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Old 11-12-2020, 04:55   #46
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

In my favourite non fiction sailing book "My old man and the sea" by David and Daniel Hays. They celebrate Chanukah while sailing towards Cape Horn. They also mention some racism they experienced being Jewish.
Great read about sailing around Cape Horn in a 25 foot yacht.
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Old 11-12-2020, 06:47   #47
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

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And the response is shocking similar to things that are haram in Islam.

In fact, it’s precisely the same.


As does Christianity. People hundreds of years ago weren't stupid.

I don't know the name of the exception nor can I quote the Torah section that covers it but I'm 99.99% sure our Jewish friends have a similar approach.

If grandma falls down and is bleeding to death, no one is going to say you have to leave her there on the floor to die.

Generally the rules are you observe in so far as you are reasonably able to do so. So if it's calm, you are far from land and nothing else pressing, heaving to and stopping anything else that would be in violation makes sense. If there is a storm blowing and you are just outside a tricky passage, it's very reasonable you keep the chart plotter running and you manage the boat to the best of your ability.

I'm sure you will find some ultra-orthodox branches where anything short of life and death, they are going to observe but they are far outside the mainstream...even of the orthodox followers.
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Old 11-12-2020, 07:00   #48
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

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I am (almost) sure that you understand the difference between rules that keep society functioning (not stealing, stop at red light) and religious rules (don't light fire on the Shabat, do not drink wine if you are Moslem).
I do agree that all or most of us like to circumvent rules, at least of the lighter shade e.g. the red light I have mentioned (I am sure it was green when I drove through&#128513
If you do a little research, you will find that there was a reason for each rule. In many cases, they may not have made the connection to why but they enjoyed the benefits:
- They may not have understood why but pork was very prone to causing illness as they had a lot of parasites, if you didn't cook it well done. In a desert environment, there were better alternatives for food animals.
- Drinking was prohibited based on a story where some guys got drunk right before prayer and were causing disturbances.
- People working on Shabat didn't get the benefits of a mental health day per week.

Of course, you have the issue of if these rules should still apply or if they have been misinterpreted:
- I've met more than one Muslim who says it's about getting drunk right before prayer. Having a single drink is not getting drunk. If you get a little drunk after evening prayer, you will be sober by morning prayer.
- Christianity as it spread beyond the desert middle east, saw a different situation eating pork. Pork was a much more suitable food animal in other areas and it had been figured out to cook it well done. Plus from a societal point of view, it would have made it harder to convert people which was the more important goal.

So sometimes, things get mixed up and a little twisted with modern interpretations but there is a solid basis for pretty much all rules.
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Old 12-12-2020, 18:27   #49
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

Why not.

The sabbath is important to many sects and always had been.
Traditional Seafarers have always been observed the sabbath when appropriate and have always acted as required by by the ordinary practice of good seaman ship when required.

Where I am from. Fishermen will not sail on the sabbath they will wait for the day after and they will try and be secure before the sabbath.
If this doesn’t work out, they do as required.

When a ship is at sea over the sabbath only those seamen who are required to be on watch would traditionally be exempt.
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Old 14-02-2022, 08:40   #50
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

I realize this is an old post but just wanted to update anyone who is interested and still following, that I am offering kosher catamaran sailing in the Mediterranean. I'm a skipper and charter catamarans which i make kosher and then skipper tours, tying up in a marina for shabbat.. We sail in Greece from Athens or Corfu and possibly also in Croatia this year. 8 to 10 days of sailing, swimming, hiking, diving, touring, eating, drinking and watching awesome sunsets and inspiring sunrises.

Take a look at our website https://www.koshermedsailing.com or https://www.facebook.com/koshermedsailing and please be in touch if you'd like more details.
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Old 14-02-2022, 11:25   #51
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

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I realize this is an old post but just wanted to update anyone who is interested and still following, that I am offering kosher catamaran sailing in the Mediterranean. I'm a skipper and charter catamarans which i make kosher and then skipper tours, tying up in a marina for shabbat.. We sail in Greece from Athens or Corfu and possibly also in Croatia this year. 8 to 10 days of sailing, swimming, hiking, diving, touring, eating, drinking and watching awesome sunsets and inspiring sunrises.



Take a look at our website https://www.koshermedsailing.com or https://www.facebook.com/koshermedsailing and please be in touch if you'd like more details.
What is involved in making a catamaran kosher?
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Old 14-02-2022, 11:32   #52
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pirate Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

A very deep cleaning I would imagine..
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Old 14-02-2022, 11:41   #53
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

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A very deep cleaning I would imagine..
Diet and menu possibly?
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Old 14-02-2022, 12:01   #54
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pirate Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

The galley and food storage areas would need to be scrupulously cleaned to remove and possible trace of pork and any thing else non kosher, as would the eating area.
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Old 16-02-2022, 03:30   #55
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

As a former charter captain, I find this to be an interesting niche. Ive had Jewish charter guests before, but they were not especially observant so no special effort was required.
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Old 16-02-2022, 03:42   #56
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

An interesting little moment I remember from chartering. My most observant Jewish charter guest was the only one that ever became seasick on the boat.

I never took the guests out of harbor if a small craft advisory was up. It was the area between Newport and block island where I can get a little queasy too, because there are usually 2 sets of waves causing an interference pattern and irregular boat motion and often a 3rd set of waves caused by a shifting wind direction. One set from the open Atlantic Ocean swell, another from westerly winds the night before, then yet another when the winds go southwest.

It was a fairly rolly ride back to Newport and bordering on small craft advisory. He was greasy, pale and barely keeping from throwing up. Then he finally did and I felt just awful. Never like to see anyone have a bad time on a charter. It’s their vacation.

He took it well though. I am much more of a crybaby when I’m queasy.
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Old 16-02-2022, 03:50   #57
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

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Hi,

Can I grab the opportunity and ask you a question I have always had but I could not ask - as I have only one Jewish sailing friend and he is not religious?

Is it legit for a Jew to sail offshore? (I mean long trips of ten days or more).

I ask this because I have read about limitations on what can or cannot be done on some days of the week considered holly.

I hope you will find fellow sailors here with whom to celebrate your festivities!

Best regards and hugs,

barnakiel
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Canary Islands
Not a Rabbi or orthodox but grew up in a shtetl in Central Pennsylvania.

Judisiam has many customs and commandments. They are all meant to be followed, interpreted, and discussed. None of them suoerced the value of human life. If following a commandment could result in death of a human the commandment can be safely ignored.

Secondly thousands of years ago Israel had a navy and were active sea traders traveling the world. They could have brought gentile crew to operate the boat during holy days.

My plan is to trace the diaspora by sea.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histor..._Jews_in_India

There are many kind of Jews who are each responsible for their code and the community gets to discuss the the individuals codes as a whole.

It’s hard to understand if you expect it to align with other faiths.

IMHO
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Old 16-02-2022, 04:28   #58
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

This is a long thread as is Jewish history--and perhaps surprisingly there is a long history of Jewish sailors. As I tell some of my charter guests (I run a sailing tour business in Annapolis, MD) "I am descended from a long line of Jewish seamen"...ahem. There have been many famous Jewish sailors and naval officers and it may surprise some to know that Lin Pardey and Bob Bitchin (He of Cruising Outpost and latitude 38 fame) are Jewish and famed racer Bus Mosbacher came from a fully assimilated Jewish background. There are five buildings at the naval Academy in Annapolis named n honor of Jewish graduates/naval officers. How many know that Jeremy Boorda, a former chief of naval operations and Admiral Rickover--father of the nuclear navy were Jewish? I also give tours of Jewish history at the Naval Academy--write me if interested.

There have been Jewish yacht clubs and noted maritime photographers..it is an interesting story.

But to the point, here in Maryland there was and maybe still is a Sailing Havurah and a Jewish Navy. I have taken many Jewish families sailing, sometimes even the observant and religious. One Sunday I had a rabbi and his wife and on another Sunday, six children came sailing while their parents relaxed on shore...albeit in touch via cell phone for the trip.

The original post and question were from six years ago, so this must be the jubilee or sabbatical year. If anyone wishes to "rekindle" this thread, please do so. BUT...as for the original question, I am sure there are at least few thousand rabbis willing to weigh in (or weigh anchor) with an opinion about what to do on a long sea voyage. I suppose you could set an autopilot and a self steering vane before shabbas, or you take a non Jewish friend along to handle all the mechanical and "work" issues...aka a shabbas goy! Or you could lie ahull and take charge if navigation or weather demanded something be performed. Or....bring along a sea anchor...or drift...or I dunno--ask a rabbi!
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Old 16-02-2022, 06:01   #59
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

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This is a long thread as is Jewish history--and perhaps surprisingly there is a long history of Jewish sailors. As I tell some of my charter guests (I run a sailing tour business in Annapolis, MD) "I am descended from a long line of Jewish seamen"...ahem. There have been many famous Jewish sailors and naval officers and it may surprise some to know that Lin Pardey and Bob Bitchin (He of Cruising Outpost and latitude 38 fame) are Jewish and famed racer Bus Mosbacher came from a fully assimilated Jewish background. There are five buildings at the naval Academy in Annapolis named n honor of Jewish graduates/naval officers. How many know that Jeremy Boorda, a former chief of naval operations and Admiral Rickover--father of the nuclear navy were Jewish? I also give tours of Jewish history at the Naval Academy--write me if interested.



There have been Jewish yacht clubs and noted maritime photographers..it is an interesting story.



But to the point, here in Maryland there was and maybe still is a Sailing Havurah and a Jewish Navy. I have taken many Jewish families sailing, sometimes even the observant and religious. One Sunday I had a rabbi and his wife and on another Sunday, six children came sailing while their parents relaxed on shore...albeit in touch via cell phone for the trip.



The original post and question were from six years ago, so this must be the jubilee or sabbatical year. If anyone wishes to "rekindle" this thread, please do so. BUT...as for the original question, I am sure there are at least few thousand rabbis willing to weigh in (or weigh anchor) with an opinion about what to do on a long sea voyage. I suppose you could set an autopilot and a self steering vane before shabbas, or you take a non Jewish friend along to handle all the mechanical and "work" issues...aka a shabbas goy! Or you could lie ahull and take charge if navigation or weather demanded something be performed. Or....bring along a sea anchor...or drift...or I dunno--ask a rabbi!
Interesting. I never knew about the Jewish sea faring tradition. Thanks!
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Old 16-02-2022, 06:09   #60
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Re: Cruising Jewish Sailors (Reform, Conservative, Orthodox)

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The galley and food storage areas would need to be scrupulously cleaned to remove and possible trace of pork and any thing else non kosher, as would the eating area.
Too keep a strictly Kosher galley is a bit more. For one thing, there must be a separate set of pots and pans, dinnerware, etc for meat and dairy. Food items and ingredients must meet Kosher rules and some items must be Kosher certified.

Further there is a subset of foods that are pareve.
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