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Old 29-05-2020, 11:33   #1
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New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

A new Raspberry Pi is now available with 8 GB Ram. And a new 64 bit OS to use on it.

Price. $75.00

https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/28/2...erating-system
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Old 29-05-2020, 16:24   #2
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

Thomm,

thanks for this. Much more exciting than the 8GB (to me) is the the 64-bit OS

I dowloaded the beta OS, updated it, and was then able to install OpenCPN 5.1.518 straight from the ARM64 packages. No more having to deal with ARMHF packages, or compiling my own, or whatever. Very much like that.

I currently have the 64-bit running with OpenCPN on a 2GB Pi 4 and it all seems to be working. Since both the OS and OpenCPN are betas I am sure I will run into bugs.

Only have a half-hour or so with it so far, but I can say my panning and zooming tests with NOAA ENCs are much better than the same Pi running the most current 32-bit OS.
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Old 29-05-2020, 16:37   #3
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsanduril View Post
Thomm,

thanks for this. Much more exciting than the 8GB (to me) is the the 64-bit OS

I dowloaded the beta OS, updated it, and was then able to install OpenCPN 5.1.518 straight from the ARM64 packages. No more having to deal with ARMHF packages, or compiling my own, or whatever. Very much like that.

I currently have the 64-bit running with OpenCPN on a 2GB Pi 4 and it all seems to be working. Since both the OS and OpenCPN are betas I am sure I will run into bugs.

Only have a half-hour or so with it so far, but I can say my panning and zooming tests with NOAA ENCs are much better than the same Pi running the most current 32-bit OS.
Nice. Thanks for the info but I believe the Pi 4 is 4 GB Ram which as you probably know is the limit for a 32 bit machine.

I just learned all this and was lucky that I had played around with these Raspberry Computers because the company that won our contract required everyone to be A+ certified (in 90 days or be out of a job) which is a basic computer tech cert.

I'm a manager and the last time I was a computer/electronics tech was 1995 and we still were using DOS 3.2 so I had to making up for 25 years in a few weeks. (I passed the second exam this week at age 64)

So now I guess I need to try this new 64 bit OS on my 2 Raspberry Pi 4's. One that's on the boat and the one here at the house.

Btw, has anyone been able to connect to their Victron Controller with a Raspberry Pi OS? I'm still having to do it with my Windows 10 Laptop
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Old 29-05-2020, 17:21   #4
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

The Pi 4 comes in 2GB, 4GB, and now 8GB versions. The one I currently have is 2GB. We'll see how it goes, but I generally find CPU to be my bottleneck with OpenCPN, not memory, so I haven't yet looked at getting the 4GB version (or now the 8).
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Old 30-05-2020, 03:04   #5
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dsanduril View Post
The Pi 4 comes in 2GB, 4GB, and now 8GB versions. The one I currently have is 2GB. We'll see how it goes, but I generally find CPU to be my bottleneck with OpenCPN, not memory, so I haven't yet looked at getting the 4GB version (or now the 8).
When I decided to get a Raspberry Pi they had the 4 GB version at Best Buy so that is what I got. The whole kit including 32 GB SD Card and USB Card Read plus case was $90 so I probably paid too much but I wanted to start building my chart plotter immediately.

The second one I ordered online....for I believe $75.

The 2 GB were maybe $20 cheaper than that and would have worked for what I wanted to do but I just went with the 4 GB
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Old 30-05-2020, 03:21   #6
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

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Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post
Nice. Thanks for the info but I believe the Pi 4 is 4 GB Ram which as you probably know is the limit for a 32 bit machine.
Not exactly ;-)

Some processors have tricks to enable them to access more than 2^32 bytes of physical memory. Intel has had "Physical Address Extensions" ("PAE") since the pentium pro. ARM has
"Large Physical Address Extensions" ("LPAE").
Obviously the kernel needs to be appropriately written to exploit this.

I haven't been following raspbian development but from the announcement it seems the 32-bit kernel already supports LPAE so it can usefully use >4GB memory, although the address space for any single process would be limited.

I'm not convinced an 8GB pi will be a game changer for boat hackers just yet though.
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Old 30-05-2020, 03:49   #7
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

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Originally Posted by muttnik View Post
Not exactly ;-)

Some processors have tricks to enable them to access more than 2^32 bytes of physical memory. Intel has had "Physical Address Extensions" ("PAE") since the pentium pro. ARM has
"Large Physical Address Extensions" ("LPAE").
Obviously the kernel needs to be appropriately written to exploit this.

I haven't been following raspbian development but from the announcement it seems the 32-bit kernel already supports LPAE so it can usefully use >4GB memory, although the address space for any single process would be limited.

I'm not convinced an 8GB pi will be a game changer for boat hackers just yet though.
All I remembered was that 32 bit technology was limited to 4 GB Memory (RAM) whereas 64 bit could use up to 256 terabytes if there was an OS capable of that.

So far Windows 10 Pro and Enterprise can use up to 2 TB
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Old 30-05-2020, 13:35   #8
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

Dsanduril,

Are you using the 4GB or 8 GB Rpi?
(wondering if i'll see improved panning on my Rpi4 4GB if I upgrade..

thx,
Geoff.
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Old 30-05-2020, 13:50   #9
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

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Dsanduril,

Are you using the 4GB or 8 GB Rpi?
(wondering if i'll see improved panning on my Rpi4 4GB if I upgrade..

thx,
Geoff.
I'm actually using the 2GB Pi

I run htop a lot when playing with OpenCPN, I almost never see even my 2GB get taxed. It is always one core of the processor running at 100% that is the bottleneck.

I'm pretty sure I still have a 32-bit install around, I may have to see if I can come up with a "standard" pan/zoom test and then do a real comparison. With the new direct entry zoom it would make things easier, but I'd have to build the ARMHF version to go back to 32-bit. Will think on it a bit.
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Old 30-05-2020, 15:15   #10
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

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Originally Posted by thomm225 View Post
All I remembered was that 32 bit technology was limited to 4 GB Memory (RAM) whereas 64 bit could use up to 256 terabytes if there was an OS capable of that.
32-bit limits a process's address space to 4GB, but each process has its own virtual memory. The kernel maps each process's virtual memory to physical memory. With PAE/LPAE, pages from multiple process's virtual memories *totalling* >4GB can be kept in physical memory simultaneously.

I'm not a windows person but from your win 10 example I'm guessing you are so here's a microsoft link on PAE (which is the Intel version of this concept):
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/win...ress-extension
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Old 30-05-2020, 15:43   #11
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

The Pi 4 had a USB problem when it first came out; a "missing" resistor meant that some USB power supplies did not correctly recognize the device for charging (not a fatal issue: just buy a dumber power supply). There were other problems as well. Recently the resistor was added to builds but unfortunately there is no way to know whether one is buying old stock or new - the good news being that all 8GB boards have the fix so buy the 8GB and no worries. Other problems have been solved by firmware updates. It sounds like it is coming close to the time that those of us that have tired of bleeding at the edge can join in, with 64-bit coming on-line. Thanks for the heads-up.

Greg
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Old 08-06-2020, 18:20   #12
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

I just bought a new pi 4 8g 64bit.
Fired it up can't see the device on any network.
Ran Fing on my phone and nmap on my Ubuntu laptop.
Nothing.
Possible that I have a dud?
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Old 13-06-2020, 03:58   #13
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

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Originally Posted by islanderp40 View Post
I just bought a new pi 4 8g 64bit.
Fired it up can't see the device on any network.
Ran Fing on my phone and nmap on my Ubuntu laptop.
Nothing.
Possible that I have a dud?
Is it connected to the network? Ethernet cable plugged in?

Or WiFi on AND connected with the correct SSID?
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Old 14-06-2020, 07:35   #14
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

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Originally Posted by Dsanduril View Post
I dowloaded the beta OS, updated it, and was then able to install OpenCPN 5.1.518 straight from the ARM64 packages. No more having to deal with ARMHF packages, or compiling my own, or whatever. Very much like that.
Dsanduril,

I'm having a problem installing OpenCPN - were you using the ppa?

Code:
pi@raspberrypi:~/.vnc $ sudo apt-get update
Hit:1 http://archive.raspberrypi.org/debian buster InRelease
Hit:2 http://deb.debian.org/debian buster InRelease
Hit:3 http://deb.debian.org/debian-security buster/updates InRelease
Hit:4 http://deb.debian.org/debian buster-updates InRelease
Ign:5 http://ppa.launchpad.net/opencpn/opencpn/ubuntu groovy InRelease
Err:6 http://ppa.launchpad.net/opencpn/opencpn/ubuntu groovy Release
  404  Not Found [IP: 91.189.95.83 80]
Reading package lists... Done
E: The repository 'http://ppa.launchpad.net/opencpn/opencpn/ubuntu groovy Release' does not have a Release file.
N: Updating from such a repository can't be done securely, and is therefore disabled by default.
N: See apt-secure(8) manpage for repository creation and user configuration details.
pi@raspberrypi:~/.vnc $ sudo apt-get install opencpn
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
Package opencpn is not available, but is referred to by another package.
This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
is only available from another source

E: Package 'opencpn' has no installation candidate
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Old 14-06-2020, 08:33   #15
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Re: New Raspberry Pi with 8 GB Ram

For the most part I grab the packages manually from the beta PPA https://launchpad.net/~bdbcat/+archi...ncpn/+packages or the stable PPA https://launchpad.net/~opencpn/+arch...ncpn/+packages. I do this because I want to have the package around so I can copy it, back it up, store it where I know about it for when I have to rebuild things offline.

But I have gotten the PPA to work, note that your source entry is looking for packages for "groovy" (mine set up by default that way too, don't know if that is old copy in the manual or something else). For the latest Pi you want packages for "bionic" (ubuntu) or "buster" (debian). If you open your /etc/apt/sources.list and change the word "groovy" to "bionic" you should be good to go (if the PPA is not in sources.list because you added it from the command line you'll have to change it from the command line). That will get you the latest 5.0 release. If you want the latest betas you'll also have to change the first "opencpn" to "~bdbcat".
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