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05-10-2018, 19:48
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 86
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Going around a broker
So finally looking for our big boat for extended cruising with my family, found one for close to the right price in the right part of the world with the majority of the features we want. We went to look at it and met the owner prior to the broker showing up talked with him for awhile and gleaned much more info than the broker could provide once we were looking the broker rushed us off the boat after about an hour he was quite pushy actually...
Due to the nature of what we are looking for our market is much smaller than typical. Some features are
-Metal hull, either steel or aluminum with no wood decking
-Pilothouse with dual helm stations
-55-65 feet
We made an offer the broker brought us a counter back, we countered again. Not to sure if we will get much closer, the amount we are apart is roughly equal to the brokers commission.
I am considering approaching the owner about dealing without a broker as we could both benefit from this. I have done this with real estate with good success in the past so don't see why it would not work here. Is there some sort of etiquette here??
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05-10-2018, 19:55
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Tavernier, Fl
Boat: Outremer 50
Posts: 750
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Re: Going around a broker
Only that the owner is bound by contract to pay the brokers fee anyway.
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05-10-2018, 20:00
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#3
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cruiser
Join Date: Jan 2017
Boat: Retired from CF
Posts: 13,317
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Re: Going around a broker
Etiquette?
I think that's spelled e-t-h-i-c-s
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05-10-2018, 20:01
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Good question
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 14,131
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Re: Going around a broker
I think you know the answer to this … not sure if etiquette is the right term. I’d call it dubious, perhaps unethical, to do what you suggest. Unless you have actual evidence the broker is behaving dishonestly or unethically, then taking the action you suggest seems to put you in this category.
It’s also likely the seller has signed a contract with the broker which obligates him/her to work through this person.
If the seller were to approach you directly with a counter, it might be reasonable to proceed without the broker. But this would raise red flags for me as the buyer. If the seller is willing to ignore a contract or renege on an agreement with the broker (i.e. lie to this person), then what else might this person be willing to lie about?
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05-10-2018, 20:34
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 86
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Re: Going around a broker
This is what I thought. Even though I have had good experiences with doing it with regard to real estate transactions (we know some cool re agents) I was unsure how the boat market handles it
That said in my dealings over the years the industries with low amounts of "ethics" or morals are always salesy types, insurance, etc. So I don't mind playing the same way they tend to which places finances and the amount of money in pocket before anything else...
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05-10-2018, 20:58
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Australia, Hervey Bay QLD
Boat: Boden 36 Triple chine long keel steel, named Nekeyah
Posts: 909
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Re: Going around a broker
We recently sold a boat. Prior to listing the vessel, I had several potential buyers.
I named them to the broker and he agreed that if any of them purchased the boat, he would not get a commission.
I undertook that after he had listed the boat, any new contacts, from wherever , had to go through him.
In the end, he sold the boat, and earned his commission.
I am a firm believer that if you cheat someone, in the end it bites you on the bum!
Regards,
Richard.
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05-10-2018, 23:16
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 128
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Re: Going around a broker
In my real estate days we called this move the commissiondectomy. And it’s a thoroughly scumbag move.
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06-10-2018, 00:32
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#8
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Sponsoring Vendor
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Hollywood, Fl.
Boat: FP Athena 38' Poerava
Posts: 3,984
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Re: Going around a broker
Morals, values and ethics. You either have them or you don't.
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06-10-2018, 02:09
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#9
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cruiser
Join Date: Jan 2017
Boat: Retired from CF
Posts: 13,317
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Re: Going around a broker
No, lots of grey areas in modern life and no one is perfect.
Learning to listen to your conscience can be an ongoing process, gets clearer / stronger as you let it guide you.
What goes around comes back around so well worth doing, keep practicing.
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06-10-2018, 04:33
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Bumping around the Caribbean
Boat: Valiant 40
Posts: 4,625
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Re: Going around a broker
Quote:
Originally Posted by stainless guy
That said in my dealings over the years the industries with low amounts of "ethics" or morals are always salesy types, insurance, etc. So I don't mind playing the same way they tend to which places finances and the amount of money in pocket before anything else...
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Dear lord. Talk about stereotyping. Just because you met some louts in a few industries is not an excuse for being unethical. Be part of the solution, not part of the problem.
And you appear to be rationalizing that because the broker was "pushy" it might be OK to stiff him. If everyone who was pushy in business got treated that way the unemployment rate would be stratospheric.
__________________
"Having a yacht is reason for being more cheerful than most." -Kurt Vonnegut
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06-10-2018, 05:02
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: New England. USA.
Boat: McCurdy & Rhodes Custom 46
Posts: 1,474
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Going around a broker
I sold a boat. I had it listed with a contract with the broker. The buyer and I decided the broker was getting in the way of the negotiation, not helping.
The buyer and i came to terms. I took the terms to the stunned broker, he did the paperwork and I paid him his commission.
Perhaps I could have negotiated the commission down but...
He listed the boat.
He found the buyer
He handled all but the end of the negotiation.
Simple.
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06-10-2018, 08:22
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 86
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Re: Going around a broker
I will probably just try to negotiate the brokers commission to get the deal closer,
either that or step back and wait for the asking price to drop as the vessel likely will not be a quick sale hi
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06-10-2018, 08:48
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
Boat: Leopard 39
Posts: 860
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Re: Going around a broker
I don't know how it is in Canada, but if you'd signed a brokerage contract in America and then "went around the broker," you'd have a lawsuit on your hands FROM the broker, and rightly so.
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06-10-2018, 08:54
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Good question
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 14,131
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Re: Going around a broker
Quote:
Originally Posted by stainless guy
I will probably just try to negotiate the brokers commission to get the deal closer,
either that or step back and wait for the asking price to drop as the vessel likely will not be a quick sale hi
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The broker’s commission is not something you pay for. It is paid for by the seller, because this person is the seller’s broker. If you’re talking about a buyer’s broker — your broker — then you can certainly do this.
I suppose you can suggest the broker take less, but he/she is not working for you. They are working for the seller.
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06-10-2018, 08:54
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#15
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29° 49.16’ N 82° 25.82’ W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 16,306
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Re: Going around a broker
As everyone else said doing this would be, to put it politely, morally questionable.
It would also violate the contract between the seller and the broker and would certainly expose the seller to a lawsuit that would be a shoe in to succeed.'
Unless the broker does something illegal or in violation of the contract the seller is obligated by the contract. There might be some room if the broker was extremely negligent in performing his/her duties but that is the only gray area I can see.
__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
Sometimes it's necessary to state the obvious for the benefit of the oblivious.
Rust is the poor man's Loctite.
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