Anchoring over bow rollers?

[Sirago]

Another point to consider when you have the rode going over the anchor roller is the loud thud you might hear all night if in a blow and sleeping in the V berth. My PI-31 would sail at anchor. To stop the thuds I would force a piece of 3/8 line between the roller and shoulder. This stopped the roller from moving side to side as the boat moved left to right. Maybe your boat doesn't sail at anchor.

[Chris777]

Originally Posted by SAM

I recently purchased a 1985 C & C Landfall 38. The boat has a double bow roller for the anchors. One 35 lb. Delta and one #23 15 lb. Fortress. I have yet to anchor as I am in the Chesapeake Bay and do a lot of marina hopping. When I do anchor this summer will it be okay to run the anchor rode over one of the anchor rollers? My anchor line is 10' of 5/16" BBB chain w/ 110' of Yale 8 plait line. If I run the line thru one of the dock line openings (small 1" Delrin rollers here) I don't think I would like the angle of pull. If I run it thru the bow rollers I can use a Chafe-Pro chafe guard for added protection where the line exits the bow roller. I would not be able to use the Chafe-Pro if I exit the line where my dock lines exit as the openings are too small for that. One last question is are bow rollers designed to take the load of an anchor in light to moderate winds up to say 40 mph max? Seldom see 40 mph and up here in the C-bay but it does happen. We usually stay put when it does. Thank you in advance to all who respond.

I would say ABSOLUTELY NOT. Did this in the past and woke up to 1 strand of a 3 strand anchor line holding the anchor. Lots of schafe on the roller. Further 10' of chain for a 38" boat.... Get yourself 100' and then use a chainhook to a bridle and you will be fine. The bridle goes to your cleats on the bow. I have a "V" setup 2 identical lines from the cleats and joined at the hook.

[DEAN2140]

Dockhead, can you post a picture or diagram of this?
To take the load off the windlass, use a chain lock or belaying strop

[kmacdonald]

In the Chesapeake Bay, use the Fortress anchor and anchor from the stern.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Chris777

I would say ABSOLUTELY NOT. Did this in the past and woke up to 1 strand of a 3 strand anchor line holding the anchor. Lots of schafe on the roller. Further 10' of chain for a 38" boat.... Get yourself 100' and then use a chainhook to a bridle and you will be fine. The bridle goes to your cleats on the bow. I have a "V" setup 2 identical lines from the cleats and joined at the hook.

Such absolutism is kinda extreme IMO. It all depends on the design of the roller and its supporting structure, and that isn't clear from the photos.

FWIW, we anchor more than most folks do, and have run chain and nylon snubber both over the same roller for many years without chafe issues. One factor is the diameter of the roller and of course, the absence of sharp edges that can contact the snubber (or rode). Shimming the roller so that it can't shift axially is useful to eliminate noise, too. Adequate scantlings for the structure to carry all anchoring loads should be part of any roller design, for even if one chooses to not run the snubber over it, snatching loads when retrieving the anchor can be severe and unpredictable.

But that aside, I too feel that considerable increase in chain length is indicated. I too think that a minimum of around 50 feet of 8-10 mm chain would be about right. I can understand the reluctance to use much chain in soft mud bottoms, for cleaning all that goo off is a pain, but the security advantage is undeniable.

Jim

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by DEAN2140

Dockhead, can you post a picture or diagram of this?
To take the load off the windlass, use a chain lock or belaying strop

Here's a chain stopper in use:





From the excellent Peter Smith anchoring guide: Chain stops (Rocna Knowledge Base)


Read that article. Peter goes on to say: "A devil's claw is an alternative to a chain stop and emulates most of its functions, but it is not 'automatic' in the way that a chain stop is when the finger is present, by allowing chain to be retrieved but not let out (a non-return mechanism)."


A "devil's claw" is one type of belaying strop.



Another important issue, often neglected, is to WHAT you belay the chain to:


https://www.waterwayguide.com/latest...laying-points#!


Never forget that the ground tackle is only as strong as the weakest link!

[stnick]

The chain should equal the length of the boat than Right off your roller ( thats what its for) Than 80 90 ft of anchor line. Back down on the line slowly till the boat stops. And your all set . The long chain keeps the angle low so no matter what that rode will not budge !
Dont count the chain , Thats your saftey margine.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Such absolutism is kinda extreme IMO. It all depends on the design of the roller and its supporting structure, and that isn't clear from the photos...

[Boatsie]

BTW. Thank you asking Sam, anchors are more important than sail set in eyes of some, eg me. If I'd done my job properly our chain wouldn't have broken. We don't use a roller but the gap essentially being that did take a heavy beat. (I was supposed to hold it while runner went to collect lunch, or milk, or something. It wasn't difficult to hold, calm day, etc but by securing it the boat didn't have the music other than provided hence the explanation is too long)

The weak link at shank eye isn't weak, merely less than that of chain! A 38 foot C&C has lots of volume. The weak link if used won't look weak with feel nor sight.

Above really good info. Thanks regarding snubbers..
Not sure about your anchorages; neighborhood restrictions, etc. We had loads of area and could let out plenty with rope over the bow typically normal. Pretty sure the rope isn't the same load strength as the chain and it doesn't need be as strong. Chain tends to focus its strength into a concentrate which is why's to use a breaker. Eg. The chain snake pulled until taunt will dissipate it's power at one link. The rope or snubber will stretch and relax during dissipation at taunt along its entire length of pull. Splice is strong.
Nathan

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Well, that pic helps a little:

The rollers are pretty small diameter where the rode rides, but they are nicely radiused at the sides which should reduce chafe. Small diameter increases frictional losses, especially with chain.

The frame appears to be a light alloy casting... could be strong, could be weak, can't tell much from the photo. Appears to not have much overhang which is good for strength.

Frame also has kinda chocks built in. The snubber, shown looped back over the pulpit, has extensive chafe where it apparently rides under load in that chock. Not good... I believe that it would have far less chafe if lead over the roller!

My opinion, worth what was paid for it.

Jim

[Boatsie]

Pitch at anchor is a considerable lever. The boat is quite long and your fulcrum will be aft. That long a lever.
I won't pretend to understand snubbers, etc.

Reality is regardless of technique, you need to build a spring to tension that of provided by a lever.

Wishing you guys and girls, men and ladies, many constant winds.

Nathan

[Mirage35]

Originally Posted by moseriw

In general... NEVER!
Calm or max to 10 knots for a splash - yep.

Would be interested in seeing a little more explanation for this kind of absolute statement.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by AnglaisInHull

Would be interested in seeing a little more explanation for this kind of absolute statement.

Written English may be a second language for some.


In fact, I use a Dyneema bridle when I use a Nylon rode. Less chafe, better control of the angle, and I don't need the stretch.


(Chain vs. rope is unrelated to the OP's question. Different topic. I've used each quite a bit, generally reserving rope for smaller boats, where cutting is less of a risk, weight matters, and you don't have a windlass.)

[endlesspursuit]

First off great info from everyone here. Learned quite a bit. Sam the little anchoring we have done is lay the chain all in (35FT) and then the rode over the roller. Tied off to the center cleat. (31Ft boat about 5 tons ) Question for Boatsie. We use a rock anchor ( grapple) a lot here in the Keys) No not on live coral. We use zip ties of different sizes to secure the chain to the shank end which works ok during the day. ( they have broken at times while still anchored) I don't think I would sleep very well with that set up at night though. What do you use that can break free when you need to pull the anchor out of the rocks but holds tight other wise? And take it easy on me I know I'm a power boater now but we are looking to switch soon.

[Boatsie]

Endlesspursuit,
Thank.
I don't know. Been sitting on trailer a long time.. I hope others help.
(Shh.. I have a power boat too. 14 foot ex military high speed duck).

Sort of hoping that coal power station owners invest into water. Solar to electrify water. Water becomes hydrogen and oxygen gases. Hydrogen fumed with coal burn fumes becomes ethanol. Ethonal is race car fuel. Eg. China could produce electricity with their coal stations and provide 2 off products. Oxygen and about 74% of earths internal combustion engines requirements of fuel.

I can't remember what the breakers are. We trust the designer and just used them.

Best wishes, Nathan