Need Advice - replacment Autopilot (Lewmar, Raymarine or CPT)

[razamataz]

Hi

it looks like my autopilot has kicked the bucket - wheel drive unit st4000 mk1.
or my boat is to heavy for it to handle big sea as manual says its good for boat up to 8 ton displacment and mine is 11.8 tons according to Loyds or 8.5 according to manufacturer marketing papers.
i bought the boat with the unit installed and thought that because i have a mamba steering system with gear reduction and a very light wheel that it will cope. (Contest 38s)

going forward - i heard the new raymarine wheel steering is crap and also again underpowered for my boat according to specs...although the mk1 worked fine so far and new one is cheap OR

since i have the Mamba setup for a steering linkage with sproket and bracket go with either Jeffa, Lewar or raymarine sproket drive unit but then price jumps and i have to add a steering position sensor and hope the st4000 autohelm will not kick the bucket too soon after
(a piston dive unit is also an option but will require lots of modifications as i dont have anywhere to mount it on steering)
Are the Chain driven unit good? Noisy? reliable?

Or last option which is both "cheap" and recommended - a totally stand alone wheel driven unit from CPT Autopilot which according to them is stronger than the raymarine wheel driven noisy motor

what is the wisdon of anyone that was in the same dilema?

also forgot to mention that During long passages i use an wind vane">Aries wind vane - Maybe a piston drive connected to it, but then out in the elements and relying on two systems instead of one?

sorry for the long post - i am truly not sure what the best option for peace of mind and reliability

[Wandering1]

Originally Posted by razamataz

Hi

it looks like my autopilot has kicked the bucket - wheel drive unit st4000 mk1.
or my boat is to heavy for it to handle big sea as manual says its good for boat up to 8 ton displacment and mine is 11.8 tons according to Loyds or 8.5 according to manufacturer marketing papers.
i bought the boat with the unit installed and thought that because i have a mamba steering system with gear reduction and a very light wheel that it will cope. (Contest 38s)

going forward - i heard the new raymarine wheel steering is crap and also again underpowered for my boat according to specs...although the mk1 worked fine so far and new one is cheap OR

since i have the Mamba setup for a steering linkage with sproket and bracket go with either Jeffa, Lewar or raymarine sproket drive unit but then price jumps and i have to add a steering position sensor and hope the st4000 autohelm will not kick the bucket too soon after
(a piston dive unit is also an option but will require lots of modifications as i dont have anywhere to mount it on steering)
Are the Chain driven unit good? Noisy? reliable?

Or last option which is both "cheap" and recommended - a totally stand alone wheel driven unit from CPT Autopilot which according to them is stronger than the raymarine wheel driven noisy motor

what is the wisdon of anyone that was in the same dilema?

also forgot to mention that During long passages i use an Aries wind vane - Maybe a piston drive connected to it, but then out in the elements and relying on two systems instead of one?

sorry for the long post - i am truly not sure what the best option for peace of mind and reliability

I love my rotary drive autopilot. We have a Raymarine rotary drive with ASU400 computer and EV sensor. It's a great package that steers very well and uses little power. It's super powerful and can handle any weather on my 41,000lb boat.
The EV sensor is a critical part of the installation that vastly reduces the amount of wheel movement compared to out old S3G Raymarine autopilot that used a fluxgate compass

[marcjsmith]

Ive been driving my moody 376 with the raymarine 6002 wheel drive granted its just been Chesapeake bay most of its life and one foray off the coast for about 30 hours.

I'm at the high end for it based on the specs, but the newer Rm evo100 is good for up 16,500lbs

its also a factor of balancing the sail plan

sailboat data has the contest 38s @ 19Klbs. then toss in another few thousand lbs in homegoods, sails, food, etc.. probabbly lukcy the wheel drive lasted aslong as it did

if you can I would look into a linear drive. hooked directly to the quadrant... nice thing about them is if the steering cables break, you still have a way to steer with out having to resort to the emergency tiller. which if its anything like mine, PITA

[OldManMirage]

I had a Raymarine on my Endeavour 32, 13K displacement. It was old and worn when I got the boat and finally the drive gave out. I could have bought another but wanted the CPT based on what I'd heard about it.

All I can say is I'm very happy with it. Took a while to get used to the controls and finding what worked for my boat in various conditions. But it never slips and it is indeed very quiet.

[barnakiel]

Ray / B&G / Garmin autopilots are all about the same. They fail quite a lot, their drives are too lightly built. I understand this is how these companies make money - by trying to sell us equipment that requires plenty of aftercare and spares.


NKE autopilots and components are slightly more reliable. They last better too.


There is one other company, but I lost the name. But you can find them by looking at what the IMOCAs use.


IMOCAS sail hard, wet and with plenty of quite brutal G. The gear used there is better than the gear used here.


Mind no matter how good your AP brain is, the ultimate test is on the drive. Get the best drive, any head, and you may be quite happy afterwards.


PS Furuno makes APs too. Imho not any worse than the plain cruising stuff, perhaps one notch better too.


b.

[razamataz]

Ok
+1 Raymarine rotary drive - but with the ACU and drive, sensor and such i'm looking at 4-5k euro's, and throwing away the st4000 and fluxgate compass plus after fiddiling with raymarine products i consider their electronics as toys and not marine suitable hardware

Sailboat data is wrong as was lately i was notified by fellow owner that our boats are 11.8 tons (26k lbs) and not 9 which was our last weight on the crane and i always wondered why are we still afloat if thats the displacment

p.s our boat is all solid rod steering with universal joint - no cables to break
they knew how to build back then

+1 CPT - will check again their specs and pricing

+1 NKE never heard of them and will look at Furuno

[Wayne Gilham]

Consider another supplier: I went for Pelagic "brain", to replace a simplistic SiTex unit. has great reviews, feeds my still-functioning electro-hydraulic "octopus"(VancouverBC) linear drive on quadrant. Sophisticated algorithms using up-to-date nine-axis gyro sensors! Mike at Pelagic is VERY knowledgeable, though they do not show a wheel-drive, he may have ideas- call him.

Pelagic is part of the Monitor windvane company (Scanmar), so has some creds...

https://pelagicautopilot.com/

[Wandering1]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

Ray / B&G / Garmin autopilots are all about the same. They fail quite a lot, their drives are too lightly built. I understand this is how these companies make money - by trying to sell us equipment that requires plenty of aftercare and spares.


NKE autopilots and components are slightly more reliable. They last better too.


There is one other company, but I lost the name. But you can find them by looking at what the IMOCAs use.


IMOCAS sail hard, wet and with plenty of quite brutal G. The gear used there is better than the gear used here.


Mind no matter how good your AP brain is, the ultimate test is on the drive. Get the best drive, any head, and you may be quite happy afterwards.


PS Furuno makes APs too. Imho not any worse than the plain cruising stuff, perhaps one notch better too.


b.

You can use any drive from any manufacturer. They will all work with Raymarine, B&G, Garmin, etc I used to run an old Neco drive from Raymarine.

[zGerman]

Most heads will control most drive units, even across manufacturers. I have an old and a new Raymarine brain and either can run my Raymarine ram or the Amel rotary drive.

What is not fully compatible are plotters and pilots. My BnG plotter can't engage my Raymarine AP brain but it can send waypoints to it. It may be easier to stick to a compatible plotter/brain combo and buy a drive of your choice.

[Rick Williams]

I have a sprocket at the bottom of my wheel steering to which I attached a Jefa drive motor. You mentioned heavy seas which is my worst case scenario so that's what I planned for and the Jefa has been excellent. It's solidly built and as long as the electronics (brain etc.) are functioning, the drive is great with marginal power usage.
Right out of the box it's an impressive piece of equipment and since I'm working towards cruising with a minimum of crew, that is a critical piece of kit worthy of investment.

[Peregrine1983]

I have a ray linear drive. Upgrading the sprockets to metal from plastic is on my to-do list.

Someone mentioned Pelagic. This looks like a nice linear system: https://pelagicautopilot.com/collect...ow-deck-system

[Goodxcharly]

I’ve have a raymarine on my current sailboat. Which probably as old as the boat, 21 years. A under deck quadrant drive. I also had a Raymarine on my previous boat, wheel drive, 25 years old. Both units worked great, trouble free.
I think the key to longevity with auto pilots is keep it to a light load on the helm, rudder. If the going gets rough/heavy load, I turn it off.

[Wandering1]

Originally Posted by Peregrine1983

I have a ray linear drive. Upgrading the sprockets to metal from plastic is on my to-do list.

Someone mentioned Pelagic. This looks like a nice linear system: https://pelagicautopilot.com/collect...ow-deck-system

If you have a bearing failure in your rudder, such that it goes stiff, the autopilot has to work extremely hard. Guess how I know! The weak link in the autopilot drive is the nylon gears. These will shear before you do any major damage to the autopilot. Replacing the nylon gears is very easy. I did think about swapping them for brass gears but I would then have no weak link.

[Peregrine1983]

Originally Posted by Wandering1

If you have a bearing failure in your rudder, such that it goes stiff, the autopilot has to work extremely hard. Guess how I know! The weak link in the autopilot drive is the nylon gears. These will shear before you do any major damage to the autopilot. Replacing the nylon gears is very easy. I did think about swapping them for brass gears but I would then have no weak link.

That's a very interesting point. Maybe the solution is to just have nylon gears on board as a spare.

[Wandering1]

Originally Posted by Peregrine1983

That's a very interesting point. Maybe the solution is to just have nylon gears on board as a spare.

That is what I do, but I also have a spare drive. I just swapped out the drive whilst sailing then replaced the nylon gears at the next anchorage