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ShaunJ · 02-09-2011, 21:45

314 Post's and still going. This is the best thread I have read in a long time.
I am no history buff so I will leave that to you guys. As for the Jolly Rodger, never for me.

Surfer Girl · 02-09-2011, 22:20

With all the imagery of the Cat's blood soaked bag and the dried blood and skin left on the knots from previous flog-ees, etc - I am thinking about all the nasty infections (some life threatening, I'm sure) that would've occurred via the Cat 'O Nine Tails... pretty gruesome thought.

History is cool but remember that 'his story' depends on who gets to write it... and as always, there are (at least) 2 sides to every story. I think it has already been mentioned that one person's Pirate is another person's Government Contractor. Still, I'm enjoying the stories...

Mhprincipe · 02-09-2011, 22:55

Just to chime in from colder waters, I sail the Port Huron to Mackinac Race, and I make it a point to fly the black beard flag, so people know who just passed them. :-)

Don1500 · 02-09-2011, 23:15

Black Beard? I thought he was dead.
Or do you have a blak beard?

rgscpat · 02-09-2011, 23:37

One contemporary writer of historical fiction (Dewey Lambdin) made a comment that books about the strikes at Spithead and the Nore are shelved under "industrial relations" because they are much about the development of labor movements. He also made a great distinction between the first strike, in the south at Portsmouth, which remained focused primarily on pay, working conditions, and fair weights and provisions, vs. the Nore, in which the demands were greater and in which more radical elements seemed to predominate.

And, did the red cockades/green cockades stuff actually happen in Parker's floating republic?

Don1500 · 02-09-2011, 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgscpat

One contemporary writer of historical fiction (Dewey Lambdin) made a comment that books about the strikes at Spithead and the Nore are shelved under "industrial relations" because they are much about the development of labor movements. He also made a great distinction between the first strike, in the south at Portsmouth, which remained focused primarily on pay, working conditions, and fair weights and provisions, vs. the Nore, in which the demands were greater and in which more radical elements seemed to predominate.

And, did the red cockades/green cockades stuff actually happen in Parker's floating republic?

What the F___K are you talking about? And how does this relate to Piracy and flying the Jolly Roger?

rgscpat · 02-09-2011, 23:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeptunesTrident

Yes, and I detest Andrew Jackson. An SOB of the first order, and an anti constitutionalist. He was the first in a long line of late.

But Old Hickory was smarter than governor Claiborne about seeing eye-to-eye with Jean LaFitte and using the pirate and his men at the Battle of New Orleans in the service of the United States.

MarinerJo · 02-09-2011, 23:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don1500

What the F___K are you talking about? And how does this relate to Piracy and flying the Jolly Roger?

I don't care who you are, that's funny right there.

Katiusha · 03-09-2011, 00:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don1500

What the F___K are you talking about? And how does this relate to Piracy and flying the Jolly Roger?

Spithead was an anchorage near Portsmouth where 16 ships in the Channel Fleet protested living conditions and demanded a pay raise - a mutiny.

Nore was one of the North Fleet bases where a mutiny broke out on HMS Sandwich because of bad living conditions. Richard Parker ended up being the President of the Delegates. Other ships joined the mutiny and organised blockage of the Thames with only "approved" ships being able to pass. This was called "Parker's Floating Republic".

Not sure about the colours of the cockades...

markpierce · 03-09-2011, 00:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by markpierce

To communicate that message, I'd fly something like the "Don't Tread on Me" flag. But maybe that would be too patriotic for some.

Katiusha · 03-09-2011, 01:35

I've always thought that flying Jolly Roger is very incensitive. Why? Because the first association with Jolly Roger is "pirates". The first association with "pirates" is "Somalia" (list of engaged ships in 2011: List of ships attacked by Somali pirates in 2011 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

If you were one of the people kidnapped or if you saw one of your buddies killed in front of your eyes by pirates, would you appreciate seeing a sign proclaiming that another boat on your anchorage is a "pirate", albeit "a Hollywood one"? I would say that such attitude could be similar to wearing white hoods, standing by the burning cross, and explaining and "it's just the Hollywood movie we like". Another example would be walking with your arm stretched out forward with your palm down and a Hindu peace/good luck sign on your sleeve and saying that you "just like the bright future described by The Leader"

Nevertheless, it's always good to read up on the topic. Turns out that contemporary use of Jolly Roger (like someone already mentioned here) was started by British Navy, specifically by Admiral Sir Arthur Wilson. He stated that submarines were "underhand, unfair, and damned un-English", and that he would convince the British Admiralty to have the crews of enemy submarines captured during wartime hanged as pirates. So HMS E9, after torpedoing SMS Hela, displayed Jolly Roger upon entering port. Thus modern tradition started in British Navy.

The last time Jolly Roger was flown by British Navy was in June 2011 by HMS Triumph on returning from Operation Ellamy in Libya with 6 Tomahawk axes indicating fired missiles. Some US air squadrons also fly Jolly Roger as their insignia.

So after reading up on all of this I'm starting to think that maybe I would not be so disquieted next time I see a Jolly Rogers flying on a cruising boat - what true pirate in their right mind declares being a pirate to the world? Obviously it'll be a fake. I'd still be worried to cross paths with a submarine with a Jolly Rogers. Maybe the following flag would be more of a worry:

Peace

sailorboy1 · 03-09-2011, 04:10

I was worried about the posts for a while. It seemed people were getting much more interested whips than I would have expected and appeared that some knew a lot about it.

robertfraser · 03-09-2011, 04:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeptunesTrident

Boatman61 and all the mature Europeans he speaks of.

And the rest of us are infintile, I guess.

Mark me down in the "infantile" column.... I still think "poo" jokes are funny....

Acedude · 03-09-2011, 04:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Lucas

I was worried about the posts for a while. It seemed people were getting much more interested whips than I would have expected and appeared that some knew a lot about it.

Whips aren't always a bad thing.