Bookshelf Speakers

[slowshoes]

I like to get the best sound as possible when listening to music on board - I love my Denon 5000 headphones, but I'd still like to get better sound when not using headphones.

I'm currently using pioneer 6 x 9's in their own enclosures, but I'm thinking of trying B4 or B5 PSB bookself speakers to improve things. I contacted PSB and they said they would work fine in the boat, but recommended an amplifier for a bit more power.

http://www.psbspeakers.com/Images/Sp...geB5_Black.jpg

Anyone have any experience with these or any other great sounding small bookshelf speakers? Thanks for any input.

[Zednotzee]

My $.02. First, avoid plastic encased speakers if you want decent sound. They may start out okay, but they will eventually loosen up & start resonating- very annoying.

Also, you don't specify what the rest of your system is. Home audio systems tend to use 8 ohm speakers, which is what most home based stereos speakers are. Car & boat 12v audio systems tend to use 4 ohm speakers though.

If you put 4 ohm speakers on a home stereo, you effectively double the output power (since the laod is cut in half), but you should be aware that some amplifiers are not built to handle this.

The reverse is also true, in that if you put 8 ohm home speakers on a car stereo, it may seem quiet, depending on your amp.

I just finished checking the technical specs on the speakers you've linked & they seem fine.
http://www.psbspeakers.com/products/...ne-B-Bookshelf

[slowshoes]

Originally Posted by Zednotzee

My $.02. First, avoid plastic encased speakers if you want decent sound. They may start out okay, but they will eventually loosen up & start resonating- very annoying.

Also, you don't specify what the rest of your system is. Home audio systems tend to use 8 ohm speakers, which is what most home based stereos speakers are. Car & boat 12v audio systems tend to use 4 ohm speakers though.

If you put 4 ohm speakers on a home stereo, you effectively double the output power (since the laod is cut in half), but you should be aware that some amplifiers are not built to handle this.

The reverse is also true, in that if you put 8 ohm home speakers on a car stereo, it may seem quiet, depending on your amp.

I just finished checking the technical specs on the speakers you've linked & they seem fine.
PSB Speakers - Imagine B Bookshelf

Thanks for the reply Zed. Right now I'm using a Pioneer head unit with no amp. It sounds pretty good but the high and low ends can definitely be better, more expansive and detailed.

I know about the 4 vs 8 ohms with speakers - the PSB speakers were one of the few I could find that are 4 ohm compatible (and still supposed to sound good).

I like my headphones, my home stereo system and now I'd really like to get my boats stereo system up to snuff. Any further suggestions would be appreciated.

[s/v Jedi]

Check out Mirage speakers. They are the ultimate for boats.



ciao!
Nick.

[slowshoes]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Check out Mirage speakers. They are the ultimate for boats.



ciao!
Nick.

Thanks Nick - those look they would work well. I like how they website says they are particularly good for reproducing naturally recorded sound. Most of the music I listen to has a great deal of acoustic instruments in it.

It sounds like they use the theory of reflected sound creating a large soundstage, therefore avoiding a small sweetspot where the speakers sound their best.

This is exactly the same theory behind my Ohm Walsh 2 speakers that I've used at home for over 20 years now. You can sit anywhere in the room where my Walsh 2's are, and they sound great.

The Mirages have real possibilities - if you have any advice on which of their bookshelf speakers sound the best to your ears, then I'm all ears.

[Zednotzee]

Originally Posted by slowshoes

I'd really like to get my boats stereo system up to snuff. Any further suggestions would be appreciated.

You're on the right track. Speakers are the cheapest, easiest thing to replace, & they have the most profound effect on the way your stereo sounds.

Your 6x9s are running full range right now, so switching to bookshelf speakers with two drivers should improve things. Unlike car audio, home speakers have crossovers built in (hi-pass, lo-pass & notch filters). So, the higher frequencies go to the tweeters, which are best able to reproduce those sounds due to their low inertia. The low frequencies go to the woofers (you need to move a lot of air to produce low frequencies).

If new speakers don't improve the sound enough, you should consider an amplifier next. Typically head units only put out a maximum of 25 Watts per channel, & there's a serious risk of clipping (which would likely toast the new speakers).
Clipping (audio) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Unlike speakers & head units, used amps are a good buy- there are no moving parts, so used ones work just as well as new, at a fraction of the price.

[S/V Alchemy]

I have relatively elderly PSB Alphas aboard and they sound great. Go to a dealer and listen with a reference CD. That should help.

By the way, the amp can be pretty piddly and still fill the boat with sound.

[sww914]

Speakers are extremely subjective. What sounds amazing to one guy might sound tinny to the next. When I was shopping for home audio speakers I found some very expensive highly rated speakers that I just didn't like and others that I loved. I found a speaker at the bottom end of expensive (older Jamo) that I really loved and the only others that I liked more (B&W's 2nd best) were about 15 times the price.
Try to have a listen before you buy. I found it was worth a trip to the city to listen to speakers and have a nice lunch. I brought my own CD's and made a day of it.

[slowshoes]

Originally Posted by sww914

Speakers are extremely subjective. What sounds amazing to one guy might sound tinny to the next. When I was shopping for home audio speakers I found some very expensive highly rated speakers that I just didn't like and others that I loved. I found a speaker at the bottom end of expensive (older Jamo) that I really loved and the only others that I liked more (B&W's 2nd best) were about 15 times the price.
Try to have a listen before you buy. I found it was worth a trip to the city to listen to speakers and have a nice lunch. I brought my own CD's and made a day of it.

I couldn't agree with you more - the problem that I'm having is finding a store around me that has the PSB or Mirage speakers I'm interested in. Best buy stores are supposed to carry the Mirages, but none of them even remotely close to me have any in stock. (at least when I checked store availability online). I hate to take a chance and order anything without hearing it first.

I just started checking out Mirage speakers after Nick mentioned them,
and I don't understand why the OS3 SAT model is about $80.00 more per speaker than the OMD -5 model. Can anyone familiar with Mirage bookshelf speakers enlighten me?

Mirage - Speakers at Vanns.com

[sww914]

I drove to LA, 175 miles away to listen. We still have more cows than people in this area. It was important to me at that time and like I said we made a nice day of it. You can't get Haitian food around here, for instance. We have tacos, burgers, and pizza. We have a Best Buy but I don't really like that store. It's top dollar, poor service, and really loud. My 13 year old likes it.
Well, if you can find something that's an open box or discontinued you can get a deal but I'm offended by the $35.00 price on an HDMI cable that I know I can get online for $3.00- $5.00. Maybe they forgot the dash on the price and they were supposed to cost 3-5 but it accidentally came out as 35?

[sww914]

BTW, I ended up buying my speakers at Audioadvisor .com
I found what I wanted that had been discontinued for about 40% what I expected to spend. At that time they'd take just about anything back without explanation and I got free shipping and no sales tax. They have PSB's. If they still take anything back you can try them an only lose return shipping.

[slowshoes]

Originally Posted by sww914

BTW, I ended up buying my speakers at Audioadvisor .com
I found what I wanted that had been discontinued for about 40% what I expected to spend. At that time they'd take just about anything back without explanation and I got free shipping and no sales tax. They have PSB's. If they still take anything back you can try them an only lose return shipping.

I hear you about Best Buy, but the small, higher end audio stores have gone the way of the dinosaur around here. The one's I've checked with don't have the Mirage's or PSB's. (even online reviews are scarce, which, if written with an ear toward critical listening, can be helpful).

Your suggestion about trying online suppliers with a no questions asked return policy is a good one - that may be the way I go. In the meantime, I'll keep checking around both the area and the internet.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by slowshoes

Best buy stores are supposed to carry the Mirages, but none of them even remotely close to me have any in stock. (at least when I checked store availability online). I hate to take a chance and order anything without hearing it first.

I just started checking out Mirage speakers after Nick mentioned them,
and I don't understand why the OS3 SAT model is about $80.00 more per speaker than the OMD -5 model. Can anyone familiar with Mirage bookshelf speakers enlighten me?

Mirage - Speakers at Vanns.com

You can't really go wrong with Mirage.. this is a whole different class than the Jamo's etc. Different price tag too

I have older model Mirage speakers but they are OmniSat so the OS3 sat is the current model of what I have. The NanoSats are too small. Just order the OmniSats, you will kill yourself for not buying these sooner haha A blind guy can't point out where my speakers are; these speakers are amazing and about 70% of output is indirect, like when you hear a live acoustic performance.

Even the bass is amazing from these small speakers (they have titanium membranes btw). But my music choice forced me to add a decent 10" subwoofer. My source is Squeezebox WiFi streaming of FLAC files. I use a Kenwood 4-channel car amplifier (cheap) with 2 channels bridged for the subwoofer. Sound is not what I had ashore but it comes pretty close which should be impossible... it's the Mirage speakers that enable this.

ciao!
Nick.

[malovich]

Due to the generally poor acoustics of a boat there is no point in going with upper end expensive speakers, the brands that have been mentioned are excellent and I'm proud of you guys, nobody has mentioned the "B" word yet. Being a marine environment, the MDF construction of most speakers likely won't last as long as in a residential setting and you might consider going the cheaper route while maintaining high value. Dayton has a high value speaker you might like to try and if you're satisfied then keep using them, the B652. Along with a sure 2x25 amp in a n enclosure with the volume control. The amp runs on 12V too.

I have a set of Athena bookshelf speakers, Athena was a sister company of Mirage and my speakers while being used as surrounds sound amazing in my 5.0 Athena setup. The Mirage Omni 150 used the exact same drivers as my Athena 100 bookshelf speakers even. Energy is another sister company, they make great speakers too. If you haven't been to avsforum yet then check it out.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by malovich

Due to the generally poor acoustics of a boat there is no point in going with upper end expensive speakers

The poor acoustics of a boat are exactly the reason that the Mirage speakers work so well. They have been designed to cope with "acoustically challenged spaces" and afaik Mirage is the only company that invested lots into research on this.

In other words: you don't have to be an audiophile to notice the huge difference these speakers make on a boat. They also have a huge WAF. (=Wife Approval Factor)

ciao!
Nick.