Autopilot - Raymarine vs Furuno

[nfbr]

My drives are hydraulic DC motors, belt to pumps (Main / Spare). No need to change. 12V, 30A needed (or maybe more)

Current control is Raymarine ST3
MFD, Wind, Depth is Raymarine

Obvious is Raymarine for integration reasons

But I wonder if Furuno isn't better quality?

Any comments?

Current unit is showing some reliability concerns common to these - randomly and regularly drops to Standby, silently, even with solid voltage.

[more]

Originally Posted by nfbr

My drives are hydraulic DC motors, belt to pumps (Main / Spare). No need to change. 12V, 30A needed (or maybe more)

Current control is Raymarine ST3
MFD, Wind, Depth is Raymarine

Obvious is Raymarine for integration reasons

But I wonder if Furuno isn't better quality?

Any comments?

Current unit is showing some reliability concerns common to these - randomly and regularly drops to Standby, silently, even with solid voltage.

Why do you think Furuno is better quality.
hydraulic DC motors is best lecomble-schmitt
Best buy electronic for Autopilot control is Garmin

Best for sailboat is B&G

Furuno maybe is best for fishing vessel, in reality i never meet on sailboat Furuno.Only 1 time in fish boat .

your Raymarine autohelm is best ever build autopilot work over 20+ year usually without problem

[nfbr]

Reason for change

a) ST3 drops to standby silently every 1-4 hrs. Sucks at night.
Common on internet. Some say voltage. I have thick wires. It's not that.

b) Hoping newer will have better rudder response with better gyros.

[Frankly]

The significant AP improvements (20 or so years) were inclusion of heading rate sensor and solid state heading sensor to eleminate heading errors due to pendulating fluxgate. Most everybody has adopted these in new designs. I am big Raymarine fan but others have their favorite.

One little POI often overlooked is that the RM STNG connectors fit through smaller holes than NMEA 2000. Can be important for lengthy cramped cable runs.


Your current requirements would make me week in the knees. My RM Evo driving my 40 YO Benmar chain drive 3 amps max if my sails are badly trimmed.


Frankly

[sv_pelagia]

Had to replace my old (1989ish) Wagner autopilot.

Went with ComNav P2 (made locally, here in Canada) and very happy.
https://comnav.com/autopilot/

With ComNav folks' advice, was able to keep old/excellent Wagner autopilot hydraulic pumpset.

[nfbr]

Current comment is due to sargassum. Made autopilot unhappy last trip. Overcurrent. Normal is much less.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by more

Why do you think Furuno is better quality.

hydraulic DC motors is best lecomble-schmitt

Best buy electronic for Autopilot control is Garmin



Best for sailboat is B&G



Furuno maybe is best for fishing vessel, in reality i never meet on sailboat Furuno.Only 1 time in fish boat .



your Raymarine autohelm is best ever build autopilot work over 20+ year usually without problem

My last boat had the latest Garmin AP. I did not find it a good course keeper and it had a vicious turn to correct XTE.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by nfbr

My drives are hydraulic DC motors, belt to pumps (Main / Spare). No need to change. 12V, 30A needed (or maybe more)

Current control is Raymarine ST3
MFD, Wind, Depth is Raymarine

Obvious is Raymarine for integration reasons

But I wonder if Furuno isn't better quality?

Any comments?

Current unit is showing some reliability concerns common to these - randomly and regularly drops to Standby, silently, even with solid voltage.

There’s little in it. The leisure range of Furuno is built to a price just like all the others.

[nfbr]

Originally Posted by Frankly

The significant AP improvements (20 or so years) were inclusion of heading rate sensor and solid state heading sensor to eleminate heading errors due to pendulating fluxgate. Most everybody has adopted these in new designs. I am big Raymarine fan but others have their favorite.

One little POI often overlooked is that the RM STNG connectors fit through smaller holes than NMEA 2000. Can be important for lengthy cramped cable runs.


Your current requirements would make me week in the knees. My RM Evo driving my 40 YO Benmar chain drive 3 amps max if my sails are badly trimmed.


Frankly

S3g says it has a gyro. Not sure how that compares to 9 axis of todays.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by nfbr

S3g says it has a gyro. Not sure how that compares to 9 axis of todays.

“9 axis “ comprises 3 axis gyro , 3 axis accelerometer , and 3 axis magnetometer

The S3G is designed for Rays heading sensor that doesn’t have an integrated gyro

[Frankly]

The G indicated a rate heading sensor (some called rate gyro) was included. The addition of rate sensors was a significant step fwd. The rudder(s) actually control the turning rate of a vessel not the heading directly (heading is an integrating process/ think delay, bad for precise control). Solid state attitude sensors also a big step fwd and includes heading rate as well as heading. The 3 axis acceleration measurement typically uses gravity to correct the rate and heading for the horizontal components (the important numbers).

You didn't say, but a rudder angle transducer can provide a lot of improvement in AP performance for small cost.

Not familiar with the S3 innards but the smaller S1 measured motor current and gave error when overloaded. So the manual says, never pushed it that hard.


Frankly

[Paul L]

Your description of the Ray AP going to Standby is typical of the Rays. It is a really annoying and possibly an unsafe way to fail. Think of surfing off a big wave and the AP just decides to give up and go to standby.

That is one reason why I like my Furuno AP. If it detects any error it will alarm, but it keeps trying to drive. A far safer way to fail.
I have about 40,000 miles on my Furuno AP and L&S drive. Both very good. The Furuno APs are well built, but they are more focused on fishing boats than sailboats. Lots of fishing patterns available that we would never use. Basic sail to course, sail to compass and sail to wind, which we do use.

[more]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

My last boat had the latest Garmin AP. I did not find it a good course keeper and it had a vicious turn to correct XTE.

Garmin reactor 40 have some this problem in some revision software. and i exploit this and buy 3 sets of autopilot for 800€ and one 2019Y for 1400€
i don't update software because working after fine tunning for charter use in Adriatic.
This year i sail Venize - Split and simple put gain on high he keep course in meter but consume electric x3

[more]

Originally Posted by nfbr

Reason for change

a) ST3 drops to standby silently every 1-4 hrs. Sucks at night.
Common on internet. Some say voltage. I have thick wires. It's not that.

b) Hoping newer will have better rudder response with better gyros.

O this is overcurrent. i have this problem with 1 old autohelm raymarine ST6000 head. i install 2 separate relay. separate relay install one raymarine electronic specialist in Split. but i posses this boat in fleet. some course computer possible some not use this.

I suggest changing autopilot,for lot stronger. this is not for you.

[Tupaia]

Can't understand why a cat even a big one would require 30Amp to drive the hydraulic AP. Maybe the current surges are causing the AP to drop out. Do you have a problem with binding rudder stocks or some other linkage issue? Unbalanced rudders and poor sail balance can cause surges on cats as they tend to run like they are on rails and large or frequent oversensitive course adjustments meet with a lot of resistance and use a lot of power.


I am not familiar with the specific RM controller but many can be set up for "Long keel heavy displacement" at one end of the scale to "Ultra light fin keel" at the other end. Cats should be set at "Long keel heavy displacement" as this best represents the steering characteristics and can reduce the power draw by a factor of 3 times in some set ups.