. Trying to keep it as simple as possible.
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Old 15-01-2021, 13:38   #7
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsanduril View Post
That may all look like gobbledygook, but the bottom line is that both units claim to be industry certified to NMEA 2000 and to support the same PGNs (i.e. the Raymarine can receive the same data the the 740 can provide). Those are the key PGNs that would be used so the GPS 740, following a route, can tell the EV400 about that route, progress along the route, and where to go to reach the next waypoint.
But what is missing from this list are any PGNs to actually "control" the autopilot ... commands to tell the autopilot to activate or deactivate, or tell it to follow a bearing or a course, or to change that bearing by +/-1 or +/-10 degrees ... all controls that should be possible between a plotter and autopilot of the same manufacturer, but I haven't managed between B&G and Raymarine ... So I still need a Raymarine P70 control head for the autopilot, the plotter cannot perform this function instead, the plotter's "autopilot control" screen is still useless ... it may be different with a Garmin plotter, but I doubt it.

Redhead ...
Do you already have an NMEA2000 network on board? if not, and you're just trying to keep it simple, just wire the autopilot as recommended by Raymarine (3 or 4 components needed: actuator, control head, and compass - and probably a rudder sensor as well),then add an extra T to the backbone and plug in the plotter using one of these:
https://www.defender.com/product.jsp?id=4871714 with a regular seatalkNG cable,
or one of these:
https://www.defender.com/product.jsp?id=3774703
The autopilot can then be controlled by the control head, but will also take waypoint and course info from the plotter ... and the plotter will get heading data from the compass as a bonus.

If you do already have a Garmin based NMEA2000 network, and you don't want to covert the cabling to SeatalkNG, then you will need to use adapter cables from all the Raymarine devices to the NMEA2000 backbone. Raymarine doesn't make an adapter cable to join the backbones.
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Old 15-01-2021, 13:45   #8
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Absolutely, I guess it comes down to what is meant by "compatibility" and what functions you are seeking from the interconnection.
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Old 16-01-2021, 09:03   #9
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Desanduril
Thanks. I had forgotten that the 740 supports nmea2000, so it is not really that old.
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Old 16-01-2021, 10:17   #10
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Thanks all. This is all great information.

Sorry for the non replies. We were getting my husband 65' up the mast changing our forestay yesterday. We recently had 70kt winds and don't know if the stay was ever changed on our 40 year old boat. We are taking today off so will get back to our dinosaur problems.

You've help immensely.
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Old 16-01-2021, 11:01   #11
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

I also own a 740s as well as 7607 and a 1042xsv all on the same 2000 network. You can forget about plugging in a Raymarine radar to the Garmin products. The 740 will send data to a Raymarine autopilot over either 0183 or 2000 wiring.
My system has several Raymarine products but mostly 2000 compatible devices. Your choice is to pick one backbone and use adapters for any of the opposite connections or do as I did and splice a segment of NG backbone cable onto a 2000 backbone and set it up that way.
If I were to choose only one backbone and use adapters I would go with 2000 as there is a lot more 3rd party stuff available for it like AIS. Radios etc.
much of the inter-connectivity can fully be done with NMEA 2000 but not heavy duty stuff like radar data, depth finder screens( it will share the digital numbers like water temp and depth) but not the screens video output. For that typ of shared connectivity you need matched stuff.
My 7607 and 1042 both share the same radar but while the 740 is Garmin radar compatible it is only with older generation equipment.
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Old 16-01-2021, 12:34   #12
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Redhead, I run all Garmin plotters on my boat but am in the process of installing a Raymarine EV150 with rudder reference. They give you most everything you need to connect all the Raymarine componets to a SeatalkNg backbone including a 5 way connector and ends. Mine also came with a long back bone cable and 2 additional tee's. You'll also need a adaptor cable (part # RAXA06045 ) to run from the Raymarine backbone to the NEMA 2000 or as I am doing directly to the NEMA port in the back of the lower helm Garmin. I also needed a short backbone cable about 400mm. FYI raymarine backbones are a little weird as they use white and blue ends but once you figure out which is which its fairly simple. Since I haven't finished my install yet I don't know what the Garmin can do with the Auto pilot. We'll see. Good luck.
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Old 16-01-2021, 15:42   #13
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Thumbs up Re: Please help a dinosaur

If you want to keep things simple consider NOT connecting to autopilot.
On sail from Jacksonville to Charleston many years ago on a friend's new boat with all of the nav toys, I noticed the autopilot was steering each wave in a beam sea. We changed to a compass heading on the autopilot and the amount of steering reduced dramatically. It was particularly evident when comparing before and after GPS track zoomed in.
Your experience may vary
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Old 16-01-2021, 16:10   #14
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

Exactly my setup. A Raymarine Evolution 150 being fed with data from Garmin chartplotters. Works great. Iíve had this setup for 6 years or more. Actually with another Raymarine autopilot at first until a lightening strike wiped it ALL out.

No I understand you sailor guys can and do a lot of sailing in some pretty sloppy conditions that most of us power boat guys avoid. But I will admit there is more to using an autopilot than just turning it on and going on any heading you want. Electronics do not replace seamanship. You have to know their limitations and use them when an how appropriate.

In heavy seas no autopilot can keep up on certain courses or maybe any course. Just what the limitations are depend on the boat and itís handling characteristics. discretion is the better part of valor.
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Old 16-01-2021, 16:34   #15
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Re: Please help a dinosaur

If already have a Raymarine Seatalk-NG backbone installed just for my original autopilot and wanted the rest of your system to be 2000 backbone. you can do as I did and join the two backbones by buying a field install cable end- install it on the end of one backbone.
Buy a 2000 cable end plug and cut off the NG cable end and match up the wires. Diagrams are available online. Then you will have one network that allows both connections.
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