Buy with all the work done or pay to have it done?

[SailingPNW]

You might want to look for a boat with 3 cabins, even if small this would give your kids their own space. While probably not as important now, it will be a bigger deal as they get older.

[Island Time O25]

How realistic are your plans to use the boat more than occasional weekends once or twice a month, especially with small children, work/family commitments, unforseen (and foreseen) things coming up, etc? Unless you plan to start real away from home base cruising soon after the purchase I see a more sober use of $100K-120K.

Rather then plunking $100K+ and 10-15% of that annually thereafter for a few weekends a season's use I'd invest these sums in income producing or appreciating assets and just join a well run sailing club which has 38'+ boats. The annual membership is usually well under $10K, more like $6-7K, which if you own a boat will be the cost of dockage only, not including insurance, maintenance, repairs, excise taxes, etc.

Such clubs usually have Benehuntalinas plus often Hanses, Bavarias, etc. After a few seasons if buying is what you want you will be much clearer on which model suits your particular needs and sailing preferences.

If at any time after joining such club you will be able to start cruising you will still be free to make a commitment to buy a boat. But the other way around, once you buy to cruise but for whatever reason can't, will be much more painful to turn around either by not using the boat or worse having to sell it at considerable discount.

The very fact that you are asking your initial questions speaks volumes as to your unreadiness for a boat purchase of that type. Once you will be confident that you know the answers that will be the time to buy. Or to continue using other people's boats for a fraction of owning it yourself.

[Sailor 99]

Originally Posted by JohnParkerSJ

Would love a little steerage here. Looking at 38+ monohulls and finding a pretty big range. Getting a price to upgrade and really mint a 1985+ 38+ sailboat isn’t easy. So many people involved. Electronics, hull/deck, engine, sails etc.


Appreciate any insight or do i just flip a coin? And I won’t be doing the work. All professionals.

Buy the best boat you can. We are coming to the very end of a major refit. You could not even begin to imagine the parts cost. We DIY almost exclusively. We just did a re & re on the keel. The only party we hired out was the travel lift. Our net cost on that is 2500. If it had been done by the yard I can not see how it would not come to 15 or 20k.

A new motor on a 38 will be 10 k and 10-15 to install it. You need a shower pump? Think 250-300 and then that or more again to install it.

I thought I could refit this boat for 100k. Not even close. To do it again I would not. I would wait and buy a boat that needed no work and sail it away. Even that boat might need 50k

[bensolomon]

Here is the post about the costs of cruising. Sailorboy1 is the forum member:


https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...d.php?t=249438


Month 55 Expenses of Cruising and Living on the Boat

[merrydolphin]

The only way to “ flip” a boat is (no don’t capsize it!) is to do all or the vast majority of the work yourself. Very cost prohibitive to do it otherwise.

I have several friends with the time and talent successfully re-fit boats for profit. They are very good a what they do. You have to be to make a profit or come out ahead. It’s a lot of work!!

[SSgtPitt]

I bought a beautiful boat in great shape, 1982 Cape Dory 36. It Cost me twice what I intended to spend but we’ve had a great time learning to sail and sailing. We’ve lived on her off and on these last 6 years and repaired items as they came up. The longer I have her the more stuff I need to fix.
It’s good advice to buy the best you can afford with the least repairs needed.....unless you have your own storage yard, a full shop and 2-5 years to refit in your spare
time, when you’re done with Daddy and Spouse duties, and your job duties.
And hire a GOOD surveyor and expect to pay nicely for it.

[Mark Marsden]

I think you guys have finally put me off buying a boat. I nearly bought one a year ago as crewing opportunities weren't coming off - and I want my own boat. But I haven't got loads of spare cash and I don't want to spend all my time doing maintenance. So I'll stick to paying £100-150pd for cruises.

[JohnParkerSJ]

Originally Posted by Island Time O25

How realistic are your plans to use the boat more than occasional weekends once or twice a month, especially with small children, work/family commitments, unforseen (and foreseen) things coming up, etc? Unless you plan to start real away from home base cruising soon after the purchase I see a more sober use of $100K-120K.

Rather then plunking $100K+ and 10-15% of that annually thereafter for a few weekends a season's use I'd invest these sums in income producing or appreciating assets and just join a well run sailing club which has 38'+ boats. The annual membership is usually well under $10K, more like $6-7K, which if you own a boat will be the cost of dockage only, not including insurance, maintenance, repairs, excise taxes, etc.

Such clubs usually have Benehuntalinas plus often Hanses, Bavarias, etc. After a few seasons if buying is what you want you will be much clearer on which model suits your particular needs and sailing preferences.

If at any time after joining such club you will be able to start cruising you will still be free to make a commitment to buy a boat. But the other way around, once you buy to cruise but for whatever reason can't, will be much more painful to turn around either by not using the boat or worse having to sell it at considerable discount.

The very fact that you are asking your initial questions speaks volumes as to your unreadiness for a boat purchase of that type. Once you will be confident that you know the answers that will be the time to buy. Or to continue using other people's boats for a fraction of owning it yourself.

Like the stern advice, truly appreciate it. I will look into these clubs you mention. Certainly don’t want to jump in over my head. Like I said I’ve owned and still do a couple motor boats with a house on the water near LBI NJ. So we slept in the house and went out fishing in the AM. Maybe 100hrs a year. But the sailing game seems quite different. Maybe a club for a couple years then jump in knowing what’s right for me and my family. Headed to Annaplolis in early May to walk on a few. Will certainly check out a couple sailing clubs while I’m there.

I’m also thinking a 21-27’ under 20k with good sails and a little outboard. Use it for a couple years and basically give it away and upgrade or ???

Thanks!

[malbert73]

Yeah starting small and cheap is one way to go. All boats are tiny compared to houses. The pleasure is similar and small and less simple you may find being cramped is the main displeasure. But go too big and complex and you could spend all your time working on boat

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by cyan

Here is just one example of getting enlightened: We loved the fantastic layout and the style of a Hunter 41 DS and it was a dream to sail... until it was late in the day and at the point where I wanted to go wing on wing like I often do. Wait. What? Not happening. B&R rig, swept back spreaders, no back stay. (oh, yeah) Maybe it could have been done with more finesse than I gave it... if only the main sheet was a bit longer.

I think of people like you every time I WOW my B&R rig. Doesn't happen a lot, maybe 1% of time. Normally I find better to just sail faster on board reach instead.

But for a cruising boat this worry is probably worth little of the big picture thought process of boat selection.

[JohnParkerSJ]

Originally Posted by malbert73

Yeah starting small and cheap is one way to go. All boats are tiny compared to houses. The pleasure is similar and small and less simple you may find being cramped is the main displeasure. But go too big and complex and you could spend all your time working on boat

Assuming very cramped, what would be the smallest boat you could rough it overnight at a nice marina or anchored / moored very close by with the minivan in the parking lot . Family of 4. I’ve done 4 a few times on a 25’ cuddy cabin V birth. It’s totally like camping and only for 1 night,but great memories!

Thanks!

[malbert73]

Originally Posted by JohnParkerSJ

Assuming very cramped, what would be the smallest boat you could rough it overnight at a nice marina or anchored / moored very close by with the minivan in the parking lot . Family of 4. I’ve done 4 a few times on a 25’ cuddy cabin V birth. It’s totally like camping and only for 1 night,but great memories!

Thanks!

Depends on size of folks but look for a 27-30 footer. A Catalina 30 is pretty big inside and there were a ton made so find a well upgraded one. Or a Pearson 28-2

[JohnParkerSJ]

Thank you!

[cyan]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

I think of people like you every time I WOW my B&R rig. Doesn't happen a lot, maybe 1% of time. Normally I find better to just sail faster on board reach instead.

But for a cruising boat this worry is probably worth little of the big picture thought process of boat selection.

I think of you every time we go over our monthly budget.

Of course the B&R rig will do WOW, as detailed by previous threads in here somewhere. This one would not, though, as it was a charter and equipped with a very conservative main sheet-- probably designed to keep the inexperienced weekend captains (me) from letting the main touch the shrouds.

My WOW habit is more than 1%. You could call that unnecessary- I don't care how it looks, and I don't care if that's wrong.... hence the personal preference part of my post. Sometimes I just want the boom out more than that rig allows. Do your broad reaching instead. That's cool.

Point is, you might find personal pros and cons for a particular boat that only appear when you're on the lean. Do some test driving. That's all.