What's to stop a borrower from taking their boat out the country and defaulting?

[weavis]

When it comes to money... people will find you.
An english guy with USA green card bought an RV and then crossed borders to Canada. Didnt pay another bill.
Within 4 months, he came home to empty RV spot.

Cross border theft aint what it used to be..

[dbraymer]

Good question and also the opposite has been known to happen a lot. Suppose you need to move money out of a country where you have worn out your welcome, and the country in question is actively trying to stop money from flowing/running away.

This happened a bunch when an imaginary country (South Africa) was making things fair and grabbing up private property and assigning it in a more "fair" manner. The government was preventing liquid assets from being shipped abroad, so people fleeing could not just sell their property and flee abroad.

One of the ways around this problem was to take your South African assets and have a yacht built in country, sail the yacht, lets say to an imaginary capitalist outpost, (Miami). You might end up losing 40 or 50% of the money in the process, but since the boat was never a USA asset, there are no capital gains. You can do an offshore transfer, and then you are just another migrant with a couple hundred grand in your pocket!

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by weavis

When it comes to money... people will find you.
An english guy with USA green card bought an RV and then crossed borders to Canada. Didnt pay another bill.
Within 4 months, he came home to empty RV spot.

Cross border theft aint what it used to be..

I was renting a car years ago near the USA/Canada border and the agent told me of a young guy in the US military who had recently rented a car and skipped across the border....I expect he got a harsh dose of reality soon after.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by dbraymer

Good question and also the opposite has been known to happen a lot. Suppose you need to move money out of a country where you have worn out your welcome, and the country in question is actively trying to stop money from flowing/running away.

This happened a bunch when an imaginary country (South Africa) was making things fair and grabbing up private property and assigning it in a more "fair" manner. The government was preventing liquid assets from being shipped abroad, so people fleeing could not just sell their property and flee abroad.

One of the ways around this problem was to take your South African assets and have a yacht built in country, sail the yacht, lets say to an imaginary capitalist outpost, (Miami). You might end up losing 40 or 50% of the money in the process, but since the boat was never a USA asset, there are no capital gains. You can do an offshore transfer, and then you are just another migrant with a couple hundred grand in your pocket!

Yep, bought my current boat that way. I got a favorable price and owner got his money out of S Africa. He had a few more boats being built.

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by dbraymer

Good question and also the opposite has been known to happen a lot. Suppose you need to move money out of a country where you have worn out your welcome, and the country in question is actively trying to stop money from flowing/running away.

This happened a bunch when an imaginary country (South Africa) was making things fair and grabbing up private property and assigning it in a more "fair" manner. The government was preventing liquid assets from being shipped abroad, so people fleeing could not just sell their property and flee abroad.

One of the ways around this problem was to take your South African assets and have a yacht built in country, sail the yacht, lets say to an imaginary capitalist outpost, (Miami). You might end up losing 40 or 50% of the money in the process, but since the boat was never a USA asset, there are no capital gains. You can do an offshore transfer, and then you are just another migrant with a couple hundred grand in your pocket!

Bitcoin/crypto currency is a hell of a lot faster, easier, and cheaper way to accomplish the same thing!

[Stingo]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

Bitcoin/crypto currency is a hell of a lot faster, easier, and cheaper way to accomplish the same thing!

[Jdege]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

Bitcoin/crypto currency is a hell of a lot faster, easier, and cheaper way to accomplish the same thing!

Bitcoin isn't really money.

But, then, neither are Federal Reserve Notes.

[Macblaze]

I don't actually care, but I wanted to subscribe to the thread so I thought I would point out it's garnishee...

garnisheed
garnisheeing

Although I admit putting a bunch of condiments on a deadbeat is an interesting idea...

[Captndave1]

Simple, just don't loan your boat. Problem solved. LOL

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by sailorchic34

There is an alleged rumor that I've had several professional folks try to find me, for whatever reason. They were extremely unsuccessful. I'm am fairly easy to find online, I mean I'm here so, that's easy.. But actually finding out where I live, that one's a little tricky.

The Boys at the NSA may know where I live, just by pinging cell towers. but for someone who hasn't had a physical address in 15 years and two states ago and who moves around a little bit, on a sailboat, and doesn't own a car or house, it's probably a little bit harder. I mean when I search for myself it, shows my PO box. But where I live, nope. I've been in California 12 years and I never had a utility bill.

I realize you are likely debt free:

But in the context of the discussion (bank tracking down deadbeat who absconds with an unpaid for boat), the bank would have additional information about you that random people in your profession do not have or likely would not pursue.

An investigator with access thru the bank to your SS number, credit report, boat registration and other legal (and sometimes not so legal) information, would likely do far better tracking you down.

Not saying you couldn't hide but a random guy with only a passing interest doing a quick google of your name is not the same as a detailed investigation by someone who knows what they are doing...and you are probably the exception as most of the random guys with a passing interest could quickly find most people.

PS: Given what you've shared in posts, the bank likely isn't giving you a million dollar loan anyway with no recent earning history. No ill intent intended by the comment just how the banks protect themselves. You have no major assets or significant income...from the bank's point of view, you are a bad risk.

[Borschelrh]

We retired overseas to Hungary and I bought a boat here. There is nothing stopping anyone from stealing a boat, repainting it, and licensing it under a new name as if it were brought in from outside the country. Here there is only a very weak title search done and this applies to everything. There is also no title insurance for anything including houses.

So, someone like me who never plans to return to the US could arguably do this and could care less about credit scores. That is purely a US thing as credit is more or less non-existent outside the US.It exists but is not often used. Friends and family are better sources for loans without getting into legal problems. My own personal creed is to never buy anything I can't pay cash for. That is, in general, how things are done in Europe as well. If financing is pursued the down payment has to be substantial (usually over 50%) and you must have a long and excellent personal history with the bank. Most Europeans distrust banks completely and are loathe to become a debtor to them. Banks are also leery of this as it has happened in the past the government steps in and forces the banks to take a haircut on the loans when the economy goes south. They don't bail out the banks but instead support the people (except in Greece where Germany forced the people to bail out the banks). Here in Hungary during the 2007 economic disaster they forced international banks to cut the loan amount to the new devalued currency rate which in effect was a 50% haircut. This ended the nascent mortgage industry completely which was being done by Swiss and Japanese banks.

Of course, I wouldn't do it as I am an honorable person but a dishonorable person could easily get away with it. People with dual citizenship would be more prone to do it than people with only US citizenship.

[KASHMIR]

I once met a guy that bought an expensive boat in the UK, spent a couple of years sailing halfway around the world. It was eventually repossessed and sold by Auction. I don't know if he was running away but he was quite a conman.

[Mauruuru]

A lot of people with cash resources in second and third world countries thats who. They do it all the time which is why customs in those countries is such a PITA

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by Jdege

Bitcoin isn't really money.

But, then, neither are Federal Reserve Notes.

You're right, nothing real about it. But that doesn't stop anyone from being able to use it as a very simple means to get around currency restrictions, and at the end of the day you only have to hold the actual crypto for a matter of a few minutes. There are plenty of crypto currency fan boys out there either speculating on price appreciation or operating on the assumption that it makes their purchases untrackable so they can avoid "the man". This isn't that. Converting your Rand to Bitcoin and 5 minutes later converting that Bitcoin to USD in an account in the U.S. and 5 minutes later wiring that money to you actual brick and mortar bank is trivial and by comparison to buying a boat, sailing it across nearly the full length of the Atlantic, and finding a buyer.....is relatively risk free. Of course you could always do a recievables swap, i-banks do it all the time and if you're trying to move that level of money out it's also trivial to set up....and also far cheaper and less risky than the whole boat nonsense. If you want to have a boat built in South Africa so you can sail it to North America and sell it because you would enjoy doing it, by all means. It's just a monumentally dumb way to get around currency restrictions if that was your only goal.

[Group9]

I sold a boat through a broker in Florida once. He called with an offer, and I took it. I asked when the closing was, and he said the boat was being shipped to Europe, and sent me the check. No closing.

Standing there, with the check in one hand, and the title in the other, and knowing I had full insurance, I had bad thoughts about what I could do when the next hurricane showed up.

I quickly tore up the title!